[biomed27]

Originally Posted by kilogram

I don't think that's a correct engineering explanation. The DoF the monoballs allow prevents binding in the suspension, but they absolutely transmit more impulse force directly to the chassis.

With rubber bushings, some of the impulse from suspension motion is consumed in deforming the bushing. This is part of rubber's natural damping properties, and as such some of the kinetic energy from the suspension impulse is dissipated. There is very little deformation in a spherical bearing (only the PTFE liner) to dissipate kinetic energy.

As an experimant, try hitting a piece of rubber with a hammer, then a piece of steel with a film of PTFE on it and see which one transmits more vibration and noise to the surface below.

The monoball is substantially stiffer than a rubber bushing in the direction it matters- the direction it's most heavily loaded. The suspension arm there is a two-force member, and although the bushing allows it to transmit limited moments, the moments involved pale in comparison to the designed load path.

Monoballs are most definitely higher NVH than rubber bushings. If they weren't, BMW would have used them there from the factory. And in the control arm chassis pickup as well. The monoballs used here are an existing part from the rear suspension, and it's cheaper to design the suspension to use existing OTS parts than to design it with a bespoke bushing.

This makes absolute sense from an engineering perspective. More reviews in the VAC set up would be useful.

[1bad14-F30]

Originally Posted by kilogram

I don't think that's a correct engineering explanation. The DoF the monoballs allow prevents binding in the suspension, but they absolutely transmit more impulse force directly to the chassis.

Originally Posted by kilogram

Monoballs are most definitely higher NVH than rubber bushings. If they weren't, BMW would have used them there from the factory.

^^^ 100% ^^^

Definitely upped the NVH on my setup. The trade off is worth it to me.

[AllaVodka]

I have the VAC monoballs, both upper and lower, on my 340i. All I can say is on well paved roads, its amazing… on shitty roads, it can be very annoying. Do you live in a big city or outside? I'd say it really just depends what kind of roads you're driving on often.

[biomed27]

Originally Posted by AllaVodka

I have the VAC monoballs, both upper and lower, on my 340i. All I can say is on well paved roads, its amazing… on shitty roads, it can be annoying. Do you live in a big city or outside? I'd say it really just depends what kind of roads you're driving on often.

Annoying how? Thank you for reaching out

[Happy Odie]

Has anyone installed the monoball bushings and got DSC light blinking during a long sweeping corner? I thought it was the alignment issue but it wasn’t. I still got DSC light blinking. I also didn’t drive fast enough to get any wheel slip or losing the control. Quite surprising to me how I got this issue and I still couldn’t figure it out.

Anyone experienced the same thing?

Thanks!

[Jvac]

Originally Posted by Happy Odie

Has anyone installed the monoball bushings and got DSC light blinking during a long sweeping corner? I thought it was the alignment issue but it wasn’t. I still got DSC light blinking. I also didn’t drive fast enough to get any wheel slip or losing the control. Quite surprising to me how I got this issue and I still couldn’t figure it out.

Anyone experienced the same thing?

Thanks!

No, that doesn't sound right. If this just started after you installed these new parts then I would get the car up on jacks and see if anything is obviously out of place. Maybe a sensor was knocked loose or not reattached during the install? These control arms are dumb mechanical parts. They don't talk to the vehicle systems nor should they be causing wheel slip.

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by johnung

You won't get any added noise, vibration or harshness from the VAC Monoball thrust arms. But as Alohasurftoad alluded to- the driver will get enhanced road feel transmitted to his hands through the steering wheel. Basically it feels the way that a sports sedan should!

After researching the alternatives, I just ordered VAC monoball UCA and LCA for my 2014 328i RWD. Thank you for the information you've provided on this thread and others about this product. It really helped me make the decision to go with VAC.

I've got an m-sport the DHP package that includes adaptive suspension. I've also got Dinan Shockware. It will be interesting to see how the ride quality and NVH changes with this product given my setup.

I've got a great indie that I use. Any idea what the cost of installation I should expect?

[johnung]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

After researching the alternatives, I just ordered VAC monoball UCA and LCA for my 2014 328i RWD. Thank you for the information you've provided on this thread and others about this product. It really helped me make the decision to go with VAC.

I've got an m-sport the DHP package that includes adaptive suspension. I've also got Dinan Shockware. It will be interesting to see how the ride quality and NVH changes with this product given my setup.

I've got a great indie that I use. Any idea what the cost of installation I should expect?

They'll probably charge minimum 2 hours/ maximum 3 hours labor. The control arms should come with nuts on the ball joints. I bought a new nut and bolt for the other end where the monoball bushing mounts to the car and gave them to my local Indy shop. It's a good idea to get a full alignment afterwards too. You may get a cost break on the alignment if the same shop is installing them.

Please post back to let us know your impressions. Photo below of a good test track to try them out. Just mash the gas pedal and go! 😀

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by johnung

They'll probably charge minimum 2 hours/ maximum 3 hours labor. The control arms should come with nuts on the ball joints. I bought a new nut and bolt for the other end where the monoball bushing mounts to the car and gave them to my local Indy shop. It's a good idea to get a full alignment afterwards too. You may get a cost break on the alignment if the same shop is installing them.

Please post back to let us know your impressions. Photo below of a good test track to try them out. Just mash the gas pedal and go! 😀

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely post once I have them installed. I have been driving BMWs non-stop since '88 and while I love the newer models, I really miss the steering feel of the hydraulic systems. I'm totally used to my 3er as is, but when I learned from you and others that monoballs can get some of that feel back, I just simply had to do it.

I'll write up my experience and share a photo of my ride down Lombard St.!

[johnung]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely post once I have them installed. I have been driving BMWs non-stop since '88 and while I love the newer models, I really miss the steering feel of the hydraulic systems. I'm totally used to my 3er as is, but when I learned from you and others that monoballs can get some of that feel back, I just simply had to do it.

I'll write up my experience and share a photo of my ride down Lombard St.!

So many owners of earlier BMWs talk about how awesome the steering was. Another mod that improves the steering on the F30 chassis is a high quality front strut brace.

When the car first turns into a curve, there's some chassis flex that's not always perceptible but it causes a slight delay in steering responsiveness. The strut brace mounts across the top of the shock towers. By eliminating that flex it makes the steering actually feel quicker, more responsive.

This is my favorite German made strut brace. It's high quality and installs in minutes. The crossbar removes in a minute to service the engine. The bolts that hold on the tower brackets are stretch bolts that are not supposed to be constantly removed and reinstalled. So this design eliminates that issue.

https://www.kiesmotorsports.com/prod...8;_ss=r?aff=22

[biomed27]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

Thanks for the advice. I will definitely post once I have them installed. I have been driving BMWs non-stop since '88 and while I love the newer models, I really miss the steering feel of the hydraulic systems. I'm totally used to my 3er as is, but when I learned from you and others that monoballs can get some of that feel back, I just simply had to do it.

I'll write up my experience and share a photo of my ride down Lombard St.!

Any updates?

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by biomed27

Any updates?

I ordered them. Waiting for them to arrive. I'll post an update.

Can't wait to try them out.

[biomed27]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

I ordered them. Waiting for them to arrive. I'll post an update.

Can't wait to try them out.

Curious to see how you like them. Installed strut bar and it made a huge difference

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by biomed27

Curious to see how you like them. Installed strut bar and it made a huge difference

I'm going for both LCA and UCA. My 328i is already really good (to me) with go flat tires, DHP (adaptive suspension) and Dinan Shockware. Tightening up the steering will make it perfect I think.

[Mr. F22]

+1 for VAC monoballs. Have the upper arms and they're one of my favorite mods. Surprisingly, added NVH was less than expected and frankly not that much different from stock arms. Will be adding lower arms after winter.

[Jvac]

I finally installed my camber plates. They added a little noise to the mix but it's not too bad. Just some thrumming type noise from the tires that is only audible at lower speeds. For me, the Vac monoballs made the most dramatic change in harshness and I'm not happy about that, but I love the steering accuracy they provide. I think if I had 18" wheels it would be a bit softer ride, bit I don't recommend anyone installing the Vac parts with 19" wheels on a daily driver unless the roads are very good where they live. Driving over a road reflector during a lane change, for example, it feels like you ran over a cat wearing a flak jacket. If anyone wants to buy mine, they only have a few thousand miles on them. 335 rwd only. I may try stepping down to meyle hd since that's a lot less money than a new set of wheels and tires.

[skier_du]

I get that. But What tire and shock combo are you using? That will also greatly effect the ride quality.
For me the shocks and tires made a bigger difference in harshness than the mono-balls. I had KW V3, camber plates, 18" PS4S tires and both VAC balls and the ride was decent. Not harsh. Just good feedback kind of like my old e90 had. With my 18" track tires, bumps had a little more harness. Especially bumps and cracks that were more squared off.
Now I have B16 and my track tires. Now my ride is slightly harsh. Small bumps are much more sharp. As the nose of the Bilstein shocks is much more firm than theKW. That's the result of the high gas pressure mono-tube shocks. But it is more sporty feeling and ads to the feedback even more. Medium is actually not that bad. Large bumps bottom. But that's the shock problem.

[Jvac]

Originally Posted by skier_du

I get that. But What tire and shock combo are you using? That will also greatly effect the ride quality.
For me the shocks and tires made a bigger difference in harshness than the mono-balls. I had KW V3, camber plates, 18" PS4S tires and both VAC balls and the ride was decent. Not harsh. Just good feedback kind of like my old e90 had. With my 18" track tires, bumps had a little more harness. Especially bumps and cracks that were more squared off.
Now I have B16 and my track tires. Now my ride is slightly harsh. Small bumps are much more sharp. As the nose of the Bilstein shocks is much more firm than theKW. That's the result of the high gas pressure mono-tube shocks. But it is more sporty feeling and ads to the feedback even more. Medium is actually not that bad. Large bumps bottom. But that's the shock problem.

I just switched from stock adaptive suspension to custom tuned bilstein b8 shocks from fatcat motorsports. They are great and my overall handling and ride quality is much improved, but they still don't hide the harshness the Vac parts introduced for me. I have Firestone indy 500 tires. They're not the best, but solid tires. Before, with these same tires and on the stock suspension, things weren't this harsh. It is mainly the monoballs in my case that pound the chassis. I will bet good money that if I swap back to stock tension struts it all goes away. But as I said, I love the steering accuracy. I have the confidence to steer right up close to curbing because I always know exactly where the wheels are going. So Now I just dodge all the bumps like I'm on a slalom course or something. Made a game out of it

[sygazelle]

Originally Posted by johnung

They'll probably charge minimum 2 hours/ maximum 3 hours labor. The control arms should come with nuts on the ball joints. I bought a new nut and bolt for the other end where the monoball bushing mounts to the car and gave them to my local Indy shop. It's a good idea to get a full alignment afterwards too. You may get a cost break on the alignment if the same shop is installing them.

Please post back to let us know your impressions. Photo below of a good test track to try them out. Just mash the gas pedal and go! ��

I had them installed yesterday. Even the BMW Indy that I use was so impressed after his test drive, he told his partner to test drive it too. They were really amazed.

My drive home was so fun. As you have mentioned, this mod pays off with every turn of the steering wheel. I don't know how to describe it in fancy auto talk terms, but it is just so much tighter, more stable, more responsive.\

This morning when I woke up, I just had to try my new mod out on some twisties. It was impressive enough just driving on straight roads from my Indy back to my house. But taking this car with monoballs installed on a proper two lane road really really showed off the steering improvement. It was everything I said before but in addition, the turns were so true, so confidence inspiring, so perfect.

To be honest, I've had my 328 so long that I'd simply gotten used to the electric steering and the absence of the feel that was built into previous generation BMWs. But now with this new upgrade, its like having my old BMWs back again. I can't get the smile off my face!

A couple of other points:

1) I can certainly feel the road better. It is slightly more harsh but not in a bad way. I've got DHP with adaptive suspension. I don't know if standard suspension would feel the same or not.
2) The parts were $1,100 with free shipping.
3) The installation was $540.
4) Spending $1,700 for such an improvement was an easy choice for me. I love the car and plan to keep it for years to come.
5) I purchased the monoball Upper Control Arms and Lower Control Arms from Kies. They are manufactured by VAC but Kies ships for free and the price is the same, so I ordered from Kies Motorsports.

Johnung, thank you your recommendation of the VAC monoballs. Everything you have said about them matches my experience. Got to go now. It's time to drive my "new" car again!

[johnung]

Originally Posted by sygazelle

I had them installed yesterday. Even the BMW Indy that I use was so impressed after his test drive, he told his partner to test drive it too. They were really amazed.

My drive home was so fun. As you have mentioned, this mod pays off with every turn of the steering wheel. I don't know how to describe it in fancy auto talk terms, but it is just so much tighter, more stable, more responsive.\

This morning when I woke up, I just had to try my new mod out on some twisties. It was impressive enough just driving on straight roads from my Indy back to my house. But taking this car with monoballs installed on a proper two lane road really really showed off the steering improvement. It was everything I said before but in addition, the turns were so true, so confidence inspiring, so perfect.

To be honest, I've had my 328 so long that I'd simply gotten used to the electric steering and the absence of the feel that was built into previous generation BMWs. But now with this new upgrade, its like having my old BMWs back again. I can't get the smile off my face!

A couple of other points:

1) I can certainly feel the road better. It is slightly more harsh but not in a bad way. I've got DHP with adaptive suspension. I don't know if standard suspension would feel the same or not.
2) The parts were $1,100 with free shipping.
3) The installation was $540.
4) Spending $1,700 for such an improvement was an easy choice for me. I love the car and plan to keep it for years to come.
5) I purchased the monoball Upper Control Arms and Lower Control Arms from Kies. They are manufactured by VAC but Kies ships for free and the price is the same, so I ordered from Kies Motorsports.

Johnung, thank you your recommendation of the VAC monoballs. Everything you have said about them matches my experience. Got to go now. It's time to drive my "new" car again!

Glad to hear that you like the Kies/VAC monoball front control arms so much. It's definitely in my Top5 must have F30 mods. I have both pairs now but could only afford the Upper Control Arms (also called Tension Struts or Thrust Arms) to start. They make a dramatic difference on their own, and the Lower Control Arm (aka Wishbones) add to it.

I've got standard dampers. The same benefit can be felt from the upgraded front bushings whether the car has standard or Adaptive/EDC dampers.

IMO I wouldn't call their affect Noise Vibration Harshness (NVH) because it's not transmitted to the cabin occupants. It's something that only the driver feels in his hands through the steering wheel. It is that road feel that's absent in the vague stock F30 steering. Road feel that a European sport sedan should have.

Another mod that improves F3x steering is a front strut tower brace. See links below and photo of mine. The brace prevents that momentary chassis flex when the weight shifts as the car enters a turn. So to the driver it feels like the turns are quicker/crisper.

I evaluated many and believe this is the best one. It's important that a brace removes quickly for engine maintenance without removing the bolts on top of the towers which are single use and degrade every time they are removed. This brace removes with two quick bolts.

https://www.kiesmotorsports.com/prod...8;_ss=r?aff=22

Hope this helps!

[jnj2455]

Of those with NVH concerns, is more pronounced in adaptive Sport mode vs. comfort? Or its more or less the same?

[johnung]

Originally Posted by jnj2455

Of those with NVH concerns, is more pronounced in adaptive Sport mode vs. comfort? Or its more or less the same?

Like I said, there is no added NVH to the cabin. It's road feel transmitted to the driver's hands through the steering wheel. It's really only noticeable because it's compared to the complete lack of road feel with the stock bushings.

You can feel the steering tighten up after switching from Comfort to Sport drive mode. But that's not the monoball bushings. It's the electronic steering setup that comes with the car stock. Probably easier to feel the transition now.