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BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > N20, N26, B46, B48 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > Intercooler upgrade?
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      02-03-2020, 11:24 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anilsk8420i View Post
Do you think that going EVO II on a n20 320i will be an overkill due to its weight? I think stock fmic is very light so I wonder if that could cause other issues
Is your car tuned? If so do you plan on adding more mods in the future?
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      02-03-2020, 01:58 PM   #24
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Still not sure why no love for the CSF FMIC.
Price is mid-range between VRSF and ER and according to multiple datalogs that are out there, the CSF outperformed each time.

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      02-03-2020, 02:52 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Is your car tuned? If so do you plan on adding more mods in the future?
I bought a sport catted DP from wagner and the intercooler performance II (11 kg). And was planning on doing stage 1 either BM3 or custom tune. My car is 184 HP stock.

Initially I wanted to just do the hardware but reading more I thing that FMIC is too big and heavy for a stock tune car.
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      02-03-2020, 03:10 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anilsk8420i View Post
I bought a sport catted DP from wagner and the intercooler performance II (11 kg). And was planning on doing stage 1 either BM3 or custom tune. My car is 184 HP stock.

Initially I wanted to just do the hardware but reading more I thing that FMIC is too big and heavy for a stock tune car.
Why dont you get the tune first?
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      02-03-2020, 03:43 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fade_The_Public View Post
Still not sure why no love for the CSF FMIC.
Price is mid-range between VRSF and ER and according to multiple datalogs that are out there, the CSF outperformed each time.
The reason it's often overlooked is because the CSF can't hold a candle against the VRSF 6.5" Competition HD or the 6.5" Race FMIC. There are less expensive options that forgo the BMW tax that offer better performance
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      02-04-2020, 01:08 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Tiago@VRSF View Post
The reason it's often overlooked is because the CSF can't hold a candle against the VRSF 6.5" Competition HD or the 6.5" Race FMIC. There are less expensive options that forgo the BMW tax that offer better performance
Correct me if I'm wrong but the CSF is 5" and your comparing that to the VRSF at 6.5".
Isn't that an unequal comparison?
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      02-04-2020, 03:34 PM   #29
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The CSF is a bit taller than our standard 6.5" Competition HD. The overall volume is more important when comparing intercoolers, not just a single dimension.

Normally folks will compare intercoolers by price and the VRSF is the clear winner there.
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      02-04-2020, 07:10 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anilsk8420i View Post
I bought a sport catted DP from wagner and the intercooler performance II (11 kg). And was planning on doing stage 1 either BM3 or custom tune. My car is 184 HP stock. Initially I wanted to just do the hardware but reading more I thing that FMIC is too big and heavy for a stock tune car.
you should have gotten the Wagner Evo I Competition. perfect for up to stage 1 with tube-fin(not bar plate) and weighing 6.6kg. if your FMIC volume is too large the pressure drop will be greater and throttle response lessened. this is the best one for your set up, in my opinion.

Wagner Evo II Competition or Ambient Thermal Management if you're going to track with stage2 or greater.

this is a good info if you want to learn more about FMIC...https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ooler+shootout
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      02-16-2020, 10:50 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Why dont you get the tune first?
Yes I can do that, I am just thinking that this fmic is too heavy for the n20 with 184hp. Do you think weight is a problem here considering I tune the car?
Otherwise I will probably RMA this fmic for the evo 1
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      02-16-2020, 10:51 AM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alohasurftoad View Post
you should have gotten the Wagner Evo I Competition. perfect for up to stage 1 with tube-fin(not bar plate) and weighing 6.6kg. if your FMIC volume is too large the pressure drop will be greater and throttle response lessened. this is the best one for your set up, in my opinion.

Wagner Evo II Competition or Ambient Thermal Management if you're going to track with stage2 or greater.

this is a good info if you want to learn more about FMIC...https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ooler+shootout
Agreed, I think I should be getting EVO 1 instead. My car is a daily drive which I Dont plan to track.
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      02-16-2020, 01:46 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F36_420i_sk8 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by alohasurftoad View Post
you should have gotten the Wagner Evo I Competition. perfect for up to stage 1 with tube-fin(not bar plate) and weighing 6.6kg. if your FMIC volume is too large the pressure drop will be greater and throttle response lessened. this is the best one for your set up, in my opinion.

Wagner Evo II Competition or Ambient Thermal Management if you're going to track with stage2 or greater.

this is a good info if you want to learn more about FMIC...https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ooler+shootout
Agreed, I think I should be getting EVO 1 instead. My car is a daily drive which I Dont plan to track.
I have the Evo 1. It is shockingly good for stage 1 street use. As a tube and fine design its noce and light and throttle response it great. Theres only 1 downside.... cost. However, i would say do things right so you only do them once. That tends to be cheaper in the long run.
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      02-16-2020, 02:20 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by F36_420i_sk8 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Why dont you get the tune first?
Yes I can do that, I am just thinking that this fmic is too heavy for the n20 with 184hp. Do you think weight is a problem here considering I tune the car?
Otherwise I will probably RMA this fmic for the evo 1
The weight of a FMIC is not meaningful unless you are tracking. The biggest issue in your situation is the sizing and type of intercooler. The Wagner Competition EVO1 is a perfect choice for your car. Perfect sizing for your car's horsepower to prevent heat soak, and lowest turbo lag for your daily driving.

NOTE: be careful about just saying "EVO1" instead of "Competition EVO1". Guys often confuse the "Performance EVO1" and the "Competition EVO1" which are very different technologies. "Performance" means bar & plate. "Competition" means "tube & fin".

Wagner's naming convention can be confusing. Larger is NOT better. An FMIC properly sized for the horsepower (amount of intake airflow) of an engine will out perform a smaller FMIC that leads to heat soak, AND a larger FMIC that will introduce turbo lag (intake boost pressure drop).

If the stock FMIC is small in size, then EVO1 is medium, and EVO2 is large. The EVO3 is a monster for major tracking of a very high horsepower car. It requires car modifications to even fit.

Hope this helps!
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      02-16-2020, 02:23 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jbiswurm View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by F36_420i_sk8 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by alohasurftoad View Post
you should have gotten the Wagner Evo I Competition. perfect for up to stage 1 with tube-fin(not bar plate) and weighing 6.6kg. if your FMIC volume is too large the pressure drop will be greater and throttle response lessened. this is the best one for your set up, in my opinion.

Wagner Evo II Competition or Ambient Thermal Management if you're going to track with stage2 or greater.

this is a good info if you want to learn more about FMIC...https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ooler+shootout
Agreed, I think I should be getting EVO 1 instead. My car is a daily drive which I Dont plan to track.
I have the Evo 1. It is shockingly good for stage 1 street use. As a tube and fine design its noce and light and throttle response it great. Theres only 1 downside.... cost. However, i would say do things right so you only do them once. That tends to be cheaper in the long run.
I justify the cost of my Wagner Competition EVO1 FMIC by smiles per mile, where it's far superior to anything else I could have installed!
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      02-16-2020, 04:02 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by johnung View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by F36_420i_sk8 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com View Post
Why dont you get the tune first?
Yes I can do that, I am just thinking that this fmic is too heavy for the n20 with 184hp. Do you think weight is a problem here considering I tune the car?
Otherwise I will probably RMA this fmic for the evo 1
The weight of a FMIC is not meaningful unless you are tracking. The biggest issue in your situation is the sizing and type of intercooler. The Wagner Competition EVO1 is a perfect choice for your car. Perfect sizing for your car's horsepower to prevent heat soak, and lowest turbo lag for your daily driving.

NOTE: be careful about just saying "EVO1" instead of "Competition EVO1". Guys often confuse the "Performance EVO1" and the "Competition EVO1" which are very different technologies. "Performance" means bar & plate. "Competition" means "tube & fin".

Wagner's naming convention can be confusing. Larger is NOT better. An FMIC properly sized for the horsepower (amount of intake airflow) of an engine will out perform a smaller FMIC that leads to heat soak, AND a larger FMIC that will introduce turbo lag (intake boost pressure drop).

If the stock FMIC is small in size, then EVO1 is medium, and EVO2 is large. The EVO3 is a monster for major tracking of a very high horsepower car. It requires car modifications to even fit.

Hope this helps!
Very good point. Thank you for the clarification. I have the competition evo 1.

I also agree with johnung 100%. Intercoolers a fun mod because there are tradeoffs and you really need to think. The competition evo 2 or 3 will have more cooling ability but will drop more pressure and thus be more laggy. If youre on theottle 100% on the track they will work wonderfully but on the street youre "paying" for cooling you dont need with reduction in responsiveness. Same concept with the tube and fin. They mass have lower thermal mass but the pressure drop is minimal.
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      02-17-2020, 10:44 AM   #37
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Quote:
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Agreed, I think I should be getting EVO 1 instead. My car is a daily drive which I Dont plan to track.
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