11-23-2021, 11:51 AM | #90 |
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I'd be careful running that much Ethanol. At one point you're HPFP is targeting 2900 psi and you're only getting 900 psi.
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'14 435i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E30/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.9@125].....60 to 130 - 8.5
'16 340i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E50/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.2@131]......60 to 130 - 7.5 |
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11-23-2021, 11:54 AM | #91 |
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Thanks. Opened a case with PTF and they are working on it now. Doesn't make sense because fuel pumps were upgraded to a Dorch Stage2 and a Precision Raceworks Stage2.5V2
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11-23-2021, 11:59 AM | #92 | |
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'14 435i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E30/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.9@125].....60 to 130 - 8.5
'16 340i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E50/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.2@131]......60 to 130 - 7.5 |
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11-23-2021, 12:05 PM | #93 |
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I do think its possible he has reached the limit of the DS2 but they quote it as being capable of supporting full E85 up to 500whp and hes quite a bit below that with stock turbo.
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11-23-2021, 12:08 PM | #94 | ||
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So it shouldn't be the hardware, but we'll see. |
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11-23-2021, 12:23 PM | #95 |
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I honestly think it's a combination of both factors. I'll explain my theory a little later when I have time to write it out lol
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'14 435i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E30/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.9@125].....60 to 130 - 8.5
'16 340i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E50/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.2@131]......60 to 130 - 7.5 |
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11-23-2021, 12:46 PM | #96 |
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when using pump gas base tune, i notice that positive STFT is needed to add fuel to meet target AFR.
in the event that the car runs in open loop, you'd be looking at a situation where you will run lean. do you have any multi-gear logs to see the open/closed loop behavior during gear shifts.
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11-23-2021, 01:03 PM | #97 | |
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https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=6198...0b436c0e830139 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=6198...0b436c0e83013d Here are some earlier 1st->4th gear logs running Bootmod3 FlexFuel MultiMap Stage2 91ACN with E50 in the tank. No xHP but I was running Bootmod3 automatic transmission tune. I installed xHP after earlier logs showed that I was hitting a torque maximum. xHP eliminated the issue. https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=6186...90c6283fe0a8e4 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=6186...729b69de5fb411 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=6186...90c6283fe0a8f0 |
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11-23-2021, 02:05 PM | #98 | |
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focusing on just the pump gas tune, looks like you go into closed loop really quick after a gear shift - benefits of the auto transmission i suppose. you only get to 10% positive STFT too, which is less than the previous single gear logs where you went up to 30%, but that makes sense since you are running less boost in this batch.
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11-23-2021, 02:25 PM | #99 |
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Ok, so here is my theory.
Your HPFP pressure drops significantly down to 900-1100 PSI right in the RPM area of peak torque ~2800-3000 RPM, at the same time you're having throttle closures (I'm assuming because of the overboosting 22+psi -- above 20.6 target). So I know the HPFP is driven by the vacuum pump, and right now I'm not sure how they work together, but I'm assuming that is a factor here because as the RPMs climb you don't have any more throttle closures (you're right at or below boost target) and the HPFP pressure begins to stabilize as it starts climbing to meet target soon after the dip. The stock turbo usually makes max hp in the neighborhood of 5100-5500 RPM, and by that time you're HPFP is meeting target. So no, I don't think you're maxing out the HPFP because of the HP, but it is maxing out because of the tuning strategy and partly because of it not being able to keep mechanically with the torque demand down low. |
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11-23-2021, 02:30 PM | #100 | |
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11-23-2021, 02:34 PM | #101 | |
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The HPFP is mechanical so the amount of fuel it is able to flow is entirely RPM dependent. Thus, the crashes typically happen at the lower RPM high boost situations. |
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11-23-2021, 03:34 PM | #102 | ||
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A lot of torque down low feels nice, but it is detrimental to connecting rods and bearings when you're making that much jam at such a low RPM. That's why MOST custom tunes (no matter the platform) don't bring in the torque/boost that hard in low RPM situations. I'm still sticking to the both being an issue. It's like trying to get a 2.0L to make 30lbs of boost with a 62mm turbo by 3000RPM, it's not going to happen. Then saying that same engine can't make 30lbs boost, which clearly it can given the chance to increase RPM. David would be a good candidate here to pump a high ethanol content and test it out on his PS2. 😬
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'14 435i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E30/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.9@125].....60 to 130 - 8.5
'16 340i RWD - BM3 stage 2+ E50/bolt ons/stock turbo/full drag pack -- [10.2@131]......60 to 130 - 7.5 |
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11-23-2021, 03:45 PM | #103 |
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Hey guys, while you're digging into this, check out my latest post (#377) here: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1774687
I went back and forth with Chris at Dorch this morning investigating an issue I was having and he helped me get it fixed. Related to your discussion, he had me start logging the RAM HPFP Angle (Final) parameter in BM3, which shows HPFP duty cycle. If more of us start logging this parameter, it may help diagnosing things like this. IDK for sure, but it looks like it's showing the behavior that 5w20 is stating when my Dorch Stg 1 dips on E50 at tip in (max torque). |
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11-23-2021, 05:32 PM | #104 |
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n55 vacuum pump is chain driven (engine rpm dependent) and has a cam that actuates the hpfp. more rpm=more pump.
check out dorch s55 lift kit install guide https://dorchengineering.com/wp-cont...LK_Install.pdf
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11-23-2021, 06:26 PM | #105 | |
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11-27-2021, 10:59 AM | #106 | ||
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Bootmod3 Tech Support sent me a Test map for FlexFuel MultiMap Stage2+ in which they said that the fuel scalar had been changed on it. I flashed it and sent in logs. Waiting to hear back for the next step. I'm wondering if the FlexFuel MultiMap Stage2 will also need some modification to run full E85 without issue? I don't have access to anything larger than a phone screen right now to view my logs. Below are my Test Map logs if anyone is interested. LOGS IN 4TH GEAR https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=619f...729b0a93f4d7c5 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=619f...729b0b18a269d4 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=619f...0b432fc163089c LOGS FROM 1ST TO 4TH GEAR https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=619f...729b0a93f4d7d0 https://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=619f...0b432fc16308a1 |
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11-29-2021, 08:25 AM | #107 | ||
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UPDATE ON 12/29/2021 Received from Bootmod3 Tech Support a new Test2 map to flash and log. Did not receive any analysis of the Test1 Map logs that I sent but I assume they showed something that needed to be modified. I kept getting an OBD Agent version error when I tried to download the Test2 Map and I am currently waiting for support to reply/fix it. Comment On Current Speculation: If the issue is that the mechanical Dorch2 HPFP can't keep up at low revs with the high torque fuel demands of the full E85 tune for the stock N55 EWG turbo, then the obvious solution would appear to be to increase the flow of the HPFP overall. The Dorch Lift Kit is being released that increases the flow of the Dorch2 by 49%. Perhaps that might be the solution for this configuration? Attached is a photo of a quick comparison of F30 N55 Dorch HPFP options based on current information on the Dorch Engineering website. |
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11-29-2021, 12:55 PM | #108 | |
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11-29-2021, 01:09 PM | #109 | ||
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