[floydarogers]

Don't know if you've seen the big new about VW: They've been cheating on their EPA Emissions Testing since their 2009 models. Fortunately, BMW seems to have been doing things kosher...

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=1174591
and
http://www.bimmerfest.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=871390

[BimmerF32_430i]

was reading about this earlier. maximum fine could be upwards of 18 billion i believe

[oceanview]

Gents. This is the time to sell all your car manufacturer stocks.
VW is just the first to pop up with that, but that's just the beginning.
Modern car software recognizes when a standard test procedure is driven and it is adjusting engine parameters to it.
In the best case only higher gas consumption in real world driving compared to the test cycle is the result, in other cases (like VW) it will affect emissions.

(By the way, where I live, most new American cars can only be imported because of a special government exception rule. Most American car models fail to pass the standard accurate European pedestrian safety crash test! No such exception for European manufacturers.)

[Burstofspeed]

Originally Posted by oceanview

Gents. This is the time to sell all your car manufacturer stocks.
VW is just the first to pop up with that, but that's just the beginning.
Modern car software recognizes when a standard test procedure is driven and it is adjusting engine parameters to it.
In the best case only higher gas consumption in real world driving compared to the test cycle is the result, in other cases (like VW) it will affect emissions. )

It was only the 4 cly VW+Audi engines that had the problem. They also tested the X5 in a similar real world scenario and it did just fine. I would not go out proclaiming the death of diesel because one company intentionally cheated the system, or assume that other manufactures are operating in a similar manner. VW stock is tanking droped over $50 as of now.

[Adamr916]

They just came out with an update today that said it wasn't just in the US that they did this. It was done on 11 million cars worldwide, more than likely in the main Euro zone.

[catskillclimber]

The X5 did exceed the NOx standard by 10X in the rural uphill/downhill route. VW appears to have put little effort into engineering as even the UREA equipped vehicle NOx performance was abysmal over all the routes.

[Thumper333]

Originally Posted by Burstofspeed

VW stock is tanking droped over $50 as of now.

Wait for the bottom here in a few weeks, than buy a ton of it. While this is disastrous in the short term PR wise it's not long term catastrophic.

I mean heck, look at all the cover ups other manufacturer's have done on SAFETY items. Things that put our lives in immediate danger, yet they get smaller fines and people just keep on buying their cars.

Stock will tank just based on the hysteria of the sheep, some people at VW will be fired, and the technical team will hit the lab and start working on solutions.

Life goes on.

Meanwhile, as this story on VW makes headlines and news all over.......

http://www.cnn.com/2015/08/09/us/col...e-river-spill/

No national outrage, no activists from Greenpeace calling for the heads of the EPA, no one is expected to get fired, and everything is hush hush.

[catskillclimber]

The Colorado spill was an accident.

VW willfully violated laws in who know how many countries and committed fraud by selling vehicles under false pretense. Ethics appear to be non existent at VW.

Both are tragic and should have consequences.

[Burstofspeed]

Originally Posted by Thumper333

Wait for the bottom here in a few weeks, than buy a ton of it. While this is disastrous in the short term PR wise it's not long term catastrophic.

I mean heck, look at all the cover ups other manufacturer's have done on SAFETY items. Things that put our lives in immediate danger, yet they get smaller fines and people just keep on buying their cars.

Its sad to see that for a environmental violation, while very serious, VW could be fined more and stock dropped more than other manufactures negligence that has caused the loss of human life like Takara airbag, or the Toyota acceleration problems.

[Thumper333]

Originally Posted by catskillclimber

The Colorado spill was an accident.

VW willfully violated laws in who know how many countries and committed fraud by selling vehicles under false pretense. Ethics appear to be non existent at VW.

Both are tragic and should have consequences.

An accident which if committed by a PRIVATE company would have resulted in fines and public outcry and the talking heads on TV going nuts with how horrible this corporation is and calls for boycotts and bans, etc.

But since it's the EPA.....they will "investigate" on their own and those responsible will be promoted. It seems VW isn't the only one with ethics issues and yet there will be no consequences.

Oh, and BTW, they did it again, another EPA spill into a river. Thankfully much less severe....

Not to mention these spills are a real danger to the environment and people unlike the fictitious boogey man of NoX.

Originally Posted by Burstofspeed

Its sad to see that for a environmental violation, while very serious, VW could be fined more and stock dropped more than other manufactures negligence that has caused the loss of human life like Takara airbag, or the Toyota acceleration problems.

Exactly.

And don't forget the GM ignition switch fires......

Was it wrong to do what VW did? Yes. But what ever happened to the punishment fitting the crime? Why is issuing a work around for a bogus emission requirement (which is only tested in a handful of locations) more of an offense than defects and cover ups that actually killed and seriously injured people?

It's not about whether or not the action was wrong, it was......I personally don't care because it's a stupid requirement in the first place......but it was wrong. The issue is with the political and emotional response which is ridiculous and unfair.

[oceanview]

Originally Posted by Thumper333

Not to mention these spills are a real danger to the environment and people unlike the fictitious boogey man of NoX.

Was it wrong to do what VW did? Yes. But what ever happened to the punishment fitting the crime? Why is issuing a work around for a bogus emission requirement (which is only tested in a handful of locations) more of an offense than defects and cover ups that actually killed and seriously injured people?

It's not about whether or not the action was wrong, it was......I personally don't care because it's a stupid requirement in the first place......but it was wrong. The issue is with the political and emotional response which is ridiculous and unfair.

The difference is that the broken ignition switch of GM killed immediately while the NOx and other emissions could kill slowly.

Over the last 50 years traffic has increased massively. It's a good thing that engines get cleaner and less emissions come out from the exhaust. (And with emission I don't mean CO2 but the dirty and dangerous stuff)

Example: In our country since 1989 NOx/Ozon and fine particles measured in the air (not at the car exhaust) where reduced by 50%. This is a success based on harder laws for industry, cars, and house heating systems.
(numbers of cars have more than doubled in this time and population has grown 20%)

If you get chronic lung disease because of NOx emission, who will pay for it? The car manufacturers not following the law?