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      02-24-2023, 01:45 PM   #1
rogersmj
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Parasitic battery drain — interpreting BimmerLink codes, NOT the cluster

I have been hunting a battery drain problem for a couple months, and the more data I gather the more confused I am.

Before someone tells me to search, yes, I have read quite a few "battery drain" threads on here. Many of them resolve to the cluster being the problem; however, in at least two of those threads, there were error codes specifically pointing to an issue with the cluster; I do not have those codes. I do have some error codes (attached), so I'm hoping someone can help interpret these to provide a clue that will help me get to an answer quicker/easier than I might otherwise.

Car is bone stock except for an Andream CarPlay unit that I installed 3+ years ago. Have never had any electronics issues until the last couple months, aside from occasionally iDrive would not shut off when I opened the door to exit the car -- this would happen maybe once every other month.

First noticed a battery issue on Dec 23, 2022 when it was -10F in the midwest; the car started complaining about a low battery charge and I should drive it more, and starting the car was sluggish. Car was on original battery at the time (about 50k miles/7 years old), so this did not shock me. It soldiered on, often indicating the battery was low (or discharging while stopped), which like I said I didn't surprise me since it was such an old battery.

Eventually I replace the battery in early/mid Feb 2023, with new AGM battery from AutoZone and code the battery myself with BimmerLink (eventually...that's a different story). Old battery was a 90aH, new one is 95aH, but I left it at 90aH because 95 wasn't an option when coding (and some material online suggested this was OK)...I only mention this in case it's relevant.

Since then, while the starting problems have gone away, the car has still been complaining about "Battery discharging while stopped" nearly every time I start it. The car is aggressively shutting stuff off to "protect" itself, and I mean aggressively...sometimes it will shut off the interior lights within seconds after I open the door. When I go up to the car after letting it sit for just a few minutes, Comfort Access does not work. If I put it in Accessory mode, it will shut off iDrive after a minute or two. Or it will just say "no" to Accessory mode and shut itself off entirely after less than 30 seconds. It never fails to start, however...but if the car thinks the battery is draining, then it could be overcharging/damaging the new battery so I really want to find this.

I pulled the Error Memory and Info Memory today with BimmerLink and got the attached. Can anyone glean any clues from this? I'm not sure what might be significant and what might be a red herring (or an effect, rather than the cause). For instance, do any of those errors indicate the problem could lie in the Comfort Access system, or are those codes there because the CA system is being shut off to conserve power?

From reading other threads, these are some culprits that others have had:
* Instrument cluster
* Water pump
* Comfort access door handle
* Some computer/ECM
Attached Images
File Type: pdf Info memory-24-02-2023.pdf (27.4 KB, 109 views)
File Type: pdf Error memory-24-02-2023.pdf (30.5 KB, 56 views)

Last edited by rogersmj; 02-24-2023 at 02:00 PM..
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      02-24-2023, 02:51 PM   #2
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Enter each code into https://bmwfault.codes/
If some don't get a result google them, prefaced with 'BMW'
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      02-24-2023, 03:06 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billfitz View Post
Enter each code into https://bmwfault.codes/
If some don't get a result google them, prefaced with 'BMW'
Brilliant, thank you...my interpretation is that most of these codes are effects (rather than the cause) of my problem. It seems like what I need to do is run a procedure called an Energy Diagnosis, which can be done from the ISTA software...which I don't have, nor do I have a Windows laptop to run it on. Guess I'll try to get my hands on one somehow and buy the ISTA software.
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      02-24-2023, 09:53 PM   #4
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The easiest way to find parasitic draw is with an ammeter. There are youtube videos that show how.
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      03-04-2023, 02:10 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billfitz View Post
The easiest way to find parasitic draw is with an ammeter. There are youtube videos that show how.
The mystery deepens.

So I bought a 10amp charger/maintainer (the NOCO Genius10), left it to charge the car up overnight (so I could make everything would be "on" as normal, instead of the car putting itself in protection mode every 30 seconds). According to the lights on the NOCO this morning, the battery was at a normal state of charge (green light).

I went through the fuse testing process (guided by this excellent video). First I made sure the car was in "normal" power mode (lights would come on when I opened the door, etc), then I latched all the doors and trunk using a screwdriver, locked it, and let it go to sleep.

After measuring all the fuses, I found two of them drawing current:

Fuse 104 (door locks) - 13 mA
Fuse 120 (radio) - 73 mA

Obviously the radio one is above the sleep target (around 35 mA). So I pulled it, and went to run some errands which meant about a 15 minute drive.

Keep in mind that the battery was supposedly fully charged prior to this drive. I got to my destination, locked the car, and when I came back to it...it was in low power mode again, evidenced by the keyless access not working. Upon startup, it again complained about discharge while stopped.

I plug in my WiFI ENET adapter and fire up BimmerLink, and it says that the battery state of charge is only 19%! What the hell.

I attempt to clear all codes using Bimmerlink, and a new (well, old, but I hadn't seen it in months) error about an Emergency Call Malfunction popped up. I had seen this months ago, ordered a new SOS battery (special $65 battery), but by the time the battery arrived the message had gone away, so I didn't bother to replace it. Well, today I replaced it. After doing that, I attempted to clear the codes again, but the ones related to the SOS issue keep popping up, and the car is still complaining about a low state of battery charge.

So as of now, it's plugged into the NOCO charger again (which when I first plugged it in does indeed appear that the battery is down around 25%, but within 20 minutes it registers as full). I tested all the fuses again and found none that were pulling current aside from 104 at 13mA.

I'm hoping that getting it a nice full charge after replacing the SOS battery will take care of this -- maybe the old dead SOS battery was messing with the main battery? Seems weird but I have no other theories right now.
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      03-04-2023, 04:36 PM   #6
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Something is eating power like Pacman. That, or the alternator output is low. With the engine running you should measure at least 13.5v.
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      03-05-2023, 02:59 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billfitz View Post
Something is eating power like Pacman. That, or the alternator output is low. With the engine running you should measure at least 13.5v.
After having it on the charger all night, here's my data from today:

1. Before engine start, battery reads at 98% charged (BimmerLink).
2. I remove it from the charger, and check battery voltage: 12.36V
3. I start the engine. No warning about draining while stopped. Bimmerlink reports 97% charged. Voltmeter reports 13.99 - 14.1V while engine running. Bimmerlink reports charge of 98% within a few minutes.

I let it run for 10+ minutes and then shut it off. No warning about battery being discharged (just the Emergency Call Malfunction, which I can't get to go away even with the new SOS battery).

It is now sitting in my garage not connected to the charger. The radio fuse is still pulled. Will see what tomorrow brings.
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      03-06-2023, 07:12 AM   #8
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The way to test the battery charge holding is to get it to full charge, then disconnect the negative terminal and leave it overnight. If it loses more than a half volt overnight it's defective. If it's OK and leaving it hooked up overnight causes more than a volt of loss something that should be shutting down isn't.
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      03-06-2023, 03:55 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billfitz View Post
The way to test the battery charge holding is to get it to full charge, then disconnect the negative terminal and leave it overnight. If it loses more than a half volt overnight it's defective. If it's OK and leaving it hooked up overnight causes more than a volt of loss something that should be shutting down isn't.
OK thanks for the advice, I'm going to try that next.

After leaving it sit for about 24 hours -- starting at 98% charged and with the radio fuse pulled -- it reads at 60% state of charge via BimmerLink. Meaning in another 24 hours it would be nearly dead. So...something is still not right.

I will charge it up, and then disconnect the negative terminal and see what happens.
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      03-09-2023, 06:45 AM   #10
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After leaving the battery unhooked for more than a day, it has stayed rock solid right around 13.0V, never wavering more than about 0.05V. So it seems the battery is fine?

I must have something other than the radio that was causing drain. I'll have to go through all the fuses again I guess, I must have missed something.
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      03-09-2023, 06:32 PM   #11
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Are you sure it isn't the iDrive? Mine did that when it was cold and the battery was slightly discharged. Mentioned it on my last free warranty visit, and the dealership updated the iDrive SW, and I have never seen it again.

I used to get the "battery discharged when stopped" and "idrive running with car off" (or something like that.)
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      03-09-2023, 07:51 PM   #12
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I am confused on what measurement device I should trust. The Bimmercode app, the car, or the NOCO external charger? I trust the NOCO. How can you verify that the others are correct?

Not sure if I understood this one: so you fully charge the car based on your external charger confirming it, you let it sit for a day, and then it reads around 60%. But when you hook up the external battery charger it goes back up to near 100% within 20 mins? Because, if that's the case then whatever you use to read the battery charge as 60% is not correct. Cannot charge back up that fast.

Also, yes voltage reading may be an indicator of battery health, but not necessarily battery charge/status. So I would not rely on that too much.

Also, your car is fully charged based on your external charger, but then after 10-20 mins of driving/using the car you car does place itself into emergency shutdown? What is the status of the battery charge then? How long does it take to re-charge it? If it takes only 20 mins to recharge, then you car is not assessing its own battery capacity or charge level properly.

You definitely need ISTA to look up hidden codes that Bimmercode will not show. Also, to help you run a diagnostics.

What I am trying to get to is if your car maybe thinking (misprogrammed) that it has a larger battery than what it really has...and even if it is fully charged the car thinks it's depleted.

Note: Pulling a fuse for a component may not stop a short in an associated circuit from draining your battery.
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Last edited by fe7565; 03-09-2023 at 08:21 PM..
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      03-10-2023, 07:32 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
I am confused on what measurement device I should trust. The Bimmercode app, the car, or the NOCO external charger? I trust the NOCO. How can you verify that the others are correct?
Yeah you picked up on that too I'm also kind of confused about which one I should be really paying attention to.

I'll say this though: I "trust" Bimmerlink insofar as the State of Charge level it reports is from the car's sensors, and I presume is also what the car is reacting to when it tells me that the battery is discharging while the car is off. So the Bimmerlink reading is valuable insofar as it shows me what the car "thinks" is happening.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
Not sure if I understood this one: so you fully charge the car based on your external charger confirming it, you let it sit for a day, and then it reads around 60%. But when you hook up the external battery charger it goes back up to near 100% within 20 mins? Because, if that's the case then whatever you use to read the battery charge as 60% is not correct. Cannot charge back up that fast.
That particular comment about "20 minutes" may have been a red herring, in that I think the NOCO charger will sit at the low red light for a little bit when you first hook it up regardless of the battery level while it "figures out" the actual charge level. I didn't realize that when I first made that comment but it seems to do that whenever I plug it in.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
Also, yes voltage reading may be an indicator of battery health, but not necessarily battery charge/status. So I would not rely on that too much.
OK good to know.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
Also, your car is fully charged based on your external charger, but then after 10-20 mins of driving/using the car you car does place itself into emergency shutdown? What is the status of the battery charge then? How long does it take to re-charge it? If it takes only 20 mins to recharge, then you car is not assessing its own battery capacity or charge level properly.
Yes, that's what it's doing. It was fully charged before I drove to Costco, about 10 minutes away, but when I came out from Costco it was in "low power mode" again. I took it home and charged it...but unfortunately I don't remember how long it took to charge up that time. I need to get more scientific about this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
You definitely need ISTA to look up hidden codes that Bimmercode will not show. Also, to help you run a diagnostics.

What I am trying to get to is if your car maybe thinking (misprogrammed) that it has a larger battery than what it really has...and even if it is fully charged the car thinks it's depleted.
Yeah I think at this point you're right I need ISTA. And yeah I was also wondering about the car "thinking" the battery is discharging when it isn't, that's why I keep checking the state of charge with BimmerLink. I did double check the programming a few days ago, and it's programmed for a 90 aH battery (which was the OEM size) and I have a 95 aH in there (and all the suggestions I've found online indicate it's fine to leave the car programmed to 90 aH for a 92 or 95 battery).

Quote:
Originally Posted by fe7565 View Post
Note: Pulling a fuse for a component may not stop a short in an associated circuit from draining your battery.
OK good to know. I suppose if that's the case I wouldn't necessarily see the power draw when measuring at the multimeter with the fuse, would I?

Last edited by rogersmj; 03-10-2023 at 07:39 AM..
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      03-10-2023, 08:24 AM   #14
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Plug one of these into the outlet below the radio/AC and you'll be able to monitor voltage in real time. https://www.amazon.com/Jebsens-Charg...01N00I4TM&th=1
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      03-10-2023, 11:18 AM   #15
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Until you get your Enet cable and connect with ISTA, it’s going to be a shot in the dark.

You have programmed your battery correctly. But I wonder what the car “thinks”.

You may have a component disconnected, but the associated bus could still have a short. Or in the case of the head unit: speaker wires, auxiliary inputs, anything on the quad connector.

The amount of milliamp ratings you cited (about 130mA total) , cannot possible drain the battery in a matter of hours.

There may be a problem with your intelligent battery sensor circuit, but again until you hook up ISTA, this is just a wild guess.
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      03-20-2023, 07:30 AM   #16
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I know I need to get it somewhere to get properly diagnosed, but I haven't had a chance to do that and the problem seemed to "go away" for a bit. Jotting this down here in case it helps someone who finds this thread in the future once I finally figure this out.

Throughout this, the radio fuse is not in the car.

About 2 weeks ago, I took the car off the charger (battery fully charged) and ran some errands. It did not complain about high discharge while being turned off after parking it at the store. Cool, I think maybe I've solved it with the radio fuse even though it wasn't drawing very much current.

Right after that, I leave the car OFF of the charger, and it sits for a week in my garage while one of the wheels gets refinished/repaired. A full week, not on the charger, not being driven. I get the wheel back, go for a drive...and the car is fine. It is not in "low power" mode when I go to get in it, it does not complain about discharge while off. After sitting for a full week. I'm sure I've solved it now.

A few days later I get in the car to go to dinner just a little over a mile from home (hey it was 22 degrees and snowing, I'm not walking in that!). I start it up, no battery message. Car's fine. I'm convinced I'm in the clear.

I get in after the car sat in 20 degree weather for over an hour at dinner...no battery message. I applaud myself for my troubleshooting skills. I drive 2 miles to pick my kids up from my mom's house. I'm inside for 10 minutes, go out to get in the car, and....BAM excessive discharge while car is off. And it did it again the next day during a couple of errands.

So, I don't know what to make of this, because for awhile it seemed to be fine when it just sat. And yes I know I need to go get ISTA diagnostics, but that doesn't stop me from gathering data.

Why would it be intermittent? My leading theory now is that is has something to do with the fact that most of my trips are very short...1-3 miles at most. I live in a downtown area, a few blocks from many things I need, and within a few miles from everything else I need. The farthest I go from home in a typical month is making the arduous, epic 4.5 mile journey to Costco, and for that I'll often take my wife's SUV. I have no commute, so most days the car sits, and then I'll take it for a 2-4 mile round trip twice a week.

I know that's not great for cars but that's my lifestyle, and we've been that way for years, so I don't know why it would suddenly be a problem now. Also, if the problem was simply not driving the car enough to charge the battery, I thought that would give a different message than the one I'm getting (which is specifically about discharge while the car is off).

Going to try to find an indy mechanic for BMWs. I've never had to take it anywhere since the warranty expired, I've done all the work myself.

Last edited by rogersmj; 03-20-2023 at 08:52 AM..
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      01-25-2024, 08:18 AM   #17
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I know this is old, but did you find any resolution to this? My issue began with a dead battery after a 9 degree night, and replacing it initiated almost the exact same issues you reported. I wonder if the bimmerlink had something to do with it all?
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      01-25-2024, 05:54 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scroto Baggins View Post
I know this is old, but did you find any resolution to this? My issue began with a dead battery after a 9 degree night, and replacing it initiated almost the exact same issues you reported. I wonder if the bimmerlink had something to do with it all?
Did you register the new battery?
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