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      01-15-2012, 07:13 PM   #177
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These new lines are horrible. I tried to configure something I would want, and in the end it switched from one line to another and undid my previous choices six times before I gave up. I feel heartbroken.
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      01-15-2012, 07:14 PM   #178
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Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
Totally disagree, that seems to be the only reason they did it this way.
My impulse, based upon BMW's typical under-the-rug profit squeezing behavior, is to agree with you. But take a look at the difference between different 2011 configurations vs. the three 2012 lines and notice that there's little for BMW's sales team to skip on home about.

I'm convinced these lines were put into practice solely for the purpose of attracting people who like the cachet of "SPORT," "MODERN," and "LUXURY." It just sounds kind of nice to categorize the niceties of your car that way, but couldn't they just offer the little fender sticker separately?
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      01-15-2012, 07:54 PM   #179
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I guess it remains to be seen if saddle or oyster interior can be optioned on the MSport? Seems like they're off limits for the sport pack, and you can't get Sport+ if you go with the base model.

To echo everyone else....wth?!?
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      01-15-2012, 10:28 PM   #180
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Originally Posted by Staszek View Post
Thats what I said looking at it. The Sport has by far the best exterior, but I can't stand the interior it looks cheap to me. I love the Modern interior, especially the wavy wood.
+1... it's a shame that the wavy wood is not available with the Sport... ridiculous even... but perhaps it's just us two
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      01-15-2012, 10:58 PM   #181
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I can only hope that the packaging of the F42 will be more open and flexible than the F30... oh please let it be so... If I am told I have to buy "Premium" with leather to get Comfort access I may not upgrade my E92..

...time will tell. If I spend $50+K on a car... I want some flexibility
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      01-15-2012, 11:18 PM   #182
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Ugh... It seems that the ratio of bitching and moaning to complements is 2:1 or 3:1. Does anyone, and I'm really asking, have the itemized sales breakdown of BMW 3-series and how many people bought what option. What were the most popular combinations? Who chose what? How much was the average salary of the majority of buyers? Etc. Etc. Etc.

Ten bucks that these plans didn't just get crapped out during a meeting. I'm willing to bet that these options are a 'hedging of bets' on BMW's part. They love a LARGE profit margin and who doesn't? I'm betting that the people who really matter here (the majority) enjoy what BMW is cooking.
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      01-16-2012, 12:01 AM   #183
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Originally Posted by Bimmerlover76 View Post
Ugh... It seems that the ratio of bitching and moaning to complements is 2:1 or 3:1. Does anyone, and I'm really asking, have the itemized sales breakdown of BMW 3-series and how many people bought what option. What were the most popular combinations? Who chose what? How much was the average salary of the majority of buyers? Etc. Etc. Etc.

Ten bucks that these plans didn't just get crapped out during a meeting. I'm willing to bet that these options are a 'hedging of bets' on BMW's part. They love a LARGE profit margin and who doesn't? I'm betting that the people who really matter here (the majority) enjoy what BMW is cooking.
+1
I believe all these lines are made for a reason, also made to simplify the buying process. "Oh you want luxury? Check out our 3 series Luxury line." Or replace luxury with sport or basic or modern.
I love what they did with the new 3 series.
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      01-16-2012, 01:43 AM   #184
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well, if I could, I would get only

328i red + sportline with oyster interior and dark wood trim with xenons.

unfortunately, you can't pick oyster with sportline, or wood trims.
and for xenons you need the premium package.

so a car that would cost ~38000 with only those options now costs a lot more and is impossible to make : <
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      01-16-2012, 12:11 PM   #185
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bimmerlover76 View Post
Ugh... It seems that the ratio of bitching and moaning to complements is 2:1 or 3:1. Does anyone, and I'm really asking, have the itemized sales breakdown of BMW 3-series and how many people bought what option. What were the most popular combinations? Who chose what? How much was the average salary of the majority of buyers? Etc. Etc. Etc.
BMW doesn't even release sales figures per model let alone breakdowns of options. I'm sure they did their research and the only way to tell if they were right is by how people react with their wallet. If BMW did not judge their buyers correctly, we will see them modify their packages, lines, and/or pricing. Judging from the reaction of BMW owners and prospective buyers so far, we may see this happening sooner rather than later.
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      01-16-2012, 12:14 PM   #186
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Thanks for posting, Jason, that is a very nice quick reference guide, especially with the addtion of the base model choices (which are quite limited as we know). One possible small improvement would be to note that the base model interior materials are model specific. I.e. 328i gets the silver, 335i gets the wood, and there is no option to choose the other. Same with the 19" wheel - 335i only.

One question: is it actually possible to get the 19" wheels on a base 335i? As far as I can tell, the order guide suggests that those wheels require you to select from one of the three lines.

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Originally Posted by Jason View Post
First post (guide) updated with combinations graphical chart:
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      01-16-2012, 02:31 PM   #187
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Kudos to building this information thread, ..in all honesty however you slice it you will get a great car and there will be more uniqueness floating around.

Looking forward to the F42 release, so curious how the F30 will morph into a coupe
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      01-16-2012, 06:51 PM   #188
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Wow, they have certainly sparked some debate! For me the biggest question is whether you can add m sport to any line. If I can take luxury with m sport; great! Like others, I find the interior on the sports line a bit cheesy and the interior on modern, well, just a bit "today"...

Apologies in advance if my question is answered elsewhere in this thread...
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      01-16-2012, 07:00 PM   #189
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Tell me how in the hell BMW saves money by forcing people to pick only certain combinations? The parts are there, just mix and match according to the build configuration.

I think BMW is trying to save resale value. Letting a customer pick awful color schemes, that the dealership has to take back after a lease and trying to sell must have gotten really annoying.

These "lines" are a complete stab in the back to true BMW fans. You can have a "simplified" build process without restricting people who know what they want.

This is a step back from being a true luxury car maker in my opinion.

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      01-16-2012, 08:06 PM   #190
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BMW messed up, audi's def win in the looks category now. New 3's are so ugly and soft looking, happy as hell I got mine when I did.
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      01-16-2012, 08:21 PM   #191
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BMW messed up, audi's def win in the looks category now. New 3's are so ugly and soft looking, happy as hell I got mine when I did.
You think the f30 looks softer than the B8? lol, i can understand if you said uglier, but softer? lol...
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      01-17-2012, 08:17 AM   #192
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Originally Posted by justinnum1 View Post
You think the f30 looks softer than the B8? lol, i can understand if you said uglier, but softer? lol...
Agreed!

Perhaps he didn't mean soft because if the B8 and upcoming LCI (I know that's a Bimmer term) where any softer, they'd melt.

And that is said with great pain. As a VW/Audi enthusiast I have become consistently underwhelemed and bored with the looks my favorite auto group keeps churning out.

Their looks are as risky as sunblock at the beach.

Save for an array of sexy, innovative (and now viciously copied) LED daytime running lights, I'm uninspired and patiently waiting.

I should note that I like sports sedans, so for me, the F30 is the only viable option if Audi doesn't snap back.
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      01-17-2012, 12:11 PM   #193
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Originally Posted by juddholland View Post
But take a look at the difference between different 2011 configurations vs. the three 2012 lines and notice that there's little for BMW's sales team to skip on home about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabe View Post
Tell me how in the hell BMW saves money by forcing people to pick only certain combinations? The parts are there, just mix and match according to the build configuration.
This is clearly a cost saving measure on the production side. The "lines" will substantially reduce the total number of possible configurations, which I'm sure translates to a much improved production efficiency. I would guess that not a lot of people bought a 328i with M sport, LeMans blue, saddle brown, and aluminum like I did, but BMW had to make sure their production line was capable of producing that particular combination. Now they don't have to.

Otherwise, why do you think most non-premium companies severely limit the customizability? It's surely not just to screw with their customers. Customization = increased production cost.

I would also like to remind you that Scott (I think it was him) said the F30 will be the most profitable 3 series yet. I'm sure this line business is a part of that improvement.
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      01-17-2012, 03:54 PM   #194
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Originally Posted by Propagator View Post
This is clearly a cost saving measure on the production side. The "lines" will substantially reduce the total number of possible configurations, which I'm sure translates to a much improved production efficiency. I would guess that not a lot of people bought a 328i with M sport, LeMans blue, saddle brown, and aluminum like I did, but BMW had to make sure their production line was capable of producing that particular combination. Now they don't have to.

Otherwise, why do you think most non-premium companies severely limit the customizability? It's surely not just to screw with their customers. Customization = increased production cost.

I would also like to remind you that Scott (I think it was him) said the F30 will be the most profitable 3 series yet. I'm sure this line business is a part of that improvement.
I'm not really sure if limiting options really simplifies and reduces cost. You can order way more combinations in other countries, but limits the interior choices in the U.S. (not allowing cloth interiors.) Obviously allowing people in Europe to build BMWs with cloth interiors is worth it enough for them to add this to the build config, otherwise why allow the option?

So, applying the same logic, why would they limit options in the "lines" that could possibly result in lost sales? If I want a "luxury" line car, but want a "modern" key fob. How does it save BMW money to not allow me to do this?

In other words, the restrictions seem to be centered around the designers' tastes. The designers say "Sporty" spice would only want their BMWs to looks this way. "Posh" spice would only like it to look this way. "Crazy" spice would like an oyster interior.

Why allow more options and at the same time only allow certain combinations of those options? I'm not sure cost and build simplicity is the only answer.

The interior and color choices are already very limited from Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti. This is what sets BMW apart from those brands. An almost fully customizable car. Why walk away from that awesome distinction?
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      01-17-2012, 04:22 PM   #195
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Originally Posted by wannabe View Post
I'm not really sure if limiting options really simplifies and reduces cost. You can order way more combinations in other countries, but limits the interior choices in the U.S. (not allowing cloth interiors.) Obviously allowing people in Europe to build BMWs with cloth interiors is worth it enough for them to add this to the build config, otherwise why allow the option?
Yes, but presumably, the profit margin per car in those countries is greater than that in the USDM to warrant such customizability. It is well known that the US is the most price competitive market, and the pay off is large volume. With the new line system, I would expect that a substantially smaller portion of their production is now "oddballs".

Quote:
So, applying the same logic, why would they limit options in the "lines" that could possibly result in lost sales? If I want a "luxury" line car, but want a "modern" key fob. How does it save BMW money to not allow me to do this?
I am sure BMW is aware that they will lose some sales due to these new limitations. The only rational reason they would go for it despite that is because they have done the calculation, and the cost saving outweighs the small loss of sales.

Quote:
In other words, the restrictions seem to be centered around the designers' tastes. The designers say "Sporty" spice would only want their BMWs to looks this way. "Posh" spice would only like it to look this way. "Crazy" spice would like an oyster interior.
That is backward. I'm sure designers and/or marketers worked their butt off to make sure they would minimize the loss of sales coming from the limitations. But it doesn't make sense to say that BMW implemented a new strategy that will lose sales without any cost saving benefits just to please the dictatorial urges of its designers. I don't think anyone runs a company that way.

Quote:
Why allow more options and at the same time only allow certain combinations of those options? I'm not sure cost and build simplicity is the only answer.

The interior and color choices are already very limited from Acura, Lexus, and Infiniti. This is what sets BMW apart from those brands. An almost fully customizable car. Why walk away from that awesome distinction?
It's not true that you could get any combination of options with the E90. Not everything was a stand alone option. What if you wanted a chrome-line window surrounding in a sedan, but still wanted the sports suspension, or sport seats? You couldn't get it. What if you wanted a regular suspension with the sport steering? You couldn't get it. Those restrictions were there because it saved BMW cost without losing too much sales. They just went further down that road.

I also liked that BMW allowed you more flexibility compared to the Japanese brands. I would've liked BMW to stay that way as well, by cutting corners somewhere else. But just reading this forum, it's clear the buyers demand every single gadgets and luxury features available in other cars. It would be very costly for BMW to offer them all, just like everyone else, and then also offer the virtually unlimited flexibility. So I think the fact that they offer more options than ever is directly linked to the fact that now you have a lot more restrictions on the combinations.
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      01-17-2012, 05:42 PM   #196
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Originally Posted by Propagator View Post
Yes, but presumably, the profit margin per car in those countries is greater than that in the USDM to warrant such customizability. It is well known that the US is the most price competitive market, and the pay off is large volume. With the new line system, I would expect that a substantially smaller portion of their production is now "oddballs".



I am sure BMW is aware that they will lose some sales due to these new limitations. The only rational reason they would go for it despite that is because they have done the calculation, and the cost saving outweighs the small loss of sales.



That is backward. I'm sure designers and/or marketers worked their butt off to make sure they would minimize the loss of sales coming from the limitations. But it doesn't make sense to say that BMW implemented a new strategy that will lose sales without any cost saving benefits just to please the dictatorial urges of its designers. I don't think anyone runs a company that way.



It's not true that you could get any combination of options with the E90. Not everything was a stand alone option. What if you wanted a chrome-line window surrounding in a sedan, but still wanted the sports suspension, or sport seats? You couldn't get it. What if you wanted a regular suspension with the sport steering? You couldn't get it. Those restrictions were there because it saved BMW cost without losing too much sales. They just went further down that road.

I also liked that BMW allowed you more flexibility compared to the Japanese brands. I would've liked BMW to stay that way as well, by cutting corners somewhere else. But just reading this forum, it's clear the buyers demand every single gadgets and luxury features available in other cars. It would be very costly for BMW to offer them all, just like everyone else, and then also offer the virtually unlimited flexibility. So I think the fact that they offer more options than ever is directly linked to the fact that now you have a lot more restrictions on the combinations.
Well it will be interesting to see if they extend this "line" crap to the 1-series or the M3. If it is a cost measure, then it should definitely be extended to the 1-series.

We'll see if this is now the BMW way or some 3-series exec's epic fail.

It just irks me that the only way I can get sport seats is to choose black, red, or grey leather.
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      01-17-2012, 10:00 PM   #197
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WTF? According to bmwusa.com, they did away with Jet Black? BMW f'd up big time if that's accurate.

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      01-18-2012, 02:34 AM   #198
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wannabe View Post
Well it will be interesting to see if they extend this "line" crap to the 1-series or the M3. If it is a cost measure, then it should definitely be extended to the 1-series.

We'll see if this is now the BMW way or some 3-series exec's epic fail.

It just irks me that the only way I can get sport seats is to choose black, red, or grey leather.
In Europe the 1-series hatchback is also limited with it's lines. So assume the worst.

Howow
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