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BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > B58 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > Turbo Reliability; Pure, VTT, Bigboost, Doc Racing
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      11-02-2020, 02:17 PM   #1
TheFanatic
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Turbo Reliability; Pure, VTT, Bigboost, Doc Racing

I want to start a thread talking about the long term reliability of the more popular brand of turbos that we use now that some of these have been in use for a couple years.

Doing the research has shown mixed results for various brands. (obviously subjective and not to be taken as fact)

Pure seems to be the most reliable out of the Big three initially with the pure 800 but I've seen my fair share of threads that shown problems. This is the second cheapest on my list.

Big Boost started out with problems like most new products usually do but otherwise has improved since than. Their stage 3 is the second most expensive on my list.

VTT GC/GC+ The n54 guys seem to hate this brand but I haven't heard too many problems from the b58 community yet. The GC+ seems to be more reliable than the standard GC. The price point of the GC+ is excellent and the cheapest on my list

Doc Racing being new to the B58 scene is by far the most expensive of the turbo options with the stage 2 (out of 4) coming in at nearly $6k that being said it is a radically different design with the top mount turbo and using Borg Warner turbos means that they are incredibly durable and strong. Obviously as more people start using this setup we will find out if that's true.


So anyways I want to open up discourse about the long term use of these various turbos that you are using or have used. There is an abundance of initial quality threads on this forum and having the long term use in one thread should make for easy research for those looking to get into the game for years to come and answer any questions they may have.

What turbo do you use? What supporting mods do you have? Do you have dyno numbers for you setup to show what level of power you're driving with? How many miles have you had this setup for? What type for driving does is normally see? How has the turbo performed in terms of durability? Any issues?

This isn't a list of questions that needs to be adhered to just suggestions to keep the conversation relevant/going.

Link to the many turbo options that we have in case anyone needs it.

https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1776083

Last edited by TheFanatic; 11-30-2020 at 12:25 PM..
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      11-02-2020, 02:23 PM   #2
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I'm keenly interested in the Vargas Turbo Technologies GC+ myself seeming the unbeatable price it can be bought from. If it proves to be just as reliable than what an awesome deal.
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      11-02-2020, 04:37 PM   #3
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I have had the GC turbo for 5 months. So far so good. I knew about the n54 situation, but I still took the risk. They are local to me and I had them install it ($2250 cash for turbo + install, it was on sale). Couldn't pass on this deal and I'd rather not get the Pure800 and have a shop install it incorrectly.
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      11-02-2020, 06:44 PM   #4
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The car drove 35000 km on GC. No problem at all.
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      11-02-2020, 09:58 PM   #5
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Tons in the field on a variety of platforms with very few issues across the board. We had a N54 turbine debacle back in 2017ish timeframe that bit us pretty good, but we sucked it up, learned from it and never looked back. N54 wise our turbos hold or have held records in pretty much every performance category, S55 we've now got 5 stock motor cars running GC's in the 9's, B58 is just getting rolling compared to the other BMW platforms but feedback thus far has been fantastic. I know you're looking for more third party feedback, but we're always happy to help with more info, or to make a decision on which turbo(s) are best for you. Feel free to shoot an email or PM.

Chris
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      11-03-2020, 02:01 AM   #6
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I am planning to put GC + on the stock engine in 2021. And go low 10s to 1/4 and low 5s to 100/200.
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      11-03-2020, 08:59 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris@VargasTurboTech View Post
Tons in the field on a variety of platforms with very few issues across the board. We had a N54 turbine debacle back in 2017ish timeframe that bit us pretty good, but we sucked it up, learned from it and never looked back. N54 wise our turbos hold or have held records in pretty much every performance category, S55 we've now got 5 stock motor cars running GC's in the 9's, B58 is just getting rolling compared to the other BMW platforms but feedback thus far has been fantastic. I know you're looking for more third party feedback, but we're always happy to help with more info, or to make a decision on which turbo(s) are best for you. Feel free to shoot an email or PM.

Chris
Yeah I've seen nothing but good things from the B58 platform. Like any brand they have ups and downs but whats important to me is improvement. That and the N54 isn't known for turbo durability in the first place. So far I'm leaning to the GC+ but a bigger hpfp comes first.
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      11-03-2020, 09:02 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jay5k View Post
I have had the GC turbo for 5 months. So far so good. I knew about the n54 situation, but I still took the risk. They are local to me and I had them install it ($2250 cash for turbo + install, it was on sale). Couldn't pass on this deal and I'd rather not get the Pure800 and have a shop install it incorrectly.
What type of driving do you normally do? Is it mostly city or highway. Regular pulls on it or standard commuter? Also what a deal!
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      11-03-2020, 12:54 PM   #9
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We sell a few Vargas, Pure B58 kits a month. Both are very reliable on this platform
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      11-03-2020, 02:15 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFanatic View Post
What type of driving do you normally do? Is it mostly city or highway. Regular pulls on it or standard commuter? Also what a deal!
I work from home. I do spirited driving/pulls/WOT daily. I run thick oil (5w-40) and let the car idle for a couple minutes before shutting it off.
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      11-03-2020, 03:39 PM   #11
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I do spirited driving/pulls/WOT daily.
My kind of man! Glad to see it's holding up as well
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      11-05-2020, 09:18 AM   #12
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They are all reliable in terms that they aren't breaking left and right. The main things that should contribute to your choice is:

1. Cost
2. Driveability
3. Power Potential
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      11-05-2020, 04:20 PM   #13
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How does the GC and Pure 800 compare in spool times?

Is the TU HPFP sufficient enough to run both on 93?
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      11-05-2020, 07:23 PM   #14
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TU E30 = 550whp
TU E20 + WMI = 600whp.
Dorch 2 E30 + WMI = 630whp
Turbo VTT GC
24/25psi, 14 timing
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      11-06-2020, 11:07 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kern417 View Post
They are all reliable in terms that they aren't breaking left and right. The main things that should contribute to your choice is:

1. Cost
2. Driveability
3. Power Potential
Part of reliability in my mind also includes oil blow by from the seals, heat soak related problems, bearing wear, and performance over time. Lower quality will start leaking oil sooner, have more play in the shaft, lose boost on high temps etc. although it still works, I would consider that as a component failure. I'm sure we're on the same page, just thought I would clarify for those who arnt.


Good things on your list to keep in mind too.
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      11-06-2020, 11:12 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fsugatorbait2 View Post
How does the GC and Pure 800 compare in spool times?

Is the TU HPFP sufficient enough to run both on 93?
The spool times between the two should be similar because they both use the stock exhaust housing.

The TU HPFP I believe can support both turbos on 93, but start running out of fuel once meth is added or ethanol is used if I remember correctly. Don't quote me on it though, I'm running the Dorch stage 2 and don't know the specs on the TU pump all that well. Someone who is running that setup care to add?
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      11-09-2020, 02:25 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheFanatic View Post
Part of reliability in my mind also includes oil blow by from the seals, heat soak related problems, bearing wear, and performance over time. Lower quality will start leaking oil sooner, have more play in the shaft, lose boost on high temps etc. although it still works, I would consider that as a component failure. I'm sure we're on the same page, just thought I would clarify for those who arnt.


Good things on your list to keep in mind too.
Just saying that no one has blown an aftermarket Pure800 or Vargas GC yet, whether it's a catastrophic failure or just smoking. At least no one that has posted publicly. There was one GC+ blown but he was pushing it to the limit (35+psi).
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      11-10-2020, 07:53 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kern417 View Post
Just saying that no one has blown an aftermarket Pure800 or Vargas GC yet, whether it's a catastrophic failure or just smoking. At least no one that has posted publicly. There was one GC+ blown but he was pushing it to the limit (35+psi).
Ah ok. 35psi out of a GC+! dude had to be pretty high in HP or had a catastrophic failure lol
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      11-10-2020, 07:43 PM   #19
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The working pressure when driving on the road with these turbines is 22 / 24psi. At 25 / 27psi races. At such a pressure, they will have nothing, especially since these loads are short-term.
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      11-11-2020, 10:33 PM   #20
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I just got my stage 4 big boost kit installed and if your looking for a mental ride I suggest it it sounds so good as well
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      11-20-2020, 11:38 AM   #21
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+1 for Pure800. I've been enjoying mine since this spring and have nothing but positive things to say about the experience. Very comfortable daily; no issues with turbo lag in any normal driving situations. Extremely powerful when you get into boost.
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      11-25-2020, 09:12 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kern417 View Post
Just saying that no one has blown an aftermarket Pure800 or Vargas GC yet, whether it's a catastrophic failure or just smoking. At least no one that has posted publicly. There was one GC+ blown but he was pushing it to the limit (35+psi).
Many people do not understand how we test things. That one GC+ unit was shipped out as a TEST unit. We tell, and told this tester, PUSH it until it breaks. He asked how far as I said as far as you can. Paul was pushing more than 40PSI on the turbo. THIS is how you find the limits of things, you push them well past what they are designed to run, and see what fails. We got the unit back, inspected it, and it was exactly as we assumed, Overspeed, and thrust failure from simply pushing it way past its surge line, and RPM limit. Now we know where to set the boost recommendation for the unit. The tester was sent another unit at no cost and was told to keep it under 35psi. This is all part of the story not being told, as people do not understand what it actually means to test something to failure.
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