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      04-20-2015, 10:54 AM   #89
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Originally Posted by tomes View Post
Just to clarify - I'm a college student who has been dreaming about Bimmer for many years. Now, working part time, allows me to make my dreams come true. Of course, I'd rather get 335i. But it makes no sense to spend all the money you make on a car. I'm also considering getting the CPO 328i E90.. The last 3er with naturally aspirated inline 6 and hydraulic power steering. The good aspect about getting a new car is the free maintenance, I know it doesn't cover everything but at least something. Maybe you guys can give me an advice?
"Dreaming about Bimmer for many years" is when you are like me, and get your first BMW when you are 45. You are working part time and in the market for a brand new car? Save yourself future financial pain, and wait until you have true financial stability before you do this.

That's my advice to you.
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      04-20-2015, 10:57 AM   #90
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Hmmm...I posted my prior reply before I saw the wicked turn this thread took. Looks like the OP got the hell outta here quick!
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      04-20-2015, 11:04 AM   #91
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Fan favorite to who? Its a turd. Complete waste of money. Be better off with a Honda or Toyota if you're gonna skimp on options. Thats for the paupers who are buying for the badge. I've said it before and I stand by it.
This is a false statement. I have a bare-bones 320i with auto as a company car. It has one option - the sport package. MSRP was 34,900 or so IIRC. I objectively drove everything in this price range and made the decision based on fit and finish, driving and road feel. Honda and Toyota can't compare. They're ridiculously reliable, but in terms of build quality and driving experience you are dead wrong. Honda/Acura and Toyota/Lexus intentionally do not build in the quality that BMW does.
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      04-20-2015, 11:15 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by sixteenpushrods View Post
This is a false statement. I have a bare-bones 320i with auto as a company car. It has one option - the sport package. MSRP was 34,900 or so IIRC. I objectively drove everything in this price range and made the decision based on fit and finish, driving and road feel. Honda and Toyota can't compare. They're ridiculously reliable, but in terms of build quality and driving experience you are dead wrong. Honda/Acura and Toyota/Lexus intentionally do not build in the quality that BMW does.
Not to mention that a $35k MSRP 320i is about the same price to lease as a $25k MSRP Accord/Camry, while offering a much better powertrain and handling. The vehicles are comparably-equipped at those price points also; just because a $35k 320i is barebones compared to a $60k 335i doesn't mean that it's barebones compared to an Accord Sport.

I know because I set out to lease a somewhat-sporty family sedan (Accord Sport or Mazda6 w/6MT). The 320i offered a much better lease proposition. If you are buying and driving into the ground, sure, get a Japanese family sedan. But you can't beat a 320i Sport for ~$300/month on a lease.
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      04-20-2015, 11:18 AM   #93
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Plus if your like me and afraid of owning one of these cars outside warrantee, the 320i seems like a much more reasonable proposition in the long run. Less stuff to go wrong.
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      04-20-2015, 12:41 PM   #94
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You're very smart to try to minimize your spending until you're firmly on your feet. I actually agree that the GTI is a pretty good alternative, but solid residuals make BMWs a very attractive lease candidate. Your BEST bet is to simply grab one of the subsidized specials when they pop up. They're pretty tough to beat.

Also, as an aside, don't get too excited about the included "maintenance" coverage. At the end of the day the maintenance you'll actually receive won't amount to much more than a few hundred dollars at most. Especially if you're taking a 36 month lease (usually most attractive).
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      04-20-2015, 01:17 PM   #95
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Originally Posted by BavarianFanatic View Post
At the end of the day the maintenance you'll actually receive won't amount to much more than a few hundred dollars at most. Especially if you're taking a 36 month lease (usually most attractive).
Depending on your driving style I would argue its worth alot more.

Consider the following items that are included in a typical 3 year ownership w/aggressive driving style:

- All 4 Brakes, BMW Service = $1,500
- Oil Change 3x $150 = $450
- Wiper Blades 3x $60 = $180
- Engine Air Filter 3x $70 = $210
- Cabin Air Filter 3x $70 = $210
- O2 Sensors (maybe) = $350
- Belt Replacement (maybe) = $250
===========================
USD Value is around ===> $3,150

Piece of mind that you only need tires for 3 years.. $$ PRICELESS $$

p.s. I know that most of you wouldn't consider spending $70 for an air filter or $150 for an oil change, yet this is what BMW feels is fair pricing in my area.
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      04-20-2015, 01:40 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by wakebord99 View Post
Depending on your driving style I would argue its worth alot more.

Consider the following items that are included in a typical 3 year ownership w/aggressive driving style:

- All 4 Brakes, BMW Service = $1,500
- Oil Change 3x $150 = $450
- Wiper Blades 3x $60 = $180
- Engine Air Filter 3x $70 = $210
- Cabin Air Filter 3x $70 = $210
- O2 Sensors (maybe) = $350
- Belt Replacement (maybe) = $250
===========================
USD Value is around ===> $3,150

Piece of mind that you only need tires for 3 years.. $$ PRICELESS $$

p.s. I know that most of you wouldn't consider spending $70 for an air filter or $150 for an oil change, yet this is what BMW feels is fair pricing in my area.
I did my own cabin filter for like $15 or so.
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      04-20-2015, 01:46 PM   #97
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I wouldn't pay any of the prices i had listed above, but that doesn't prevent BMW from charging those prices if you want "Genuine BMW Service and Parts"

Heck my Mazda service costs are out of control if you go to the dealer.
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      04-20-2015, 01:53 PM   #98
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I assume you'll be the first in line for the self-driving cars? After all, "manual" driving will then be "antiquated" and "obsolete". And virtual reality sexual intercourse when it makes "manual" sex obsolete?

More technologically advanced doesn't necessarily equate to better or more fun. I have more fun driving manual, and will give my money to automakers that sell me what I want. The U.S. market for MT-equipped vehicles is roughly $2billion/yr, and this number has stayed relatively constant (inflation-adjusted) for over a decade. Why would every automaker decide they don't want a piece of this mostly inelastic market? Their shareholders would kill them if they left this $ on the table.

Other people can buy and drive whatever they want, and I won't devote a second of my time worrying about their choices.
Oh c'mon. It would be fun to have the car drive itself. Then you can launch a game of GTO.
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      04-20-2015, 02:05 PM   #99
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Originally Posted by the_phew View Post
Not to mention that a $35k MSRP 320i is about the same price to lease as a $25k MSRP Accord/Camry, while offering a much better powertrain and handling. The vehicles are comparably-equipped at those price points also; just because a $35k 320i is barebones compared to a $60k 335i doesn't mean that it's barebones compared to an Accord Sport.
Nonsense. A lease on a $25K Honda Accord is roughly $1700 drive-off and $215/mo (including CA sales tax). Actually...even less than that, given those are exact figures for a $27K 2014 Accord. I know this because this is the car I got for my housekeeper.
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      04-20-2015, 02:59 PM   #100
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Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
Nonsense. A lease on a $25K Honda Accord is roughly $1700 drive-off and $215/mo (including CA sales tax). Actually...even less than that, given those are exact figures for a $27K 2014 Accord. I know this because this is the car I got for my housekeeper.
Best pre-tax/nothing down Accord Sport lease deal on the Edmunds thread is $232/month. The best "Jalopnik Edition" 320i leases are in the neighborhood of $270/month. That's only a bit more than $1/day difference; if that difference is a hardship for someone, they probably shouldn't be leasing ANY new car.
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      04-20-2015, 03:27 PM   #101
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Originally Posted by the_phew View Post
Best pre-tax/nothing down Accord Sport lease deal on the Edmunds thread is $232/month. The best "Jalopnik Edition" 320i leases are in the neighborhood of $270/month. That's only a bit more than $1/day difference; if that difference is a hardship for someone, they probably shouldn't be leasing ANY new car.
Your numbers are a little off, but regardless...a "Jalopnik edition" 320i is as barebones as it gets compared to an Accord. You can not buy an Accord (or Civic, for that matter) without Bluetooth audio and a reverse camera. Additionally, the Accord I got her has more HP, leather, heated seats, lane-departure, an alarm (LOL...not even standard on higher BMWs), navigation, etc. Never cared to drive a 320i, but I would imagine a well appointed Accord is also significantly quieter and more comfortable, too.

I wasn't going to give her in a stripped down, bottom-of-the-line BMW just because it's a BMW. It's a better car in nearly every way. Ok, so it won't "feel" as good to drive for an enthusiast compared to a 320i. Big deal...it's still not saying much.
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      04-20-2015, 05:30 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
Your numbers are a little off, but regardless...a "Jalopnik edition" 320i is as barebones as it gets compared to an Accord. You can not buy an Accord (or Civic, for that matter) without Bluetooth audio and a reverse camera. Additionally, the Accord I got her has more HP, leather, heated seats, lane-departure, an alarm (LOL...not even standard on higher BMWs), navigation, etc. Never cared to drive a 320i, but I would imagine a well appointed Accord is also significantly quieter and more comfortable, too.

I wasn't going to give her in a stripped down, bottom-of-the-line BMW just because it's a BMW. It's a better car in nearly every way. Ok, so it won't "feel" as good to drive for an enthusiast compared to a 320i. Big deal...it's still not saying much.
But then you have to tell people you drive a honda.

In all seriousness, bluetooth audio and a backup camera are really options that sway you to choose a honda over a BMW? Also, more HP doesn't always equate to better performance.
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      04-20-2015, 05:57 PM   #103
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Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
Your numbers are a little off, but regardless...a "Jalopnik edition" 320i is as barebones as it gets compared to an Accord. You can not buy an Accord (or Civic, for that matter) without Bluetooth audio and a reverse camera. Additionally, the Accord I got her has more HP, leather, heated seats, lane-departure, an alarm (LOL...not even standard on higher BMWs), navigation, etc. Never cared to drive a 320i, but I would imagine a well appointed Accord is also significantly quieter and more comfortable, too.

I wasn't going to give her in a stripped down, bottom-of-the-line BMW just because it's a BMW. It's a better car in nearly every way. Ok, so it won't "feel" as good to drive for an enthusiast compared to a 320i. Big deal...it's still not saying much.
This is where we get into the different audiences/demographics. I doubt your housekeeper is interested in the engine and handling characteristics that make a BMW superior to a Honda. Similar to a family friend we just got a '15 Camry SE for. $25k sticker, leased at $211/mo incl MA taxes and gap insurance w/ $1,400 out of pocket. She wouldn't know if she was driving a rwd car or if it were fwd. The people who generally buy an Accord or Camry want the Bluetooth, backup camera, sometimes nav, etc. They want a comfortable car to get in and drive point A to point B. Therefore these comparisons to a 320 make no sense.
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      04-20-2015, 05:58 PM   #104
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But then you have to tell people you drive a honda.

In all seriousness, bluetooth audio and a backup camera are really options that sway you to choose a honda over a BMW? Also, more HP doesn't always equate to better performance.
Were Bluetooth and reverse-camera the only options I mentioned, or did you just stop reading there? Did you miss how I mentioned "you can not buy an Accord (or Civic, for that matter) without..." right before that, meaning they are standard features on even the lowest trim-level of an economy car. Shit, my $60K BMW doesn't have a reverse-camera.

But, yes...those features did sway me to chose the Honda instead of BMW for her. And the leather. And the heated seats. And the navigation system. And the audio hard-drive. And the collision warning. And lane departure monitoring. And an alarm. And all the other features, as useless as they may all be to me personally, which are not available on a BMW for $34-35K which are on a much cheaper Honda.

LOL. The fact that this is even a comparison speaks volumes. What does your housekeeper drive?
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      04-20-2015, 06:12 PM   #105
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But then you have to tell people you drive a honda.
I rather tell people i drive a Honda. I feel like a douche-bag every time i say i drive a BMW, like i immediately need to justify it by saying "I got it so i can go to the track in the weekends, and AWD / Family Safety" so that i don't come across looking like.. well a douche-bag.

When you say you drive a new Honda, most normal people will think your a smart person who wants a reliable car, but like's it be a little sporty in your driving habits.

I had a base Accord LX twice in the last decade. They drive fantastic. <<ready for this>> Better than a BMW on rough roads, highway cruising, and when my wife is with me <<Come on..>> but the BMW is certainly better balanced in the corners.

If i could buy a 50/50 Balanced Accord, around 240 hp, AWD or RWD, and some semblance of an exhaust note.. I would jump on it immediately.
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      04-20-2015, 06:22 PM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
Were Bluetooth and reverse-camera the only options I mentioned, or did you just stop reading there? Did you miss how I mentioned "you can not buy an Accord (or Civic, for that matter) without..." right before that, meaning they are standard features on even the lowest trim-level of an economy car. Shit, my $60K BMW doesn't have a reverse-camera.

But, yes...those features did sway me to chose the Honda instead of BMW for her. And the leather. And the heated seats. And the navigation system. And the audio hard-drive. And the collision warning. And lane departure monitoring. And an alarm. And all the other features, as useless as they may all be to me personally, which are not available on a BMW for $34-35K which are on a much cheaper Honda.

LOL. The fact that this is even a comparison speaks volumes. What does your housekeeper drive?
My housekeeper drives a chevy silverado actually.
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      04-20-2015, 06:26 PM   #107
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Originally Posted by FC4 View Post
Nonsense. A lease on a $25K Honda Accord is roughly $1700 drive-off and $215/mo (including CA sales tax). Actually...even less than that, given those are exact figures for a $27K 2014 Accord. I know this because this is the car I got for my housekeeper.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tyler20c View Post
My housekeeper drives a chevy silverado actually.
Let's start a new thread "What does your housekeeper drive?"

Disclaimer, I don't have a housekeeper. Oh wait, do wives count?
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      04-20-2015, 06:49 PM   #108
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In all seriousness, bluetooth audio and a backup camera are really options that sway you to choose a honda over a BMW?
No--and that's how BMW (and other entry lux models) know they can get away with making features optional that would come standard in a Civic.
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      04-20-2015, 06:57 PM   #109
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Originally Posted by wakebord99 View Post
If i could buy a 50/50 Balanced Accord, around 240 hp, AWD or RWD, and some semblance of an exhaust note.. I would jump on it immediately.
Don't you think there's a reason why there's no RWD/AWD, 50/50 balanced, sports sedan offering from non-luxury brands out there? If VW, Honda, Ford, Toyota, and especially, Nissan, could produce one, and sell it for less than Audi, BMW, MB, Lexus, Infiniti--don't you think they would do it? Sure--some of those makes don't want to canibalize sales from their lux sibling brand, but if it could be produced at a cost to undercut lux makes, someone would make one. And I'd buy it too.
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      04-20-2015, 07:05 PM   #110
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