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      11-17-2017, 04:18 PM   #23
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You're unlikely to find a good one around the same price. Ideally £50 minimum.

For £28, you are probably getting about the best for the price. That's why my initial post in the thread I said spend a little more.

Last edited by Dr Forinor; 11-17-2017 at 05:25 PM.
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      11-17-2017, 04:20 PM   #24
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Originally Posted by Dr Forinor View Post
You're unlikely to find a good one around the same price. Ideally £50 minimum.

For the price, £28, you are probably getting about the best for the price. That's why my initial post in the thread I said spend a little more.
Thanks pal, any recommendations around the £50 mark?
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      11-17-2017, 04:24 PM   #25
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I bought a LED lenser last year but I don't how/what all the different modes are and how you change in between them?
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      11-17-2017, 04:40 PM   #26
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Originally Posted by Theone88 View Post
Thanks pal, any recommendations around the £50 mark?
This is where it can get complicated. Do you have a preference for/against any particular battery? Your typical AA/AAA batteries are much more readily available, but don't produce the most light out of a torch. The chemistry in these batteries doesn't allow maximum output. To get a brighter output, you're best with a Lithium type of battery (you can get Lithium AA batteries, but torches that can make use of an AA Lithium battery are very rare).

A common Lithium battery is either CR123, or an 18650. You can buy non-rechargeable or chargeable CR123s and 18650s only come in a rechargeable form.

Also, the majority of good torches tend to run on CR123A/18650 batteries.

If you can narrow which battery type, it will help me suggest a shortlist for torches.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveChester View Post
I bought a LED lenser last year but I don't how/what all the different modes are and how you change in between them?
I'm afraid I have forgotten how to change the different settings in a Led Lenser.
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Last edited by Dr Forinor; 11-17-2017 at 06:11 PM.
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      11-17-2017, 04:51 PM   #27
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I'm a bit of a flashaholic, so my parameters for a torch will most likely be different from anyone who isn't a flashaholic. I look for things like beam pattern, colour temperature of the beam is important to me and I use high CRI torches.

What I don't like about these torches that do spot/flood, is when it's set to flood, the light in the middle isn't that great.
Do you spend alot of time in the undergrowth, after dark?
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      11-17-2017, 04:52 PM   #28
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Do you spend alot of time in the undergrowth, after dark?
I do try
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      11-17-2017, 06:54 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Dr Forinor View Post
If you have a look at a good quality torch which isn't adjustable for spot/flood, you will see the beam pattern actually caters for spot and flood.

The spot/flood torch is great for spot, but actually quite crap in flood. But the problem with a spot is in darkness it creates tunnel vision which can be really annoying. And when you use flood on that torch, you will find that the majority of lighting up is done around the periphery of the "flood circle". If you now compare that to a torch which is "generic" (meaning can't adjusted for spot/flood) you will find that it actually lights up just as much area as you would expect the LED Lenser to do in flood, but you have a really useable light in the center of the area that's being lit up. The ONLY one time the spot/flood torch is better than a standard one is when you use spot, but then since that creates tunnel vision I never use spot, therefore a spot/flood torch is useless to me. And with a torch that isn't able to adjust from spot to flood, but you are doing something task specific, then you simply lower the lumen setting and it works great.

Colour temperature, meaning either 4500k or 6000k etc, that's obviously personal preference, but after a few years of trying different colour temperatures I find my eyes strain a lot less (I think there is some science behind it) with a colour temperature that is more neutral, ie closer to the sun's colour temperature. That is most usually 4000-4500k, and you find that your eyes adjust a lot easier to this temperature than a torch which has a much colder temperature of say 6000k or 6500k which has a blue tinge to it. Again this is only noticeable with direct comparison, but once you see it, you can't unsee it, or that's true at least in my case.

High CRI I find very important because it actually allows you to see colours for the colours that they are. If you don't understand this High CRI concept then this may sound silly, but again there is sound science behind this. CRI stands for Colour Rendition Index, and not all torches have high CRI, most are closer to 80ish, which has light that doesn't allow visiblity of all of the colours of any given object to close accuracy. Why is this handy? Well for example in the woods, with a torch that has low CRI, it will be harder to distinguish the difference between mud/soil and dog poo for example. A torch with high CRI the difference is so much more visible, the different shades are much more clearly differentiated. That may also have applications in mechanics where you are trying to find a very specific colour of wire. A high CRI torch will much better assist you in your purpose. And then there is a survival aspect to this also (not saying that it's my reason, but it's a valid reason), where if you need specific types of wood for fire burning, or specific types of tinder for starting a fire, a torch which is high CRI will allow you to be able to tell the difference between different trees by the colour or different greens for tinder.

I enjoy camping a lot, and this is where I am able to try out the difference between a whole range of torches that offer many variabilities. It's after trying them all out (and I have to stress it's much easier to see a clearer difference in complete darkness) in direct comparison that you can actually tell that there is a purpose to different torches, and also which are actually better.

You can actually go a lot more specific and have torches for different purposes, different number of LEDs create different beam patterns and spreads, different depths of reflectors (or sometimes lack thereof) create different beams, a shiny or dimpled/stippled/orange peel reflector creates a different beam pattern, all of which have their own uses.

---------------------

This is my high CRI or 92, with no reflector, creates the most useable light in a camping setting, but you can't see anything in the far distance with it. But whilst around the camp area, nothing beats it, it's the ONLY torch I use;


And you can see a completely different reflector here;


For long distance, 603m (but will still light up a decent area, rather than being tunnel vision style of spot);


A variety I take when I'm out for a camping trip;




A few of the ones I have, of varying sizes, (with an 18650 battery on the right end for size comparison);


-------------------

I hope that helped clear things up a little. At the start of my collection if had a few LED Lenser torches because like yourselves I figured it does spot/flood, what more do I need. After having played with other torches, I got rid of all of my LED Lensers as I found them to be a compromise in everything and not excel at anything in particular.

Whichever hobby you have, the more now about it the more you understand and can appreciate what is available. If you talk to someone who doesn't like cars, or enjoy driving, they might have a Perodua Myvi and say "well you only need to go from A to B". People like us know that it's more than just "A to B", because we have more interest and knowledge in cars. Similarly, a torch isn't as simple as "you just need it to light things up". If it was that simple people wouldn't spend £28 on an LED Lenser, but buy a £4.99 torch from B & Q. You are buying a £28 LED Lenser because you can appreciate it's better than a torch which costs a fiver, but also you might just not have seen a direct comparison with a torch that may cost a fair bit more - and therefore have seen a proper difference.

Sorry for the long post.
All hail the god of torches...may he throw a long beam of light upon our unworthy shadows
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      11-17-2017, 07:10 PM   #30
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Lol, far from it bud, there are so many more out there that know so much more than I do.
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      11-17-2017, 07:10 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Forinor View Post
If you have a look at a good quality torch which isn't adjustable for spot/flood, you will see the beam pattern actually caters for spot and flood.

The spot/flood torch is great for spot, but actually quite crap in flood. But the problem with a spot is in darkness it creates tunnel vision which can be really annoying. And when you use flood on that torch, you will find that the majority of lighting up is done around the periphery of the "flood circle". If you now compare that to a torch which is "generic" (meaning can't adjusted for spot/flood) you will find that it actually lights up just as much area as you would expect the LED Lenser to do in flood, but you have a really useable light in the center of the area that's being lit up. The ONLY one time the spot/flood torch is better than a standard one is when you use spot, but then since that creates tunnel vision I never use spot, therefore a spot/flood torch is useless to me. And with a torch that isn't able to adjust from spot to flood, but you are doing something task specific, then you simply lower the lumen setting and it works great.

Colour temperature, meaning either 4500k or 6000k etc, that's obviously personal preference, but after a few years of trying different colour temperatures I find my eyes strain a lot less (I think there is some science behind it) with a colour temperature that is more neutral, ie closer to the sun's colour temperature. That is most usually 4000-4500k, and you find that your eyes adjust a lot easier to this temperature than a torch which has a much colder temperature of say 6000k or 6500k which has a blue tinge to it. Again this is only noticeable with direct comparison, but once you see it, you can't unsee it, or that's true at least in my case.

High CRI I find very important because it actually allows you to see colours for the colours that they are. If you don't understand this High CRI concept then this may sound silly, but again there is sound science behind this. CRI stands for Colour Rendition Index, and not all torches have high CRI, most are closer to 80ish, which has light that doesn't allow visiblity of all of the colours of any given object to close accuracy. Why is this handy? Well for example in the woods, with a torch that has low CRI, it will be harder to distinguish the difference between mud/soil and dog poo for example. A torch with high CRI the difference is so much more visible, the different shades are much more clearly differentiated. That may also have applications in mechanics where you are trying to find a very specific colour of wire. A high CRI torch will much better assist you in your purpose. And then there is a survival aspect to this also (not saying that it's my reason, but it's a valid reason), where if you need specific types of wood for fire burning, or specific types of tinder for starting a fire, a torch which is high CRI will allow you to be able to tell the difference between different trees by the colour or different greens for tinder.

I enjoy camping a lot, and this is where I am able to try out the difference between a whole range of torches that offer many variabilities. It's after trying them all out (and I have to stress it's much easier to see a clearer difference in complete darkness) in direct comparison that you can actually tell that there is a purpose to different torches, and also which are actually better.

You can actually go a lot more specific and have torches for different purposes, different number of LEDs create different beam patterns and spreads, different depths of reflectors (or sometimes lack thereof) create different beams, a shiny or dimpled/stippled/orange peel reflector creates a different beam pattern, all of which have their own uses.

---------------------

This is my high CRI or 92, with no reflector, creates the most useable light in a camping setting, but you can't see anything in the far distance with it. But whilst around the camp area, nothing beats it, it's the ONLY torch I use;


And you can see a completely different reflector here;


For long distance, 603m (but will still light up a decent area, rather than being tunnel vision style of spot);


A variety I take when I'm out for a camping trip;




A few of the ones I have, of varying sizes, (with an 18650 battery on the right end for size comparison);


-------------------

I hope that helped clear things up a little. At the start of my collection if had a few LED Lenser torches because like yourselves I figured it does spot/flood, what more do I need. After having played with other torches, I got rid of all of my LED Lensers as I found them to be a compromise in everything and not excel at anything in particular.

Whichever hobby you have, the more now about it the more you understand and can appreciate what is available. If you talk to someone who doesn't like cars, or enjoy driving, they might have a Perodua Myvi and say "well you only need to go from A to B". People like us know that it's more than just "A to B", because we have more interest and knowledge in cars. Similarly, a torch isn't as simple as "you just need it to light things up". If it was that simple people wouldn't spend £28 on an LED Lenser, but buy a £4.99 torch from B & Q. You are buying a £28 LED Lenser because you can appreciate it's better than a torch which costs a fiver, but also you might just not have seen a direct comparison with a torch that may cost a fair bit more - and therefore have seen a proper difference.

Sorry for the long post.
You had to ask.....
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      11-17-2017, 07:14 PM   #32
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      11-17-2017, 07:39 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Forinor View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Theone88 View Post
Thanks pal, any recommendations around the £50 mark?
This is where it can get complicated. Do you have a preference for/against any particular battery? Your typical AA/AAA batteries are much more readily available, but don't produce the most light out of a torch. The chemistry in these batteries doesn't allow maximum output. To get a brighter output, you're best with a Lithium type of battery (you can get Lithium AA batteries, but torches that can make use of an AA Lithium battery are very rare).

A common Lithium battery is either CR123, or an 18650. You can buy non-rechargeable or chargeable CR123s and 18650s only come in a rechargeable form.

Also, the majority of good torches tend to run on CR123A/18650 batteries.

If you can narrow which battery type, it will help me suggest a shortlist for torches.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SteveChester View Post
I bought a LED lenser last year but I don't how/what all the different modes are and how you change in between them?
I'm afraid I have forgotten how to change the different settings in a Led Lenser.
I'd probably say 18650 or AA.

Thanks again!
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      11-17-2017, 07:51 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Theone88 View Post
I'd probably say 18650 or AA.

Thanks again!
Going with the 18650 (fine choice);

Fenix PD32 2016 edition would be a great start. This thing will be a great companion when you need light in all sorts of different situations, and will last you a lifetime if you don't abuse it.

https://www.heinnie.com/fenix-pd32-2016-xp-l-hi
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      11-17-2017, 08:09 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dr Forinor View Post
If you have a look at a good quality torch which isn't adjustable for spot/flood, you will see the beam pattern actually caters for spot and flood.

The spot/flood torch is great for spot, but actually quite crap in flood. But the problem with a spot is in darkness it creates tunnel vision which can be really annoying. And when you use flood on that torch, you will find that the majority of lighting up is done around the periphery of the "flood circle". If you now compare that to a torch which is "generic" (meaning can't adjusted for spot/flood) you will find that it actually lights up just as much area as you would expect the LED Lenser to do in flood, but you have a really useable light in the center of the area that's being lit up. The ONLY one time the spot/flood torch is better than a standard one is when you use spot, but then since that creates tunnel vision I never use spot, therefore a spot/flood torch is useless to me. And with a torch that isn't able to adjust from spot to flood, but you are doing something task specific, then you simply lower the lumen setting and it works great.

Colour temperature, meaning either 4500k or 6000k etc, that's obviously personal preference, but after a few years of trying different colour temperatures I find my eyes strain a lot less (I think there is some science behind it) with a colour temperature that is more neutral, ie closer to the sun's colour temperature. That is most usually 4000-4500k, and you find that your eyes adjust a lot easier to this temperature than a torch which has a much colder temperature of say 6000k or 6500k which has a blue tinge to it. Again this is only noticeable with direct comparison, but once you see it, you can't unsee it, or that's true at least in my case.

High CRI I find very important because it actually allows you to see colours for the colours that they are. If you don't understand this High CRI concept then this may sound silly, but again there is sound science behind this. CRI stands for Colour Rendition Index, and not all torches have high CRI, most are closer to 80ish, which has light that doesn't allow visiblity of all of the colours of any given object to close accuracy. Why is this handy? Well for example in the woods, with a torch that has low CRI, it will be harder to distinguish the difference between mud/soil and dog poo for example. A torch with high CRI the difference is so much more visible, the different shades are much more clearly differentiated. That may also have applications in mechanics where you are trying to find a very specific colour of wire. A high CRI torch will much better assist you in your purpose. And then there is a survival aspect to this also (not saying that it's my reason, but it's a valid reason), where if you need specific types of wood for fire burning, or specific types of tinder for starting a fire, a torch which is high CRI will allow you to be able to tell the difference between different trees by the colour or different greens for tinder.

I enjoy camping a lot, and this is where I am able to try out the difference between a whole range of torches that offer many variabilities. It's after trying them all out (and I have to stress it's much easier to see a clearer difference in complete darkness) in direct comparison that you can actually tell that there is a purpose to different torches, and also which are actually better.

You can actually go a lot more specific and have torches for different purposes, different number of LEDs create different beam patterns and spreads, different depths of reflectors (or sometimes lack thereof) create different beams, a shiny or dimpled/stippled/orange peel reflector creates a different beam pattern, all of which have their own uses.

---------------------

This is my high CRI or 92, with no reflector, creates the most useable light in a camping setting, but you can't see anything in the far distance with it. But whilst around the camp area, nothing beats it, it's the ONLY torch I use;


And you can see a completely different reflector here;


For long distance, 603m (but will still light up a decent area, rather than being tunnel vision style of spot);


A variety I take when I'm out for a camping trip;




A few of the ones I have, of varying sizes, (with an 18650 battery on the right end for size comparison);


-------------------

I hope that helped clear things up a little. At the start of my collection if had a few LED Lenser torches because like yourselves I figured it does spot/flood, what more do I need. After having played with other torches, I got rid of all of my LED Lensers as I found them to be a compromise in everything and not excel at anything in particular.

Whichever hobby you have, the more now about it the more you understand and can appreciate what is available. If you talk to someone who doesn't like cars, or enjoy driving, they might have a Perodua Myvi and say "well you only need to go from A to B". People like us know that it's more than just "A to B", because we have more interest and knowledge in cars. Similarly, a torch isn't as simple as "you just need it to light things up". If it was that simple people wouldn't spend £28 on an LED Lenser, but buy a £4.99 torch from B & Q. You are buying a £28 LED Lenser because you can appreciate it's better than a torch which costs a fiver, but also you might just not have seen a direct comparison with a torch that may cost a fair bit more - and therefore have seen a proper difference.

Sorry for the long post.
Finally, someone who can shed some light on the subject.
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      11-19-2017, 06:04 PM   #36
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Am I the only one old enough to remember Torchy the battery boy
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      11-19-2017, 08:01 PM   #37
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That was an interesting read! Thanks! No apology required.

That’s some crazy collection dude!

P.s. still a little confused about basic and complex uses mind.....
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      11-20-2017, 02:25 AM   #38
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Need more lumens.

I have 4000, which when searching for the dog on a dark morning walk, pretty much turns night to day.

I bought one of these a couple of years ago.
https://www.amazon.com/Flashlight-Sky-Ray-3XT6-818-5-Mode-2x18650/dp/B011ZJ68X2
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      11-20-2017, 04:56 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Russbmw View Post
That’s some crazy collection dude!
I haven't actually shown my full collection....

Quote:
Originally Posted by Russbmw View Post
P.s. still a little confused about basic and complex uses mind.....
What I meant by basic was that it's a torch, complex meaning the requirements from the torch as per my shortlist that I look for in a torch as opposed to "give me some light".

Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyTo View Post
I have 4000, which when searching for the dog on a dark morning walk, pretty much turns night to day.
That big one in my picture, to the furthest left, has 6000 lumens.
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