[classyfast]

Just a few thoughts on a loaner I have today and most likely tomorrow. FYI: this is not a critique in my dealership or anything like that just a reflective look at the insane and absurd pricing bmw has on a basic ass 3 series that lacks everything I've learned to love about bimmers over my 17 combined years of ownership.

Some of my past cars: e36m, e46m, e92 pre-lci 335, e90 lci 335, f25 x3, e92 LCi msport 335, e92 M3, current f48 X1 and f30 335 msport. Decent history with bmw, a few Infiniti's and and an Audi S4 sprinkled in there too!

Loaner car is a 2018 330xdrive non m-sport (which looks terrible) plus the shitty NAV! I was utterly shocked to shit when I saw the sticker in the trunk! Lol how the hell is this car $47,695? I can't understand how somebody would actually shell that out when there are literally tons of "better" cars that can be had in that price range for far less. Everything in the car screams cheap and mundane. It's crazy.

It is worth mentioning my f30 is an msport with EDC, MPPK, MPE, brembos and a bunch of mperf parts so I am spoiled and lucky to have my car spec'd out as it is, but holy shit 50k for this basic ass 330 with very few options is completely insane. The loaner feels like a Toyota Corolla, hell the new Camry is spec'd better and is more comfortable than this car! Steering, road feel, fun to drive? Lol. Hell no. That is long gone for BMW, this is truly a sad day for me!

Then to top it all off my Sales guy and SA we're talking about how bmw will eliminate all manual trannny productions within 3 years! Lol. Damn it actually does get worse.

That is all

[tigger_643]

As a reviewer mentioned in a video I watched recently, you can get heated/cooled seats, power seats, leather, navigation, backup cameras and lots of features today in a Kia, which a few years ago were only available in high-end brands/models. So the older manufacturers, like BMW and Mercedes, define luxury by their heritage. I guess that's what you're paying for when you shell out $48k. And BMW is shamelessly embracing it by offering so many models (don't even get started on the X4) simply for marketing, while erasing what some enthusiasts hold on to them for - features like the manual transmission.

[vooonoo]

Least it has LED head lights and fogs standard, oh and a back up camera... took you long enough to include that BMW.... come on man that thing isn't bone stock, it has heated seats, a heated steering wheel, blind spot detection and comfort access! /s

You would think all that would be standard when you're spending 50k for a car

Really though that's insane, that's why people wait for them to be returned leases and buy them for 16k

Also post a pic let's see how ugly that bumper really is

[jmg]

I had the 328i, the 340i and now an F80 M3. Driving the 320i and the 330i loaners, I find them kind of boring in stock trim, but that's mostly the steering and suspension. If they returned to form as driver's cars, the $47k would be fine. I find the non-M Sport good looking enough, the interior is fine actually, but it's 5 years old so it could use a refresh. I'm not sure what happened between my 328i and the current F30, but the seats don't feel as comfortable. The side bolsters are too low, the leather feels rubbery... and don't get me started on the convertible seats. They are horribly uncomfortable to me, although I like the neck vent design.

[bimmer456]

Buy refurbished and get it half price.

[flyguy27]

I agree they are expensive for what you get. Many will argue to justify it. Branding is such a powerful thing.

[Humdizzle]

$50k for a 4 cylinder. what a world we live in.

[chiefneil]

Prices seem high now mostly because the competition has caught up. Back in 1995 IIRC I paid 32.5k for a 325i. Options were sport, premium, auto. Those were probably *all* the options offered at the time

Anyway that E36 had 189 hp, 225/50 16” square setup wheels, and halogens. Adjusted for inflation that 32.5k today is 54k! So honestly a well-equipped 330i is in the same ballpark as that E36 325i that would seem pretty primitive today.

The difference today is that the F30 is swimming in a sea of very competitive cars. That E36 at the time had practically no features other than one huge, ginormous one - it was the only game in town for somebody wanting a compact sport sedan. Now pretty much every car on the road has a decent suspension, decent reliability, and decent features. And specifically in the sport sedan market there’s stiff competition while at the same time BMW has shifted away from what made previous 3-series models such “must-have” cars, so the compelling pro-BMW argument isn’t nearly as compelling as it used to be.

[metallicpea]

Originally Posted by chiefneil

Prices seem high now mostly because the competition has caught up. Back in 1995 IIRC I paid 32.5k for a 325i. Options were sport, premium, auto. Those were probably *all* the options offered at the time

Anyway that E36 had 189 hp, 225/50 16” square setup wheels, and halogens. Adjusted for inflation that 32.5k today is 54k! So honestly a well-equipped 330i is in the same ballpark as that E36 325i that would seem pretty primitive today.

The difference today is that the F30 is swimming in a sea of very competitive cars. That E36 at the time had practically no features other than one huge, ginormous one - it was the only game in town for somebody wanting a compact sport sedan. Now pretty much every car on the road has a decent suspension, decent reliability, and decent features. And specifically in the sport sedan market there’s stiff competition while at the same time BMW has shifted away from what made previous 3-series models such “must-have” cars, so the compelling pro-BMW argument isn’t nearly as compelling as it used to be.

I paid 32.5k for my 325i in 2001. Few options, but all the important ones. Sport package and such. But most importantly suspension and steering were great - better than all sedans then and better than the F30 now. So it had some value there. And the straight six, although not high HP, pulled ok at all speeds. I got 27 mpg cruising at 80 mph. Oh and the build quality was far superior to the norm in 2001.

Now they still charge the premium, but offer an average car.

[nickf30]

Few points:
1) F30 is at the end of its product cycle

2) Dealer/BMW are giving higher % discount / incentive. Very few people are paying MSRP and 80+% of first owners are leasing.

3) F30 was designed to take the sales crown back from Previous Gen C-class and it did (E9x was outsold by C-class). It is the ultimate sales machine first driving machine second.

4) You can find many SUVs/Cars selling at 40-50k range at Toyota or Honda these days.

5) During F30 product cycle many non sporty luxury car buyers are moving onto the crossover / electric segment and the trend continue (X/i series). This will give G20 a chance to be more driver focus again.

[metallicpea]

Originally Posted by nickf30

Few points:
1) F30 is at the end of its product cycle

2) Dealer/BMW are giving higher % discount / incentive. Very few people are paying MSRP and 80+% of first owners are leasing.

3) F30 was designed to take the sales crown back from Previous Gen C-class and it did (E9x was outsold by C-class). It is the ultimate sales machine first driving machine second.

4) You can find many SUVs/Cars selling at 40-50k range at Toyota or Honda these days.

5) During F30 product cycle many non sporty luxury car buyers are moving onto the crossover / electric segment and the trend continue (X/i series). This will give G20 a chance to be more driver focus again.

#5 is a keen observation, but unfortunately signs point to BMW not really going this route with the G20. Only time will tell. Maybe I just don't have that faith in BMW / BMW NA anymore.

[classyfast]

Originally Posted by nickf30

Few points:
1) F30 is at the end of its product cycle

2) Dealer/BMW are giving higher % discount / incentive. Very few people are paying MSRP and 80+% of first owners are leasing.

3) F30 was designed to take the sales crown back from Previous Gen C-class and it did (E9x was outsold by C-class). It is the ultimate sales machine first driving machine second.

4) You can find many SUVs/Cars selling at 40-50k range at Toyota or Honda these days.

5) During F30 product cycle many non sporty luxury car buyers are moving onto the crossover / electric segment and the trend continue (X/i series). This will give G20 a chance to be more driver focus again.

Great points

[jeffc83]

Many great points here and thanks for starting this OP

After owning this car for almost 2 years now and reading that sticker this morning with a "fresh mind" if you will, I'm truly wondering what justifies it at this point. 42 grand (base) and has no XM, no comfort entry or hell, not even lumbar support! And it has SensaTEC too at 47 grand?! Incentives or not, there are better options out there even at the 35-40k price point. Okay, I know we all mention the lack of features but then we can start talking about "overall satisfaction and FUN factor" which just aren't there at that price. Although I love my Bimmer a lot and plan on keeping it around for quite awhile, it might also be the last as the latest "sneak peek" I've seen on the G20 just isn't doing it for me at all nor is the 5er anymore, especially after driving one. (although the interior was nice on the G30, it completely lacked the fun factor)

[classyfast]

Originally Posted by vooonoo

Least it has LED head lights and fogs standard, oh and a back up camera... took you long enough to include that BMW.... come on man that thing isn't bone stock, it has heated seats, a heated steering wheel, blind spot detection and comfort access! /s

You would think all that would be standard when you're spending 50k for a car

Really though that's insane, that's why people wait for them to be returned leases and buy them for 16k

Also post a pic let's see how ugly that bumper really is

Ask and you shall receive!

[classyfast]

Originally Posted by vooonoo

Least it has LED head lights and fogs standard, oh and a back up camera... took you long enough to include that BMW.... come on man that thing isn't bone stock, it has heated seats, a heated steering wheel, blind spot detection and comfort access! /s

You would think all that would be standard when you're spending 50k for a car

Really though that's insane, that's why people wait for them to be returned leases and buy them for 16k

Also post a pic let's see how ugly that bumper really is

All things mentioned in your first paragraph are typically standard on a "luxury" car. Idk though I guess I just expected so much more.

[jeffc83]

Originally Posted by classyfast

All things mentioned in your first paragraph are typically standard on a "luxury" car. Idk though I guess I just expected so much more.

And in this day in age, you should expect more as this "heritage" BS only goes so far...if it's no longer amazing to drive, what is it really? An overpriced turd with "heritage"? (no offense to anyone and for the record, I love the F30) Yet tigger_643 has the right idea here with that thought as in their eyes, you are indeed getting what you pay for as you did not shell out close to 100 grand lol

[Fuller]

Originally Posted by jeffc83

And in this day in age, you should expect more as this "heritage" BS only goes so far...if it's no longer amazing to drive, what is it really? An overpriced turd with "heritage"? (no offense to anyone and for the record, I love the F30) Yet tigger_643 has the right idea here with that thought as in their eyes, you are indeed getting what you pay for as you did not shell out close to 100 grand lol

Their heritage seems to be what matters to most people though. Consider that the average bmw driver isn't what we'd consider a car enthusiast. They just want a comfy car that they can feel proud driving. Those who post on bmw forums like this likely comprise a relatively small portion of bmw drivers.

For that matter I'd even say that badge and heritage matters a lot to most enthusiasts who post here. It seems to matter more than most would admit anyway. How often have we read posts here to the effect of, "I'd never drive a 'insert the non-premium brand of your choice' regardless of what it offers. Sure there are those who drive camaros, mustangs, Chevy ss, Kia stinger, etc, but there are also many who wouldn't be able to bring themselves to buy or lease one, regardless of the performance to cost value offered by such models.

Believe me, I understand wanting some minimum standard of build quality and technology, but as long as even car enthusiasts prioritize those things over performance, we can't really complain about where car designs are heading.

[metallicpea]

Originally Posted by classyfast

Ask and you shall receive!

It looks especially bad in lighter colors - silver and white.

[jeffc83]

Originally Posted by Fuller

Their heritage seems to be what matters to most people though. Consider that the average bmw driver isn't what we'd consider a car enthusiast. They just want a comfy car that they can feel proud driving. Those who post on bmw forums like this likely comprise a relatively small portion of bmw drivers.

For that matter I'd even say that badge and heritage matters a lot to most enthusiasts who post here. It seems to matter more than most would admit anyway. How often have we read posts here to the effect of, "I'd never drive a 'insert the non-premium brand of your choice' regardless of what it offers. Sure there are those who drive camaros, mustangs, Chevy ss, Kia stinger, etc, but there are also many who wouldn't be able to bring themselves to buy or lease one, regardless of the performance to value ratio offered by such models.

Believe me, I understand wanting some minimum standard of build quality and technology, but as long as even car enthusiasts prioritize those things over performance, we can't really complain about where car designs are heading.

Well put! Although BMW is losing some "faithful owners and enthusiasts" along the way, they'll always have an EXTREMELY large following due to what has been established and technically, their heritage means a lot more to the majority than I might have once thought! It especially rings true on the forums/here!

Okay, okay, I "was" one of those that "was" having a difficult time looking at a Chevy Volt in the past yet I'm now finding myself not caring about the name versus what it offers because the i3 truly isn't for me and for that car, the name doesn't make it any better and never will, lol. I was also one that said "I'm not spending that much on a Kia" when the Stinger is actually one hell of a sport car that has tons of potential! Just need to get past the name and lack of "heritage"

[classyfast]

Originally Posted by jeffc83

Well put! Although BMW is losing some "faithful owners and enthusiasts" along the way, they'll always have an EXTREMELY large following due to what has been established and technically, their heritage means a lot more to the majority than I might have once thought! It especially rings true on the forums/here!

Okay, okay, I "was" one of those that "was" having a difficult time looking at a Chevy Volt in the past yet I'm now finding myself not caring about the name versus what it offers because the i3 truly isn't for me and for that car, the name doesn't make it any better and never will, lol. I was also one that said "I'm not spending that much on a Kia" when the Stinger is actually one hell of a sport car that has tons of potential! Just need to get past the name and lack of "heritage"

Spot on

[classyfast]

What do you guys think about no more manuals? I will absolutely be locating another e36 or e46m car as a weekend toy in the next couple years. For sure.

[530iDriver]

Originally Posted by Humdizzle

$50k for a 4 cylinder. what a world we live in.

Make that $70K+ for a fully loaded G30 530i with the 4 pot...