[328iX]

Originally Posted by catskillclimber

The first clue I got was an increase in sodium in the engine oil analysis during the 49k-57k range. It went from single digits to 30's. I didn't get a low coolant alarm until 63k and had not topped coolant before. Added 16oz at that time. The leak was minimal as a pressure test revealed nothing. From 63k - 74k we lost 8 oz. From 74k - 91k we lost 16oz. From 91k - 92k we lost 8 oz. Sodium jumped into the 70's on the 91k sample. Based on those indications we we stopped driving it at 92k. Our intake was replaced as per the recall but it showed no internal damage, unlike another vehicle brought to the dealer around the same time with a smoldering intake.
We were lucky that the breaking point came around the same time as the recall.

ahh ok good to know so i'm still kind of low in miles for it to fail, i guess i'll monitor it and have it replaced when i notice coolant is low

[Newgene]

Sorry for the text wall. I have an interesting bit of data to add to this. I have a 2014 328d that’s no longer under warranty with a slow coolant leak that I’ve noticed since last year. I first noticed it when the coolant light came on, and I had to top of the reservoir. Since then, I have had to add either EG mix or distilled water to the reservoir every few thousand miles. I learned about the recall right before I had an issue with mine. So, here’s the saga.

I was driving the car to work when the EML came on. I don’t live far from the local BMW dealership (Beaumont), and it was a quick drive in. So, I left it with them. They diagnosed the problem pretty quick as an EGR failure and a melted intake. Here’s where it gets odd. They immediately stated that the EGR cooler could not have had anything to do with it because the boroscope images of my cooler look like the “normal” sooty condition in their guidance from the BMW technical staff. So, they gave me the repair bill (~$3k), and said it would not be covered under the recall. I can’t imagine BMW would want me to perform all of this work, and then put the cooler back on the car, knowing there is a leaking coolant problem with no obvious signs of leaking coolant, and the car just recently had a melted intake. So, then the BMW team later came back and said although the cooler is “normal,” I need to go ahead and change it. Lol…wth? When I asked the dealership what they were talking about, I then asked the simple question. Has the cooler failed or not? They literally gave me two different answers for the same question. So, the repair bill is up to nearly $5k even before they get into it. They also have not performed any troubleshooting on where the leaking coolant is actually going. It’s just comical at this point, because I can swap the intake and change the parts myself. The care is still with them now for over 3 weeks.

So, I’m wondering my next steps. I have not logged anything with the NHTSA or anything like that. I’ve been cool with everyone, and the case is still open. I believe my case is one where I can help others on the forum, if nothing else but a data point. The parts from my car can be a forensic piece of data, as I’m really beginning to wonder if BMW fully understands how to diagnose the problem. The root cause is a mechanical failure of the cooler, but the deciding factor for recall claims is a very subjective image of the fins on a cooler based on sludge build-up. I think BMW may be realizing these coolers can fail and not exhibit the subjective levels they are showing from their “normal” images. Hence, I believe BMW would like to get my likely defective parts off the car whether either I or they pay for the replacement.

I'll keep everyone posted on the outcome.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

Sorry for the text wall. I have an interesting bit of data to add to this. I have a 2014 328d that’s no longer under warranty with a slow coolant leak that I’ve noticed since last year. I first noticed it when the coolant light came on, and I had to top of the reservoir. Since then, I have had to add either EG mix or distilled water to the reservoir every few thousand miles. I learned about the recall right before I had an issue with mine. So, here’s the saga.

I was driving the car to work when the EML came on. I don’t live far from the local BMW dealership (Beaumont), and it was a quick drive in. So, I left it with them. They diagnosed the problem pretty quick as an EGR failure and a melted intake. Here’s where it gets odd. They immediately stated that the EGR cooler could not have had anything to do with it because the boroscope images of my cooler look like the “normal” sooty condition in their guidance from the BMW technical staff. So, they gave me the repair bill (~$3k), and said it would not be covered under the recall. I can’t imagine BMW would want me to perform all of this work, and then put the cooler back on the car, knowing there is a leaking coolant problem with no obvious signs of leaking coolant, and the car just recently had a melted intake. So, then the BMW team later came back and said although the cooler is “normal,” I need to go ahead and change it. Lol…wth? When I asked the dealership what they were talking about, I then asked the simple question. Has the cooler failed or not? They literally gave me two different answers for the same question. So, the repair bill is up to nearly $5k even before they get into it. They also have not performed any troubleshooting on where the leaking coolant is actually going. It’s just comical at this point, because I can swap the intake and change the parts myself. The care is still with them now for over 3 weeks.

So, I’m wondering my next steps. I have not logged anything with the NHTSA or anything like that. I’ve been cool with everyone, and the case is still open. I believe my case is one where I can help others on the forum, if nothing else but a data point. The parts from my car can be a forensic piece of data, as I’m really beginning to wonder if BMW fully understands how to diagnose the problem. The root cause is a mechanical failure of the cooler, but the deciding factor for recall claims is a very subjective image of the fins on a cooler based on sludge build-up. I think BMW may be realizing these coolers can fail and not exhibit the subjective levels they are showing from their “normal” images. Hence, I believe BMW would like to get my likely defective parts off the car whether either I or they pay for the replacement.

I'll keep everyone posted on the outcome.

Wow i would completely go off on them, what did they speculate the loss of coolant was from? a blown head gasket, or a faulty transmission cooler line? wtf?

Sounds like they're trying to foot the bill to you instead of doing the right thing, i would've left immediately and went to another dealership.

[Newgene]

Originally Posted by 328dX

Wow i would completely go off on them, what did they speculate the loss of coolant was from? a blown head gasket, or a faulty transmission cooler line? wtf?

Sounds like they're trying to foot the bill to you instead of doing the right thing, i would've left immediately and went to another dealership.

They said they weren't going to troubleshoot it unless I was willing to pay for the time if it is not the EGR cooler. I've worked on a fair share of cars (have a rotary 2-post lift in my garage, tools/shop manuals, and have changed timing belts, major suspension, transmissions, etc.), and this is not a major deal to change the intake. I'm just trying to give these guys an opportunity to make it right. I hate to hijack this thread, so I'll try to consolidate posts to specific questions or details that will help others. I just feel if I go swap the intake and take care of the EGR parts, I won't be helping too many others on this one.

I can't answer for BMW, but if I were the engineers on this one, I would likely at least offer to change the cooler. They already know there was a bad batch, and it's a quick part to change. I already told them I have UV dye in the system, so they should be able to cut the part and see if it is where it shouldn't be. Looking for dye with a black light on a shop bench is much easier to say yay or nay versus comparing sludge levels on a cooler fin for soot that gets sooty anyway. I would say it's just a bad system from the start, and an EGR component is definitely causing damage to intake manifolds (or worse). I feel like they are splitting hairs on this one, and I really just don't see how they could be right. Again, I'm letting it play out, but it's just really odd at this point. I'll be back at work tomorrow, so I may not reply immediately, but I'll surely keep everyone posted.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

They said they weren't going to troubleshoot it unless I was willing to pay for the time if it is not the EGR cooler. I've worked on a fair share of cars (have a rotary 2-post lift in my garage, tools/shop manuals, and have changed timing belts, major suspension, transmissions, etc.), and this is not a major deal to change the intake. I'm just trying to give these guys an opportunity to make it right. I hate to hijack this thread, so I'll try to consolidate posts to specific questions or details that will help others. I just feel if I go swap the intake and take care of the EGR parts, I won't be helping too many others on this one.

I can't answer for BMW, but if I were the engineers on this one, I would likely at least offer to change the cooler. They already know there was a bad batch, and it's a quick part to change. I already told them I have UV dye in the system, so they should be able to cut the part and see if it is where it shouldn't be. Looking for dye with a black light on a shop bench is much easier to say yay or nay versus comparing sludge levels on a cooler fin for soot that gets sooty anyway. I would say it's just a bad system from the start, and an EGR component is definitely causing damage to intake manifolds (or worse). I feel like they are splitting hairs on this one, and I really just don't see how they could be right. Again, I'm letting it play out, but it's just really odd at this point. I'll be back at work tomorrow, so I may not reply immediately, but I'll surely keep everyone posted.

it's cool this thread already run its course and everythings been discussed for the most part, but yeah keep us updated.

[328iX]

Received my first call today informing me that parts are available and they are ready to work the recall.


Only issue is my vehicle isn't experiencing coolant loss, and based on the remedy instructions/TSB if your EGR cooler passes inspection (no coolant/soot build up in the cooler) then all they do it replace an o-ring and reassemble, I attached the TSB.


So i'm going to wait at least another 25-50k miles before taking it in because I don't want to pass inspection, then have the cooler fail down the road and be denied replacement, if that is how the system works?

[n00bkiller944]

Originally Posted by Newgene

They said they weren't going to troubleshoot it unless I was willing to pay for the time if it is not the EGR cooler. I've worked on a fair share of cars (have a rotary 2-post lift in my garage, tools/shop manuals, and have changed timing belts, major suspension, transmissions, etc.), and this is not a major deal to change the intake. I'm just trying to give these guys an opportunity to make it right. I hate to hijack this thread, so I'll try to consolidate posts to specific questions or details that will help others. I just feel if I go swap the intake and take care of the EGR parts, I won't be helping too many others on this one.

I can't answer for BMW, but if I were the engineers on this one, I would likely at least offer to change the cooler. They already know there was a bad batch, and it's a quick part to change. I already told them I have UV dye in the system, so they should be able to cut the part and see if it is where it shouldn't be. Looking for dye with a black light on a shop bench is much easier to say yay or nay versus comparing sludge levels on a cooler fin for soot that gets sooty anyway. I would say it's just a bad system from the start, and an EGR component is definitely causing damage to intake manifolds (or worse). I feel like they are splitting hairs on this one, and I really just don't see how they could be right. Again, I'm letting it play out, but it's just really odd at this point. I'll be back at work tomorrow, so I may not reply immediately, but I'll surely keep everyone posted.

I can't believe they are unwilling to cover this. Keep us updated on how this plays out.

[Alcuin49]

The EGR cooler on my 2014 328d failed in November 2018. There was a bit of exhaust migrating into the ventilation system and it progressed to full gas chamber experience in about 3 weeks. There was info posted around that time on the EGR cooler recalls in Korea with talk of extending the recall to other regions.

The local dealer wouldn't take the car for the recall issue until January. It has been sitting on the lot at Performance BMW in Raleigh NC since January 15. Checked again today - no parts available, no horizon for parts delivery. No loaner vehicle so far, either.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Alcuin49

The EGR cooler on my 2014 328d failed in November 2018. There was a bit of exhaust migrating into the ventilation system and it progressed to full gas chamber experience in about 3 weeks. There was info posted around that time on the EGR cooler recalls in Korea with talk of extending the recall to other regions.

The local dealer wouldn't take the car for the recall issue until January. It has been sitting on the lot at Performance BMW in Raleigh NC since January 15. Checked again today - no parts available, no horizon for parts delivery. No loaner vehicle so far, either.

You need to contact BMW N/A immediately.

[Newgene]

I am working with them now, but it's still up in the air. However, the last conversation was better. They understand where I'm at. I'm trying to get their clear position on the cooler. If it's bad, I believe it should be covered. If it's not bad, I'm not sure they really recommend putting it back on the car knowing something has been leaking coolant. With all the telltale signs, I just don't see how it's not the cooler. I'll definitely update this post either way. They've had my car for a month, so I hope it gets resolved soon.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

I am working with them now, but it's still up in the air. However, the last conversation was better. They understand where I'm at. I'm trying to get their clear position on the cooler. If it's bad, I believe it should be covered. If it's not bad, I'm not sure they really recommend putting it back on the car knowing something has been leaking coolant. With all the telltale signs, I just don't see how it's not the cooler. I'll definitely update this post either way. They've had my car for a month, so I hope it gets resolved soon.

Maybe check out the TSB on how to check it out yourself? you need a borescope and you take off a fitting I believe and look inside the cooler. Just a thought

[Tomo366]

I called my Dealer last week and was told the parts aren’t available yet.....Silver Spring Md

[Newgene]

Oh well, I received a call back from BMW NA today, and they said they talked to the engineering team, and they stated that carbon buildup caused the failure of the EGR system, which includes the cooler, valve, and intake. They still haven't figured out why the coolant has been leaking since last year, and they haven't discussed if any excess carbon is related to the failed cooler. They are still with a denial to claim any of this under recall, and they stand behind their statement that the cooler needs to be changed. I'm disappointed in BMW at this point, and I have another '18 diesel X5. Loyalty has not been a factor in anything to date. I am still asking to escalate this to another level, and I would like to directly talk with someone technical. I also asked them to put in writing if the cooler is bad or not. They are saying it is bad, but they are saying they won't cover it under recall. I'll post when I hear more.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

Oh well, I received a call back from BMW NA today, and they said they talked to the engineering team, and they stated that carbon buildup caused the failure of the EGR system, which includes the cooler, valve, and intake. They still haven't figured out why the coolant has been leaking since last year, and they haven't discussed if any excess carbon is related to the failed cooler. They are still with a denial to claim any of this under recall, and they stand behind their statement that the cooler needs to be changed. I'm disappointed in BMW at this point, and I have another '18 diesel X5. Loyalty has not been a factor in anything to date. I am still asking to escalate this to another level, and I would like to directly talk with someone technical. I also asked them to put in writing if the cooler is bad or not. They are saying it is bad, but they are saying they won't cover it under recall. I'll post when I hear more.

How many miles. Crazy to think it could get that bad

[Newgene]

Originally Posted by 328dX

How many miles. Crazy to think it could get that bad

It has right at 100k miles on it. Here is an image of the fins. Clearly there is some build-up on the fins. I just don't know how they have arrived at their pass fail criteria to determine if an EGR cooler is leaking. I would assume some have much worse leaks than others, and I believe that is evident from their bad images, which I would assume are very severe. In my photo, you can see I have some fin holes blocked off. I would assume that not every car that fails the test has images as bad as below because I'm not sure if every car is going to make it to that point before an intake failure.

[Newgene]

These are the images that BMW uses as their guide

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

These are the images that BMW uses as their guide

Now how can they know it's not EGR failure and caused by carbon build up. That is definite EGR failure they should be responsible!

[Newgene]

Originally Posted by 328dX

Now how can they know it's not EGR failure and caused by carbon build up. That is definite EGR failure they should be responsible!

I just want to make sure I'm not losing my mind, and others can see the build-up on the fins. If they are looking for wet soot in 100% of the cars with failed EGR's, they are overlooking other scenarios. If you have a car that has been leaking slower over a longer time, you should have more dry soot and less of the sludge. It is still a failure nonetheless. This is ridiculous.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Newgene

I just want to make sure I'm not losing my mind, and others can see the build-up on the fins. If they are looking for wet soot in 100% of the cars with failed EGR's, they are overlooking other scenarios. If you have a car that has been leaking slower over a longer time, you should have more dry soot and less of the sludge. It is still a failure nonetheless. This is ridiculous.

I've never heard of it having to be "wet" once wet coolant interacts with soot it turns into the sludge you have pictured, if they want it to be "wet" they're never going to see that.

[agentorange]

Originally Posted by 328dX

Received my first call today informing me that parts are available and they are ready to work the recall.

As of April 25th the Vegas dealership still says no parts available.

[Apples12]

Had the recall done on mine and promptly had the egr delete done.

[328iX]

Originally Posted by Apples12

Had the recall done on mine and promptly had the egr delete done.

What is the EGR delete?

I haven't taken mine in because I know it's not faulty (yet) @57k miles