[Alice Coupe]

Originally Posted by Wills2

Well you can in fact insurers reflect that in their pricing and you can also say that people continue to drive past a point that is safe to do so, as this incident clearly demonstrates.

Plenty of reports/articles on age related issues that should stop people driving that are not acted upon hence accidents like this happen.

You cannot only attribute this accident to age. It's not the first time accidents like this have happened. Below just 2 examples of younger people doing the same thing.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8284621.html

https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/10/man-a...miles-7619645/

Insurance for am 18 year old with everything else being equal is more than that for an 80 year old. Plenty reports on young drivers being high risk. Let's ban them too.

[Alice Coupe]

Originally Posted by Wills2

So am I! I cannot believe anyone would seek to mitigate the actions of the driver.

Originally Posted by MashinBenzin

Same here, 100%

Same here. But to class it only on age is wrong.

[Bibbles]

Originally Posted by Alice Coupe

You cannot only attribute this accident to age. It's not the first time accidents like this have happened. Below just 2 examples of younger people doing the same thing.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8284621.html

https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/10/man-a...miles-7619645/

Insurance for am 18 year old with everything else being equal is more than that for an 80 year old. Plenty reports on young drivers being high risk. Let's ban them too.

They were both very late at night with not much traffic on the road and one of them was drunk. I'm pretty sure the one on this thread is an age related issue but we'll see when the investigation is complete coroners report comes out.

[Harryg]

Originally Posted by Wills2

Well you can in fact insurers reflect that in their pricing and you can also say that people continue to drive past a point that is safe to do so, as this incident clearly demonstrates.

Plenty of reports/articles on age related issues that should stop people driving that are not acted upon hence accidents like this happen.

Some people may continue to drive when they shouldn't but a blanket ban on aged people is ridiculous I know and see many people in that age group that are excellent and have never had problems so they must be penalised definitely not you see many people races ( boy don't want to offend) who due to their antics while driving shouldn't be on the road People with road rage attacking other people you don't see many aged people doing that, yes medicals should be mandatory but to ban them no way they have a life as well. Should you drive commercial vehicles or PSV your checked at 40 years and then monitored after that why cant they do that for normal drivers I bet there would be more people restricted before they reach their retirement.

Did it state somewhere in the article that the vehicle involved had foreign plates I may be wrong

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Harryg

Some people may continue to drive when they shouldn't but a blanket ban on aged people is ridiculous I know and see many people in that age group that are excellent and have never had problems so they must be penalised definitely not you see many people races ( boy don't want to offend) who due to their antics while driving shouldn't be on the road People with road rage attacking other people you don't see many aged people doing that, yes medicals should be mandatory but to ban them no way they have a life as well. Should you drive commercial vehicles or PSV your checked at 40 years and then monitored after that why cant they do that for normal drivers I bet there would be more people restricted before they reach their retirement.

Did it state somewhere in the article that the vehicle involved had foreign plates I may be wrong

Where did I advocate for the blanket banning of drivers based upon age?

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Alice Coupe

Insurance for am 18 year old with everything else being equal is more than that for an 80 year old. Plenty reports on young drivers being high risk. Let's ban them too.

We have a system of testing to make sure that an 18 year old is competent. He will have been tested within the last 2 years. The testing isn't perfect of course and it's possible for someone who passes to then do something stupid. It may be that they should stay on probation for a longer period and face a ban for 6 points in the first 5 years for example.

It's quite different for an 80 year old - he probably won't have been tested for the last 60 years. The system currently has no proactive mechanism for removing drivers when the ageing process takes their standard of driving below an acceptable standard. The system seems to rely upon them voluntarily giving up, or an incident involving the police triggering that decision to be made for them, which is clearly too late. Consequently many seem to stop driving long after they have become incompetent.

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Alice Coupe

You cannot only attribute this accident to age. It's not the first time accidents like this have happened. Below just 2 examples of younger people doing the same thing.


https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a8284621.html

https://metro.co.uk/2018/06/10/man-a...miles-7619645/

Insurance for am 18 year old with everything else being equal is more than that for an 80 year old. Plenty reports on young drivers being high risk. Let's ban them too.

I don't know why you're trying to narrow the discussion down to specific points that no one is arguing against and no amount of whataboutism is going to change anything.

That driver by his actions alone has shown he wasn't fit to be behind the wheel, the fact that other drivers are also not fit to be behind the wheel for other reasons is neither here nor there.

[Harryg]

Originally Posted by Wills2

Where did I advocate for the blanket banning of drivers based upon age?

Well you can in fact insurers reflect that in their pricing and you can also say that people continue to drive past a point that is safe to do so, as this incident clearly demonstrates.

Yes you are not advocating a blanket ban but you are saying driving when they shouldn't as this case clearly demonstrates

No one knows the facts its really really bad that someone has lost their life due to these circumstances and tragic for the people involved.

A lot of the posts on here assume its age related but nothing is based on fact once the details come out and eventually they will.

[Watsey]

Originally Posted by Wills2

So am I! I cannot believe anyone would seek to mitigate the actions of the driver.

Me too. There are absolutely no mitigating factors relating to driving against the flow of three lanes of motorway traffic. Incompetence or a death wish are the only possibilities.

[Wills2]

Originally Posted by Harryg

Yes you are not advocating a blanket ban but you are saying driving when they shouldn't as this case clearly demonstrates

No one knows the facts its really really bad that someone has lost their life due to these circumstances and tragic for the people involved.

A lot of the posts on here assume its age related but nothing is based on fact once the details come out and eventually they will.

OK the driver was totally capable and wilfully drove down the wrong side of the carriageway in order to cause death and mayhem...is that better because that's what you're actually saying, if you think it wasn't age related.

BTW I'm no spring chicken either.

[Harryg]

Originally Posted by Wills2

OK the driver was totally capable and wilfully drove down the wrong side of the carriageway in order to cause death and mayhem...is that better because that's what you're actually saying, if you think it wasn't age related.

BTW I'm no spring chicken either.

No I certainly am not saying that.
I am saying whatever happened and the reasons for it will eventually come out..
that's why we have judges baristas solicitors and juries because people can make assumptions on what they think but don't have the facts every one thinks different however I would not automatically condemn a person on assumptions.


Weather or not you are a spring chicken its irrelevant

[Alice Coupe]

Yup. This ^^^^

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by Harryg

No I certainly am not saying that.
I am saying whatever happened and the reasons for it will eventually come out..
that's why we have judges baristas solicitors and juries because people can make assumptions on what they think but don't have the facts every one thinks different however I would not automatically condemn a person on assumptions.


Weather or not you are a spring chicken its irrelevant

Can I ask what possible facts some of you guys are waiting to come out within investigation?

The actions within this video are indefensible.

If you watch a video of someone put a gun to another persons heads and blow their brains out....is it not a complete picture until we know all the facts? Or is it bleeding obvious?

PS I hope you guys have called your lawyers...!? The video is from Idiot Drivers UK i see dirk the logo standpoint. We can't say that until we see all the facts right

PPS I've counted around 6 seconds between the white van flashing and the car appearing. Unless the cruise control is stuck on, or the accelerator is melted to the floor (likely?? Remember the guy crashed needlessly weeks before)

Conclusion unless there are bizarre powers at large gross gross incompetence.

[Harryg]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Can I ask what possible facts some of you guys are waiting to come out within investigation?

The actions within this video are indefensible.

If you watch a video of someone put a gun to another persons heads and blow their brains out....is it not a complete picture until we know all the facts? Or is it bleeding obvious?

PS I hope you guys have called your lawyers...!? The video is from Idiot Drivers UK i see dirk the logo standpoint. We can't say that until we see all the facts right

PPS I've counted around 6 seconds between the white van flashing and the car appearing. Unless the cruise control is stuck on, or the accelerator is melted to the floor (likely?? Remember the guy crashed needlessly weeks before)

Conclusion unless there are bizarre powers at large gross gross incompetence.

No one is saying it was not wrong what he did its highly obvious he is totally in the wrong its the point of using the age factor as the reason and saying he shouldn't be driving

A couple of posts earlier shows a 40 something year old doing the same because hes not 80 the age thing isn't mentioned
I am not defending this guy he is totally wrong its easy to see but to put this down to age is premature people are now debating this guy shouldn't be on the road at his age.

Another post earlier shows a guy doing exactly the same but is pissed luckily on both occasions no one was injured now the guy knows he shouldn't drive along the motorway in the wrong direction but he's pissed do we ban alcohol. He should be locked up for a very long time but the reasons are clear. No assumptions on that one

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Harryg

Another post earlier shows a guy doing exactly the same but is pissed luckily on both occasions no one was injured now the guy knows he shouldn't drive along the motorway in the wrong direction but he's pissed do we ban alcohol.

I could be wrong, but there might already be a ban on alcohol and driving...

I don’t think that people are suggesting removing 80 year olds from the roads, but introducing age-related testing. We test for alcohol as that is a factor which is shown to make driving worse. We should also test for the effects of age. If someone is still competent at 80 then they should be able to continue driving until they fail a test.

[Bibbles]

It doesn't even need to be a driving test that older people have to complete. Just go see a doctor (not your GP who is run off their feet seeing to Bob's cold or Bills wish to now be Jemima) have someone that's medically trained that can run through some simple tests - can you see ok, if I throw something at you do you react in time, does this big fucking sign mean no entry or drive through here for a Costa? I don't think you need a full on driving test every couple of years but something that proves you're driving a car not unintentionally wielding a weapon would be a start.

[Harryg]

Originally Posted by JD6

I could be wrong, but there might already be a ban on alcohol and driving...

I don’t think that people are suggesting removing 80 year olds from the roads, but introducing age-related testing. We test for alcohol as that is a factor which is shown to make driving worse. We should also test for the effects of age. If someone is still competent at 80 then they should be able to continue driving until they fail a test.

This is what I have been saying all along I'm all for that I have stated this in my posts earlier and this should be mandatory from the age of 50 they do it at the early age so roll it out to middle age

Lets hope they do this the roads could become safer.

[MashinBenzin]

As Chris states, I don't think we particularly need the results of an investigation to presume this is age related. We're not changing the law on the basis of our debate on a forum. It seems unlikely that an investigation will find that the driver posted a video to Facebook about his motives, so a reasonable assumption is an age-related mistake and utter failure to react.

If anyone was suggesting an age-related ban, I don't know why we would be outraged by that. We have no trouble with the concept of every 16 year old being judged as incapable, why would we feel that it is horrendous to say the same of a 85 year old?

Testing though, is the obvious answer. The GP tests are one idea. However, we already have test centres for the theory test, why not come up with a test for the over-70s. Come in, take the simulator test, identify and react to situations appropriately, pass - simple. 100%, come back in two years, 90%, we will see you in a year, 80% six months. Failed to identify a major danger - off for a real test. Utter ineptitude, your ban starts now.

That's short term. Medium term will be solved by autonomous taxis.

[JustChris]

A few more quotes from witnesses or their partners:-

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/201...wrong-way-m40/

“He must have been going about 60mph. It was a car with foreign plates pulling a caravan. It didn’t look to be slowing down.

Sonia Thomson, from Staffordshire, said the car was "going so fast it was almost past me in the blink of an eye".

And Oliver Hayes wrote: "We also had to swerve, seemed at least 70mph driving head on in our lane at junction 8... did not look accidental.


The comments about J7 and J8 are also interesting as its been suggested by some on here that they joined just a short 100m prior to the accident, not a all the case.

The Forester is thought to have joined the M40 at Junction 7, which is around six miles north of the crash site or Junction 8, which is 8.5 miles north.


https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/752393...chards-victim/

The car is believed to have been on the motorway for eight miles, swerving between cars for seven minutes before the crash.