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      05-14-2021, 03:41 PM   #1
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Unhappy Custom tune (Flash only) bootmod3 boost won't go over 2.5bar (22.5 PSI) issue

I'm currently in process of doing a custom tune to take full advantage of my Stage 3 BW EFR 8374 turbo.

But we are having an issue boost won't go over 2.5bar/22.5 PSI on WOT, although on the partial throttle boost can max the 3.5bar sensor no problem.
Anyone with EWG N55, turbo upgrade, and custom tune had this issue?
And if anyone don't have this problem would mind sharing some logs?

So far the tuner made many revisions without any luck..
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      05-14-2021, 04:48 PM   #2
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Not sure if its helpful to you or not as I'm not the same setup. Let me know and I can dig for some logs.

With decent octane I hit boost well above 22.5 with my ewg PS2 with jb4 BMS backend flash and meth injection. I use the n20 tmap purchased from fcp euro.
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      05-14-2021, 04:54 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
I'm currently in process of doing a custom tune to take full advantage of my Stage 3 BW EFR 8374 turbo.

But we are having an issue boost won't go over 2.5bar/22.5 PSI on WOT, although on the partial throttle boost can max the 3.5bar sensor no problem.
Anyone with EWG N55, turbo upgrade, and custom tune had this issue?
And if anyone don't have this problem would mind sharing some logs?

So far the tuner made many revisions without any luck..
Can you post a part throttle and WOT log?

Is your 3.5 bar in the CP or the MAP location? Or both? If its only in the CP and you are maxing it under partial throttle that may only be because its pre-throttle boost and the throttle isnt open all the way.

Also are you running a load based tune? It could be a load/torque limit issue.
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      05-14-2021, 05:00 PM   #4
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Previously with JB4, I can hit any boost target without any issue. I'm switching to full flash only, still have the JB4 as a Meth controller.

For some reason boost target won't even go beyond 22.5 PSI let alone the boost itself.
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      05-14-2021, 05:05 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thejeremyman9 View Post
Can you post a part throttle and WOT log?

Is your 3.5 bar in the CP or the MAP location? Or both? If its only in the CP and you are maxing it under partial throttle that may only be because its pre-throttle boost and the throttle isnt open all the way.

Also are you running a load based tune? It could be a load/torque limit issue.
I'm not sure but I think it's load based tune. I'm running 3.5 bar in the CP only. should I upgrade the MAP location as well ?

WOT log:
https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=609d...0b430647aa5b4d

Partial throttle:
https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=609d...0b4306cd0893de
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      05-14-2021, 05:26 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
I'm not sure but I think it's load based tune. I'm running 3.5 bar in the CP only. should I upgrade the MAP location as well ?

WOT log:
https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=609d...0b430647aa5b4d

Partial throttle:
https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=609d...0b4306cd0893de
It doesn't look like a load based tune. It looks like its based on BM3, which is a boost-based tune.

Also, i dont really see what the problem is? You're meeting your boost target just fine in the WOT log. The target is just dropping in the upper RPM below 22.5 psi. This is usually intentionally as a "soft limiter" so you dont slam into redline at full boost. For example you are right on your boost target at 22.5 psi even in 3rd gear in the WOT log.

Are you saying you want to be OVER the boost target of 22.5psi? I see that a little in the partial throttle log (toward the end) but that's only going based on the CP sensor because your MAP sensor is maxxed out. Although, throttle is open 100% so they should be reading the same boost.

I don't know why your boost target is so much lower in 6th gear in the WOT log. Seems like it could be a tune issue although its not a direct comparison because your partial throttle log stopped at 5000 rpm and your WOT log started at 5000 rpm.

So are you saying you want to set boost target at 22.5psi but you actually want to make more boost than that?

Also for a direct comparison i would try gathering logs under the same conditions - i.e., a 4th or 5th gear pull, partial throttle then full throttle, over the same RPM range.
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      05-14-2021, 05:35 PM   #7
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The boost should go as high as 26-27 PSI .. that what I was running when I was using JB4 as boost & Meth controller. We are trying to get the boost to go over the 22.5 PSI limit.
The target in the first place should be higher than 22.5 PSI, but not sure why it's not.

The boost target limit in 6th gear is due the torque limit I put in XHP flash to avoid slippage on the 6th gear.
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      05-14-2021, 05:44 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
The boost should go as high as 26-27 PSI .. that what I was running when I was using JB4 as boost & Meth controller. We are trying to get the boost to go over the 22.5 PSI limit.
The target in the first place should be higher than 22.5 PSI, but not sure why it's not.

The boost target limit in 6th gear is due the torque limit I put in XHP flash to avoid slippage on the 6th gear.
We'll, im not a tuner persay, but it seems like step 1 is making the boost target over 22.5psi? Unless there is some limitation there because you have a 2.5bar MAP that maxes at 22.5psi. Tuning with BM3 is always a little more confusing to me because its not based on a load target so the boost has a mind of its own and is allowed to exceed target in some situations but not others.

That doesn't necessarily explain why you can get over 22.5psi target at part throttle but not WOT. But your boost target never goes over 22.5 psi in any gear. And infact the only gear you see 26psi of boost is 6th in the part throttle log.
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      05-14-2021, 05:57 PM   #9
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Here another partial throttle (5th gear) you can see boost goes as high as 33 PSI!
https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=609c...0b434b387178fc

I'm not sure, but I think the tuner told me it's normal for the boost target not to show above 22.5 PSI due to platform limitation perhaps? But the actual boost should go beyond that.

That's why I'm hoping to see if anyone here had flash only (bootmod3) with a boost over 22.5 PSI.
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      05-14-2021, 06:34 PM   #10
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your boost target is flat out low in wot. that's a setting.

who's the tuner so I don't go with them when I get a new one?
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      05-14-2021, 06:57 PM   #11
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Have you confirmed that the flash .bin has its boost targets set where you want them? Try tunerpro to confirm maybe?

I don't understand the tuner saying its normal to read a boost level below what it actually is. Never heard anything like that before.

If a boost reading cannot be taken above 22.5, I wouldn't want to tune above that. I mean I wouldn't trust anything at that point. Who's to know if a hpfp crash, throttle cut, or trims signal deviation may be related to overboosting? WGDC who knows what that means.

Edit: after re reading this a couple times I may be misunderstanding, I cant view the logs at the moment. The issue isn't one of reaching/reading your ACTUAL boost, but rather the issue is just that your unable to read the boost TARGET?

Last edited by 435gc; 05-14-2021 at 08:11 PM..
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      05-14-2021, 11:46 PM   #12
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Just to clarify the limitation is in displaying boost target, not in the actual boost itself.
From my research, I saw this mentioned in the MHD thread:
Quote:
Which confirms what my tuner said. Anyhow now with Bootmod3 CustomROM they added something called RAM channels and I just tested and were able to see the actual target and boost target without issue. I sent the new logs to my tuner hopefully he can figure what is the issue is.

I was hoping to see someone with over 22 PSI EWG N55 bootmod3 flash only to see if this issue only affects me or it's just something missing in the bootmod3 itself.
I found two running boost over 2.5bar flash only EWG N55 but one using MHD and the other is using ECUtek platform.
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      05-15-2021, 01:31 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
Just to clarify the limitation is in displaying boost target, not in the actual boost itself.
From my research, I saw this mentioned in the MHD thread:


Which confirms what my tuner said. Anyhow now with Bootmod3 CustomROM they added something called RAM channels and I just tested and were able to see the actual target and boost target without issue. I sent the new logs to my tuner hopefully he can figure what is the issue is.

I was hoping to see someone with over 22 PSI EWG N55 bootmod3 flash only to see if this issue only affects me or it's just something missing in the bootmod3 itself.
I found two running boost over 2.5bar flash only EWG N55 but one using MHD and the other is using ECUtek platform.
Well that explains the target issue. I think its worth asking your tuner if you should replace the MAP sensor with a 3.5 bar as well. I would be a little weary of tuning well over its maximum boost reading, although i know people do that to some extent with a 3.5bar only in the CP.
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      05-17-2021, 05:17 PM   #14
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You should add all the latest logging stuff available too. They added tons of new stuff recently. What I do is go into the About screen and click on the reset settings button and that brings in all the latest toys they have in the data logging department.
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      05-17-2021, 09:40 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
I'm currently in process of doing a custom tune to take full advantage of my Stage 3 BW EFR 8374 turbo.

But we are having an issue boost won't go over 2.5bar/22.5 PSI on WOT, although on the partial throttle boost can max the 3.5bar sensor no problem.
Anyone with EWG N55, turbo upgrade, and custom tune had this issue?
And if anyone don't have this problem would mind sharing some logs?

So far the tuner made many revisions without any luck..
@cookiesowns at BendCalibration dialed in my Speedtech EFR flex fuel build: https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=27561294

Maybe he can chime in.
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      05-18-2021, 12:48 AM   #16
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oh yeah. you absolutely need a 3.5bar map. you'll have all kinds of issues cause of boost clipping if you don't. I'm shocked your tuner didn't make you get one! Cary Jordan makes people get them when you hit 20pai just in case. I had issues with on my stock turbo and had to get one.
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      05-18-2021, 04:31 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTWO View Post
You should add all the latest logging stuff available too. They added tons of new stuff recently. What I do is go into the About screen and click on the reset settings button and that brings in all the latest toys they have in the data logging department.
Yes my tuner asked me to do the same and I have sent him the new logs .. hopefully, he can figure things out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Eidos View Post
@cookiesowns at BendCalibration dialed in my Speedtech EFR flex fuel build: https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=27561294

Maybe he can chime in.
You have a very nice setup!.
I think I did contact BendCalibration about 1 year ago but they were super busy at that time and did not want to take the project. Do they offer remote tuning?

If I give up on bootmod3 I might consider switching to ECUtek.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom10R View Post
oh yeah. you absolutely need a 3.5bar map. you'll have all kinds of issues cause of boost clipping if you don't. I'm shocked your tuner didn't make you get one! Cary Jordan makes people get them when you hit 20pai just in case. I had issues with on my stock turbo and had to get one.
I have 3.5bar TMAP Sensor but only on Pre-Throttle/CP.

Did you upgrade both Pre-Throttle TMAP Sensor and Manifold TMAP Sensor?
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      05-18-2021, 07:35 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTWO View Post
You should add all the latest logging stuff available too. They added tons of new stuff recently. What I do is go into the About screen and click on the reset settings button and that brings in all the latest toys they have in the data logging department.
Yes my tuner asked me to do the same and I have sent him the new logs .. hopefully, he can figure things out.

Quote:
Originally Posted by -Eidos View Post
@cookiesowns at BendCalibration dialed in my Speedtech EFR flex fuel build: https://www.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...php?p=27561294

Maybe he can chime in.
You have a very nice setup!.
I think I did contact BendCalibration about 1 year ago but they were super busy at that time and did not want to take the project. Do they offer remote tuning?

If I give up on bootmod3 I might consider switching to ECUtek.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom10R View Post
oh yeah. you absolutely need a 3.5bar map. you'll have all kinds of issues cause of boost clipping if you don't. I'm shocked your tuner didn't make you get one! Cary Jordan makes people get them when you hit 20pai just in case. I had issues with on my stock turbo and had to get one.
I have 3.5bar TMAP Sensor but only on Pre-Throttle/CP.

Did you upgrade both Pre-Throttle TMAP Sensor and Manifold TMAP Sensor?
just the pre throttle. not the manifold.
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      05-18-2021, 08:08 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phantom10R View Post
just the pre throttle. not the manifold.
Yeah, that's what I'm currently running.
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      05-19-2021, 04:23 AM   #20
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A thing I never understood is why it is only necessary to update the CP TMAP to 3.5 bar... To calc throttle closure would it not be comparing readings from CP and manifold TMAP?
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      05-19-2021, 09:43 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harkes View Post
A thing I never understood is why it is only necessary to update the CP TMAP to 3.5 bar... To calc throttle closure would it not be comparing readings from CP and manifold TMAP?
Yeah, no idea . How much boost are you currently running? I know PWG might be different but still interesting to see how MHD compares to bootmod3 in this regard.
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      05-19-2021, 11:12 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kfardan View Post

You have a very nice setup!.

I think I did contact BendCalibration about 1 year ago but they were super busy at that time and did not want to take the project. Do they offer remote tuning?

If I give up on bootmod3 I might consider switching to ECUtek.
They do offer remote tuning. ECUTek is their main preference but they now offer BM3 packages ever since BM3 revamped their map editor.

https://www.bendcalibration.com/shop/p/bootmod3
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