[t5pilot]

I'm in the camp that think this is the buyer pulling a fast one, not Evri.

Have you looked at Evri's proof of delivery photo? They always take one.
From that, it should be pretty obvious to you (as you packed it up) if the parcel's been tampered with. I suspect it hasn't, and it looks the same as when you sent it.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by t5pilot

I'm in the camp that think this is the buyer pulling a fast one, not Evri.

Have you looked at Evri's proof of delivery photo? They always take one.
From that, it should be pretty obvious to you (as you packed it up) if the parcel's been tampered with. I suspect it hasn't, and it looks the same as when you sent it.

From post 3....by the OP

I know the buyer isn't trying to scam me because I did pay for proof of postage 0.50p which required the delivery driver to get a signature and a photo of the parcel in the recipients open doorway and guess what... the parcel in the photo isn't the one which I posted...

That seems pretty conclusive.

[Watsey]

Originally Posted by Danj94

Hey,

You're absolutely right it's exactly what I suspected when I first received the message from the buyer this evening explaining the situation.

I know the buyer isn't trying to scam me because I did pay for proof of postage 0.50p which required the delivery driver to get a signature and a photo of the parcel in the recipients open doorway and guess what... the parcel in the photo isn't the one which I posted...

I asked the recipient to show me a picture of the postage label on the parcel and sure enough it's exactly the same as the one I attached to the playstation but it does look to of been tampered with.

That's how I know someone at Evri has been up to no good.

Have you got a photo of the package that you posted, at the drop-off location ?

On the rare occasions that I sell to a remote buyer, i.e. not cash on collection in-person, I always do this. Place the parcel on the counter (i.e. the shop that's an official EVRI drop-off location) and take a photo of it, the EVRI receipt, and something identifiable in the background (counter staff; display unit; etc).

[t5pilot]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

From post 3....by the OP

I know the buyer isn't trying to scam me because I did pay for proof of postage 0.50p which required the delivery driver to get a signature and a photo of the parcel in the recipients open doorway and guess what... the parcel in the photo isn't the one which I posted...

That seems pretty conclusive.

Ah... Thank you. Completely missed that.

[speedski]

Originally Posted by Danj94

Usually wouldn't do this but.. on this occasion I feel I have a duty to debunk this absolute nonsense which you're spreading on this forum. Please see details below for exactly why insurance in this case is both not applicable but also by law not enforceable as EVRI T's & C's.

The fact you think I am naive for refunding the eBay buyer for their purchase when they have not received the item which they purchased shows to me you have absolutely no understanding of consumer rights act 2015 but I shall continue to explain for the benefit of others who may find themselves in a similar position, who knows perhaps you might actually learn something too and could become less naive to the fact you actually have far more weight in the court of law under the consumer rights act then you think. This isn't about being a nice guy, this is about doing whats both morally right and legal. You're right I could wait for eBay to enforce a refund to the buyer but this doesn't help my case one bit and actually just further inconveniences the buyer who has no further part in this case.

So why isn't the - You didn't buy insurance for your package so you have no case line enforceable in a court of law in this case.

First, the delivery companies' insurance is unlawful because it is contrary to section 57 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015 which specifically prohibits the exclusion or limitation of any liability for the failure to take reasonable skill and care.

Second, the insurance contract itself is a secondary contract which is also designed to exclude or to limit liability and these kinds of secondary contracts are specifically prohibited by section 72 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

Third, it cannot be correct that the service provider expects the customer to protect – (essentially them, the service provider) – from having to bear the cost of compensating for their own negligence or the criminality of their own employees. This is effectively requiring the customer to pay for the service provider' s breach of contract.

Fourth, the service provider is required to use reasonable care and skill – and the insurance requirement amounts to contracting out of their duty.

Fifth, The insurance requirement imposed by the courier industry is intended to remove your rights under the Consumer Rights Act that the service provided to you should be carried out with reasonable care and skill. The insurance requirement effectively grants you that right only if you pay an additional fee and this amounts to an attempt to restrict or exclude the courier's liability and is contrary to section 57 of the Consumer Rights Act 2015.

Six, where an item is stolen, not only is it a criminal act but also it is an act of conversion – which is a tort. It is unfair to require the customer to be responsible for the torts of the service providers own employees.

Seven, the service provider is a large well resourced company and is the "better loss bearer".

all seven of those reasons are exactly why in this case the lack of insurance is NOT enforceable in a court of law. It may be used to intimidate customers to prevent them from pursuing recovery of costs which they are actually entitled to.

and to back up the information I have given above and to prove it works I am also going to provide a case study of a person who encountered a similar set of circumstances and has recently been successful in recovering all costs before attending court.

https://www.consumeractiongroup.co.u...efund-in-full/

Now I am not saying for a second that I will 100% win this case, I will be following the methodology shown in the link above, I am not trained in law or consumer rights but I have made an effort to educate myself on what my rights are as a consumer and to dismiss this as you didn't pay a fiver for insurance its your own fault your so naive is absolutely ridiculous.

I am sure you will have some smart answers to some of the points I've listed above but frankly I couldn't care less. I will continue to update this thread only with progress updates from my case against EVRI.

Just to clarify for accuracy - Evri sell additional coverage, they do not sell insurance.

So I wouldn't refer to any 'insurance' in any claim but to 'additional coverage'.

I would also make a point of the 'duty of care' involved in the process of package delivery to strengthen your case.

Good luck.

[JustChris]

Originally Posted by Allworth

As someone who works for DPD as C&D driver,
It is good to hear people are having positive experience with DPD.
I personally never had such a massive bad experience when sending items, but I suspect bad people can be in any company, including parcel shops. Maybe sometimes it worth using parcel lockers, spending sometime delivering dear items on your own, or asking to collect. And just to restore the sanity, an elder gentleman who does Evri delivery in my area is really trustworthy.

DPD are excellent for me! Love the App and knowing the exact delivery time

[SkyJawa]

DPD are defo one of the better ones. The tracking and 1 hour slot work very well.

Evri is only ok as our local guy is pretty good but further down the line who knows! Yodel are useless twats.

FedEx, UPS and DHL are out of touch and stupid expensive.

[boba-fett]

Well this has been a hard read. I hope the OP gets his money back, however I think it will be a lot of stress, wasted time and no doubt some money!

I don't believe people still actually pay for Evri as a viable delivery service. I just don't get that some people think oh they have changed their name, so lets forget about the horrendous service they provided and the damn right outrageous reviews that people gave them.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by SkyJawa

DPD are defo one of the better ones. The tracking and 1 hour slot work very well.

Evri is only ok as our local guy is pretty good but further down the line who knows! Yodel are useless twats.

FedEx, UPS and DHL are out of touch and stupid expensive.

Our local Evri girl is fantastic, they all need to be fantastic though.

Its the only delivery service that if I bought something and the seller used them, I always thought there was a high probability I might not get this!

I bought a rare Carbon spoiler for a Ferrari and it went missing by them, yes I got my money back through E-Bay buyer protection, but its the item and its rarity that was more important. Sometimes its a lot more of a loss than just getting your money back!

[Bryans69]

Evri are beyond useless in my experience, and I won't buy from anyone that I know is using them to ship anything.

[planemad]

Originally Posted by Bryans69

Evri are beyond useless in my experience, and I won't buy from anyone that I know is using them to ship anything.

Same here, they were so piss poor as Hermes they had to change name and rebrand to evri to trick everyone.

[Danj94]

Quick update.

I contacted both Packlink & EVRI about my issue.

Packlink first denied there was any issue as my parcel was showing as delivered, after explaining a second time they now understand my issue and have offered the £25 compensation for the issue. I am not likely to pursue them any further although my initial contract was with Packlink via EVRI they are domiciled in Spain and the only way to recover my costs would be via the Spanish courts. Instead if required I will be exercising my rights under the Contracts (right of third parties) Act 1999 which will allow me to take action directly with EVRI as I am a direct beneficiary of the arranged contract.

So in short I'm done with Packlink now.

As for EVRI, my email to the CEO was responded to by a member of the "executive office" and the response is pleasant, they are going to carry out an "investigation" into the where abouts of my parcel over the next 72 hours and will update me on their findings once this time has elapsed. So I am expecting to hear on Thursday there is nothing they can do to help me and wash their hands with me.

In anticipation of this I have drafted my letter of claim and will be sending it to EVRI likely Thursday/Friday this week which in essence is the start of legal proceedings.

The recipient that received the incorrect parcel has since been refunded. He has been helpful in weighing and measuring the parcel he received. Crucially it weighs 1.5kg and the box isn't large enough to fit a SONY PS5 in it. I paid for a service for an item which weighed between 7-10kg. So it is clear there has been a mix up.

Also I have sent over 80 items with EVRI/HERMES over the years and this is the first occasion which I have had an issue. Our local EVRI guy is super helpful so I try to avoid tarring all with the same brush. I do understand though that HERMES/EVRI have built a reputation for themselves which is now ringing true. We live and we learn.

It will likely be about a week until the next update.

Dan

[speedski]

Originally Posted by Danj94

Quick update.

I contacted both Packlink & EVRI about my issue.

Packlink first denied there was any issue as my parcel was showing as delivered, after explaining a second time they now understand my issue and have offered the £25 compensation for the issue. I am not likely to pursue them any further although my initial contract was with Packlink via EVRI they are domiciled in Spain and the only way to recover my costs would be via the Spanish courts. Instead if required I will be exercising my rights under the Contracts (right of third parties) Act 1999 which will allow me to take action directly with EVRI as I am a direct beneficiary of the arranged contract.

So in short I'm done with Packlink now.

As for EVRI, my email to the CEO was responded to by a member of the "executive office" and the response is pleasant, they are going to carry out an "investigation" into the where abouts of my parcel over the next 72 hours and will update me on their findings once this time has elapsed. So I am expecting to hear on Thursday there is nothing they can do to help me and wash their hands with me.

In anticipation of this I have drafted my letter of claim and will be sending it to EVRI likely Thursday/Friday this week which in essence is the start of legal proceedings.

The recipient that received the incorrect parcel has since been refunded. He has been helpful in weighing and measuring the parcel he received. Crucially it weighs 1.5kg and the box isn't large enough to fit a SONY PS5 in it. I paid for a service for an item which weighed between 7-10kg. So it is clear there has been a mix up.

Also I have sent over 80 items with EVRI/HERMES over the years and this is the first occasion which I have had an issue. Our local EVRI guy is super helpful so I try to avoid tarring all with the same brush. I do understand though that HERMES/EVRI have built a reputation for themselves which is now ringing true. We live and we learn.

It will likely be about a week until the next update.

Dan

The problem here is going to be your contract isn't with Evri, its with packlink. So I would plan for both outcomes from the Evri 'feedback' - as you might be done with packlink because they are in Spain etc, but you can't pick and choose who the contract is when it suits - its officially with Packlink, Evri are fully within their rights to tell you to speak to packlink and ignore you - there is nothing you can do about that if they do - hence the suggestion to ensure you have a route either way.

[crAbb]

Originally Posted by SkyJawa

DPD are defo one of the better ones. The tracking and 1 hour slot work very well.

Evri is only ok as our local guy is pretty good but further down the line who knows! Yodel are useless twats.

FedEx, UPS and DHL are out of touch and stupid expensive.

I believe its very much down to your local courier. DPD have been a disaster for me, on more than one occasion.

[Danj94]

Originally Posted by speedski

The problem here is going to be your contract isn't with Evri, its with packlink. So I would plan for both outcomes from the Evri 'feedback' - as you might be done with packlink because they are in Spain etc, but you can't pick and choose who the contract is when it suits - its officially with Packlink, Evri are fully within their rights to tell you to speak to packlink and ignore you - there is nothing you can do about that if they do - hence the suggestion to ensure you have a route either way.

Disagree, as a direct beneficiary of the contract in place I am within my right to pursue either EVRI or Packlink or both. The Contracts (third parties) Act of 1999 allows this as I explained in my last post. There is a number of examples where this has passed in a court of law where packlink/parcel2go etc haven't been taken to court but EVRI have although it was setup via say Packlink.

I wont be pursuing Packlink in Spain that looks like it could be a bit pricey and not worth the effort. I will be taking action against EVRI as per this and my last posts on this thread.

[speedski]

Originally Posted by Danj94

Disagree, as a direct beneficiary of the contract in place I am within my right to pursue either EVRI or Packlink or both. The Contracts (third parties) Act of 1999 allows this as I explained in my last post. There is a number of examples where this has passed in a court of law where packlink/parcel2go etc haven't been taken to court but EVRI have although it was setup via say Packlink.

I wont be pursuing Packlink in Spain that looks like it could be a bit pricey and not worth the effort. I will be taking action against EVRI as per this and my last posts on this thread.

You can disagree, but the contract is between you and packlink - I am aware of the act you mention - but that doesn't change the contracted parties, it just may allow you to pursue the 3rd party or intermediary, but it doesn't change the contract of the service - in any case to get them to act could take time and court proceedings.

They can, under the contract you agreed to when purchasing the service, push you back to the original contracted route first, before being able to pursue under the third parties act. I would carefully review the terms you agreed to as part of the packink purchase to ensure you aren't going to be sent 'packing' at the early stages.

[planemad]

Do you have the MAC address for the PS5, so can let the police know what IP address is using it.

This can be don’t but I don’t think the police have the appetite for the effort for a low value item.

[335dX]

Originally Posted by planemad

Do you have the MAC address for the PS5, so can let the police know what IP address is using it.

This can be don’t but I don’t think the police have the appetite for the effort for a low value item.

This made me chuckle. Like the Police will do ANYTHING of the sort to track down this PS5 or be worried about some bloke losing out on £400.

Wouldn't it be a great world if this DID happen though?

[335dX]

Just before the Pandemic I sold a Macbook on ebay to a guy in Cornwall. Said Macbook was £3000 worth.

It was sent via Royal Mail and insured for the full amount, yes it cost a fortune to send!

I had a message the following day from the buyer saying he had received the parcel only to find two metal gate hinges and a bag of screws in place of the computer.

Long story short, the box had been cut along the bottom on 1 long side and 1 short allowing entry into the box to remove the contents and replace. Crucially whoever had done this had replaced the items with the exact weight as itemised on the shipping label printed at the PO.

I had photographic evidence of the box before it was sent, (it was a John Lewis box so had no seals underneith, only the top was open.)

All evidence sent to RM for a claim and it was rejected - because the weight was the same of the contents there was no proof I had sent the Macbook!

I called the Police and the guy on the phone believed there was a case, (due to value,) so he sent an officer via appointment to my house. By this time I had received the box back, (thinking they would take it for finger prints,) oh how wrong I was. Within 3 minutes of sitting in my lounge the Police Officer said it's not something we can investigate as we don't have the resources. Shaking with rage I asked the tosser to leave.

I ended up claiming on my house insurance who said they would make a case and claim from RM. All I know is RM were awful to deal with during the claim and case, after speaking with a manager she stood fast and said there's no valid claim. I have never shipped with RM again.

I doubt you will get anywhere with EVRI even if they bother to turn up at court, if it gets that far.

Sounds like a lot of hot air and effort for little gain.

PS the computer remains on the stolen register.

[moonshine]

My wife ordered 2 replacement soda stream CO2 canisters a while back from Soda Stream.
They duly arrived, and we put the unopened box in the cupboard
About 2 months later she opened the box, and the soda stream bottles were missing, and 4 full cans of Camden Town Lager were in it's place.
Box showed evidence of tampering (it had tape over the senders tape with courier branding- can't remember which courier now)
We complained to sodastream. They couldn't believe someone would swap beer for their gas cylinders.
They sent us replacements and said I could keep the beer!! 👍

[Danj94]

Originally Posted by 335dX

Just before the Pandemic I sold a Macbook on ebay to a guy in Cornwall. Said Macbook was £3000 worth.

It was sent via Royal Mail and insured for the full amount, yes it cost a fortune to send!

I had a message the following day from the buyer saying he had received the parcel only to find two metal gate hinges and a bag of screws in place of the computer.

Long story short, the box had been cut along the bottom on 1 long side and 1 short allowing entry into the box to remove the contents and replace. Crucially whoever had done this had replaced the items with the exact weight as itemised on the shipping label printed at the PO.

I had photographic evidence of the box before it was sent, (it was a John Lewis box so had no seals underneith, only the top was open.)

All evidence sent to RM for a claim and it was rejected - because the weight was the same of the contents there was no proof I had sent the Macbook!

I called the Police and the guy on the phone believed there was a case, (due to value,) so he sent an officer via appointment to my house. By this time I had received the box back, (thinking they would take it for finger prints,) oh how wrong I was. Within 3 minutes of sitting in my lounge the Police Officer said it's not something we can investigate as we don't have the resources. Shaking with rage I asked the tosser to leave.

I ended up claiming on my house insurance who said they would make a case and claim from RM. All I know is RM were awful to deal with during the claim and case, after speaking with a manager she stood fast and said there's no valid claim. I have never shipped with RM again.

I doubt you will get anywhere with EVRI even if they bother to turn up at court, if it gets that far.

Sounds like a lot of hot air and effort for little gain.

PS the computer remains on the stolen register.

Hey great shout with the house insurance its something I'd not considered until reading you reply. I will explore the details of my policy depending on excess etc may be something I pursue.

Agree it is a fair bit of faffing about but its more principle then money related for me.

[blau3er]

Feel you on the principle matter! I won't go into specific details, but I took the owner of a well known 'performance' garage to court. Their employee's damaged two brand new alloy wheels and a brake caliper when fitting tyres.

The owner was beyond arrogant and as a result, out of principle, I went all the way to the County Court. Turns out they were as inept at fitting tyres as they were preparing for Court. As a result of the directions hearing, the Judge advised the owner to see sense and settle out of court.

In short, if you feel you have the time and effort - go for it - too many people are too quick to let idiots get away with their actions!