[natesi]

I did a search of the forum (can't find much) AND looked in the manual (can't find anything):

Certain times of the year, in WA and OR, tire/snow chains are required to carry when going over the mountain pass, even if not needed -- and even if you have dedicated winter tires.

I'm getting dedicated winter tires, plus I have xDrive, so I'm sure that will be plenty -- but, as I stated, I will still need to carry chains in case I get pulled over or something like that.

If I ever had to actually use the chains though, would I put them on the front or back wheels? I can't find a definitive answer info anywhere.

Since the car is xDrive I was assuming I'd need two sets -- for both the front AND back -- but I was inspecting the car and there's barely any clearance between the front shock and the inside of the front tire. You can't see this visually -- you have to wrap your hand around the top of the front tire (through the wheel). Between the inside sidewall and the shock there's barely a finger's width of space. So I'm skeptical chains would fit on the front at all.

I'm guessing they would go only on the rear. But I'm afraid just rear chains might screw up the AWD differential.

Does anyone know what the answer is?

I'm driving a 2016 328i xDrive.

Thanks!

-Nathan

[goj]

My opinion having been in severe winter weather in both states, AWD and good all season tires is more than enough. I honestly don't think you need both. (Edit I mean both winter tires and chains w/ AWD) I have been in AWD rental cars with all season grand touring tires

[Blubaron79]

Originally Posted by goj

My opinion having been in severe winter weather in both states, AWD and good all season tires is more than enough. I honestly don't think you need both. I have been in AWD rental cars with all season grand touring tires

SO FALSE. All seasons cannot stop or grip at all. I used to run no seasons on my xdrive. Switched to true winter tires 3 winters ago and I'll never go back.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by goj

My opinion having been in severe winter weather in both states, AWD and good all season tires is more than enough. I honestly don't think you need both. I have been in AWD rental cars with all season grand touring tires

With all due respect, worst advice ever.
Coming from Bay area, this might be true, but NOTHING could be further from the truth in true winter conditions. Sure, you can get away with it (I did when I was younger, not as "wise" and with less disposable income), but in general, not a great advice.

In my family, we own both, RWD and AWD vehicles and live in area with tons of snow for 4-5 months a year, so I'm speaking from experience, AWD vehicle does not justify lack of winter ties, all advantage of AWD drivetrain is completely lost if you chose to go this route.

Just the other day, fully snow covered roads, I encountered not one but two xDrive 3 series struggling to move around on what I assume are all season tires (any car would not be able to move at all on summer tires that day, so I'm assuming all seasons), while I was managing perfectly fine with RWD and winter tires.

[lens]

Originally Posted by goj

My opinion having been in severe winter weather in both states, AWD and good all season tires is more than enough. I honestly don't think you need both. I have been in AWD rental cars with all season grand touring tires

If you do this where there's REAL winter (sorry but if you're getting around with all seasons, then the winter you have isn't severe at all.) I can guarantee you'll cause or be in an accident.

Always buy winter tires for winter. If you get barely 5cm per winter season and it doesn't drop below -5C, then maybe you'll get away with all seasons, but if you get a dump of snow per season (100CM+) and it drops below -10C then winters are a must. You really don't want to increase your insurance premium and have your car in the shop because you rear ended someone or went into a ditch just because "All seasons" are enough.

[Gearhog]

If you have to, rear chains only will be fine.

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by Bbb34

With all due respect, worst advice ever.
Coming from Bay area, this might be true, but NOTHING could be further from the truth in true winter conditions. Sure, you can get away with it (I did when I was younger, not as "wise" and with less disposable income), but in general, not a great advice.

In my family, we own both, RWD and AWD vehicles and live in area with tons of snow for 4-5 months a year, so I'm speaking from experience, AWD vehicle does not justify lack of winter ties, all advantage of AWD drivetrain is completely lost if you chose to go this route.

Just the other day, fully snow covered roads, I encountered not one but two xDrive 3 series struggling to move around on what I assume are all season tires (any car would not be able to move at all on summer tires that day, so I'm assuming all seasons), while I was managing perfectly fine with RWD and winter tires.

For the record, I had a fwd hatchback with standard tires all throughout my time in upstate NY and college out in Buffalo. Never had an issue. Other than the one time in winter of 1998 when the snow was almost to the top of my a pillar. Then I skipped a few classes.

That said, after 24 years of driving in snow, dedicated winters are the tits, and I would always recommend them over anything else. At the end of the day though, nothing beats driving slower and with your head on a swivel. I take calls from home now and have to drive through some pretty awful shit no matter what and my xdrive with all seasons does fantastic.

[Billfitz]

Originally Posted by chaungo

If you do this where there's REAL winter (sorry but if you're getting around with all seasons, then the winter you have isn't severe at all.) I can guarantee you'll cause or be in an accident.

Winter in New Hampshire is as real as it gets. My XDrive w/AS works better in snow and ice than any RWD or FWD I ever owned shod with snows. If conditions are so bad that my AS are inadequate I stay home. It's not like I'm a first responder.
But that's not what the OP asked about.

OP, in Washington if you have AWD and AS or snows you don't need to have chains on the tires, but you do need to have a set for one axle on board, in the event that you have to put them on.
http://www.wsp.wa.gov/traveler/traction.htm

Oregon is probably similar.

With XDrive put chains on the rear tires, as the rear wheels are the primary drive mechanism. A set for the fronts as well isn't a bad idea, but chances are if you need them the snow will be too deep for chassis clearance anyway.

Studded winters is another option. Studded winters on AWD meets chain requirements. If I was living in the mountains where there are chain regs that's what I'd use.

[RoundelM3]

OP, your rear wheels are the primary driving wheels, so if you feel the need to chain up, put them there. Putting them on the front would be advisable only in an extreme situation, as the added weight of the chains and their tendency to "flail" at anything above very slow speeds could have a negative effect on steering. Studded tires would be better, but many states won't allow them due to potential road surface damage.

[KGB_123_99]

RWD + winters >>> AWD + all-season...because stopping.

Ideally chains should go on all wheels. If not, then put on rear as that is where most of your torque split goes.

[RedKloud]

OP: I don't think chains are required for cars if they have full winters on with the snow flake symbol.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by KGB_123_99

RWD + winters >>> AWD + all-season...because stopping.

Very true, but it's not "just stopping" it's lateral grip and recovery from loosing it as well. All season tire might be fine on xDrive, but so could unprotected one night stand with complete stranger, but....you know, you're taking a chance either way.

With winter tires xDrive is incredible on snow. Once you try the same car on snow covered or icy roads, with all seasons and winter tires, it's beyond me how anyone can even argue this.

Sorry OP, don't mean to derail the thread further, but I think general agreement is if you have to go with chains, rear wheels first.

[natesi]

Thanks for all the feedback guys.

I just sent off for 1 set of rear chains. Like I said, I don't think the fronts really have the clearance between the inner tire and shock -- not much more than a finger's width of space is available. Mostly I was just worried about the AWD differential due to asymmetric diameters between the front and rear -- once the chains are on only one axle.

That being said, I doubt I'll ever have to use the chains -- as I'll be getting Pirelli Sottozeo 3 winter tires on next week. But I didn't want to do anything that would mess up the car, in case I ever do need to use them.

Thanks all,

-Nathan

[goj]

Originally Posted by chaungo

If you do this where there's REAL winter (sorry but if you're getting around with all seasons, then the winter you have isn't severe at all.) I can guarantee you'll cause or be in an accident.

Always buy winter tires for winter. If you get barely 5cm per winter season and it doesn't drop below -5C, then maybe you'll get away with all seasons, but if you get a dump of snow per season (100CM+) and it drops below -10C then winters are a must. You really don't want to increase your insurance premium and have your car in the shop because you rear ended someone or went into a ditch just because "All seasons" are enough.

Crossing passes and such in Washington and Oregon, all-seasons and chains with AWD or AWD and snow tires will be enough. That is my point, somehow I haven't been in or caused an accident with a suburban or 4 runner in "real" winter road trips

[goj]

Originally Posted by Blubaron79

SO FALSE. All seasons cannot stop or grip at all. I used to run no seasons on my xdrive. Switched to true winter tires 3 winters ago and I'll never go back.

On trips in both states I have been fine. Which is the application the OP is asking about. To be clear. One does not need Winter tires AND chains. I was unclear but that's my point

[Jimmy775]

Originally Posted by Gearhog

If you have to, rear chains only will be fine.

Correct answer. But I've never bothered buying chains for my AWD sedans... spend the money on dedicated snow tires instead. Braking performance and traction is significantly improved over A/S tires. Snow tires will last several seasons if you install in Dec and remove in Apr.

[lens]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

Winter in New Hampshire is as real as it gets. My XDrive w/AS works better in snow and ice than any RWD or FWD I ever owned shod with snows. If conditions are so bad that my AS are inadequate I stay home. It's not like I'm a first responder.
But that's not what the OP asked about.

OP, in Washington if you have AWD and AS or snows you don't need to have chains on the tires, but you do need to have a set for one axle on board, in the event that you have to put them on.
http://www.wsp.wa.gov/traveler/traction.htm

Oregon is probably similar.

With XDrive put chains on the rear tires, as the rear wheels are the primary drive mechanism. A set for the fronts as well isn't a bad idea, but chances are if you need them the snow will be too deep for chassis clearance anyway.

Studded winters is another option. Studded winters on AWD meets chain requirements. If I was living in the mountains where there are chain regs that's what I'd use.

It's as I said, when you actually experience real winter, you will never have the mindset that AWD+A/S will be enough. You might not have been in a accident yet but not everyone has the same driving skills. Which is why winter tires are always recommended over A/S, the braking distance is huge between the two. You can drive slow but once you hit hills or have someone cut you off and slam the brakes on you, it helps tremendously having winter tires over A/S.

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

My XDrive w/AS works better in snow and ice than any RWD or FWD I ever owned shod with snows.

No way, absolutely no way, maybe you're forgotten how other two feel with winter tires.

I know you ski, I know you live in area with lots of snow, but what you're saying is absolutely not true, not in theory, not in real life.

When I visit Jay Peak this winter we can meet up for a day of skiing, maybe a pint of beer after , then we'll compare, hopefully it's snow covered roads that day . You let me know which one you want me to bring, AWD or RWD both with great winter tires, and we'll compare.

[Billfitz]

Originally Posted by chaungo

It's as I said, when you actually experience real winter

I've driven in 51 'real' winters so far, 25 of them as manager of a mountainside ski shop, where I had to open the doors every morning, no matter what. I've driven more miles through snow in hilly terrain than many plow drivers.

[ErkanTR16]

Here we go again Tires and xDrive.

[Beek]

One of many video's @ Tirerack.com which will pretty much answer any winter tire question you may have. OP just my opinion but under no circumstances would I put chains on my BMW. If conditions are that bad I would park it and wait.
http://www.tirerack.com/videos/index...454&tab=Winter

[Bbb34]

Originally Posted by Erkan_340i

Here we go again Tires and xDrive.

Nothing wrong with that in my opinion.

As long as there's people out there claiming that xDrive cancels need for winter tires, threads like these might help someone and save them lots of trouble easily avoided otherwise.