[kern417]

Originally Posted by baldeagleman

Gapped to 0.022". That was my first pull with them installed on that tune. It was also raining outside, so not really ideal conditions. Once they have a bit more time I'm hoping I can get those timing corrections down a bit.

For things like that, I'd recommend either reflashing the tune or reset adaptations to speed up the learning process.

[baldeagleman]

Originally Posted by kern417

For things like that, I'd recommend either reflashing the tune or reset adaptations to speed up the learning process.

Yeah, I did reflash the tune, I have about 30 miles on it right now. At that point I had about 20.

[kern417]

Originally Posted by baldeagleman

Yeah, I did reflash the tune, I have about 30 miles on it right now. At that point I had about 20.

Gotcha. Yeah it shouldn't take that long. Just keep an eye on it, there could be a lot of factors that play into it. Make sure all of your coilpacks are pushed down all the way, your intake filter isn't dirty, etc etc etc.

[luke79]

Hi, just installed 300 cell catted HJS DP + bm3 OTS stage 2 93
http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e5e76c7d10b433a8b85af8f

What you think ?
Why boost is dropping 1 psi in after 6000 rpm ? It was more consistent in this range in stage 1 ... (http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e303d58c090c621b75e2af1)

[alyabiev]

Originally Posted by luke79

Hi, just installed 300 cell catted HJS DP + bm3 OTS stage 2 93
http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e5e76c7d10b433a8b85af8f

What you think ?
Why boost is dropping 1 psi in after 6000 rpm ? It was more consistent in this range in stage 1 ... (http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e303d58c090c621b75e2af1)

Blue - first link.
Red - second link.

Boost profile is identical after 4000RPM. You got some major throttle closure due to overload at 3000RPM that occured due overboost.

It's also strange too see exact same AFR, load and timing profile both in stage 1 and 2. Maybe the only difference between these maps is the requested load in mid RPM range? Or these logs are made on the same map?

[luke79]

Originally Posted by alyabiev

Boost profile is identical after 4000RPM. You got some major throttle closure due to overload at 3000RPM that occured due overboost.

It's also strange too see exact same AFR, load and timing profile both in stage 1 and 2. Maybe the only difference between these maps is the requested load in mid RPM range? Or these logs are made on the same map?

Thanks for your comments, the maps are :
1st link: bm3 OTS Stage 2 93 octane map
2nd link: bm3 OTS Stage 1 93 octane map

Are those numbers satisfying for a stage 2 with catted DP?

PS : What's this software to make the charts?
Thanks!

[Nugget]

Originally Posted by kern417

def add some ethanol to get that timing up. that's less than our 91oct maps

This will end up wherever is safe for the fuel.
Then I'm going to get a seperate e85 map done for me.

[alyabiev]

Originally Posted by luke79

Thanks for your comments, the maps are :
1st link: bm3 OTS Stage 2 93 octane map
2nd link: bm3 OTS Stage 1 93 octane map

Are those numbers satisfying for a stage 2 with catted DP?

PS : What's this software to make the charts?
Thanks!

The only difference I see is that Stage 2 has just a bit more torque in mid RPM, that's it. Everything else is the same.
OTS maps are not editable, so I can't tell if that equality is normal.

I would expect any generic Stage 2 map to have a just bit more timing advance through all RPM range, more boost and richer AFRs than Stage 1 to use an advantage of a high flow downpipe.

The software is LogViewer from EpifanSoftware. My version is embedded in a MazdaEdit suite which I use to tune MPS / Mazdaspeed vehicles.

[kern417]

Originally Posted by alyabiev

The only difference I see is that Stage 2 has just a bit more torque in mid RPM, that's it. Everything else is the same.
OTS maps are not editable, so I can't tell if that equality is normal.

I would expect any generic Stage 2 map to have a just bit more timing advance through all RPM range, more boost and richer AFRs than Stage 1 to use an advantage of a high flow downpipe.

Look at the 2nd post of this thread. I brought this up in the first couple pages of the thread. My motivation to create this was because I had a hunch that stg 1 and stg 2 were the same. MHD makes more boost in the midrange but BM3 seems to be the same. Only timing increases with different octane, but not stg 1 to stg 2.

I've had similar experience on prev cars. I don't understand why the downpipe would be a limiting factor in how much boost you can make. It should react similar to an intake. It allows your powerband to be wider.

[alyabiev]

Originally Posted by kern417

Look at the 2nd post of this thread. I brought this up in the first couple pages of the thread. My motivation to create this was because I had a hunch that stg 1 and stg 2 were the same. MHD makes more boost in the midrange but BM3 seems to be the same. Only timing increases with different octane, but not stg 1 to stg 2.

I've had similar experience on prev cars. I don't understand why the downpipe would be a limiting factor in how much boost you can make. It should react similar to an intake. It allows your powerband to be wider.

High flow downpipe has less exhaust backpressure effect compared to an OEM unit, thus requiring less WGDC to hit the same load/boost. Different perspective: same WGDC would provide more load/boost.

[InstigatorX]

Thoughts on why boost level is so low? Timing is higher than normal.

https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436729
https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436851

MHD ST1 v3.0 + xHP ST2 on 2018 440i. Fuel = 93/E10 with 2 gals of E85 (really E75)...E18-ish.

[kern417]

Originally Posted by InstigatorX

Thoughts on why boost level is so low? Timing is higher than normal.

https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436729
https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436851

MHD ST1 v3.0 + xHP ST2 on 2018 440i. Fuel = 93/E10 with 2 gals of E85 (really E75)...E18-ish.

Looks like you have a boost leak somewhere. Do you have an aftermarket intake or chargepipe?

[OzBMR]

Originally Posted by InstigatorX

Thoughts on why boost level is so low? Timing is higher than normal.

https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436729
https://datazap.me/u/instigatorx/log-1583436851

MHD ST1 v3.0 + xHP ST2 on 2018 440i. Fuel = 93/E10 with 2 gals of E85 (really E75)...E18-ish.

Put more fuel in your car 4 liters is very low and DME is likely limiting boost over X RPM as a result

If you look at the Load Target to Load Actual and Boost Target the car is getting exactly what the DME is asking

Timing is high because Load is low, normal

[InstigatorX]

Originally Posted by OzBMR

Put more fuel in your car 4 liters is very low and DME is likely limiting boost over X RPM as a result

If you look at the Load Target to Load Actual and Boost Target the car is getting exactly what the DME is asking

Timing is high because Load is low, normal

That's what I was hoping. I had same thoughts. Targets were aligned to actuals.

Thx!

[Isoleucine]

I got my first logging runs in this evening, and I was a little surprised by the timing correction since I at least wasn't expecting it to pull any in the Stage 1 run. Not sure if that's normal/expected or above average, and how to fix it if it's higher than it should be.

MHD Stage 1: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-1-3-5
MHD Stage 2: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-2-3-6

I've daily-driven the car with either tune in the past and they both feel nice and smooth, just want to make sure there aren't issues I'm overlooking. Wish I could find a 93 octane pump somewhere nearby, but sadly everything here is all only 91.

[enemigo13]

your wgdc is sky high, you probably have boost leak

Originally Posted by Isoleucine

I got my first logging runs in this evening, and I was a little surprised by the timing correction since I at least wasn't expecting it to pull any in the Stage 1 run. Not sure if that's normal/expected or above average, and how to fix it if it's higher than it should be.

MHD Stage 1: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-1-3-5
MHD Stage 2: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-2-3-6

I've daily-driven the car with either tune in the past and they both feel nice and smooth, just want to make sure there aren't issues I'm overlooking. Wish I could find a 93 octane pump somewhere nearby, but sadly everything here is all only 91.

[OzBMR]

Originally Posted by enemigo13

your wgdc is sky high, you probably have boost leak

Check out the ambient pressure, very low, high altitude? May explain the relatively high WGDC to achieve the load target.

Originally Posted by Isoleucine

I got my first logging runs in this evening, and I was a little surprised by the timing correction since I at least wasn't expecting it to pull any in the Stage 1 run. Not sure if that's normal/expected or above average, and how to fix it if it's higher than it should be.

MHD Stage 1: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-1-3-5
MHD Stage 2: https://datazap.me/u/isoleucine/2017...hd-stage-2-3-6

I've daily-driven the car with either tune in the past and they both feel nice and smooth, just want to make sure there aren't issues I'm overlooking. Wish I could find a 93 octane pump somewhere nearby, but sadly everything here is all only 91.

I think the logs look pretty good considering the gas you have access to. E85 would help.

[OzBMR]

Originally Posted by luke79

Hi, just installed 300 cell catted HJS DP + bm3 OTS stage 2 93
http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e5e76c7d10b433a8b85af8f

What you think ?
Why boost is dropping 1 psi in after 6000 rpm ? It was more consistent in this range in stage 1 ... (http://www.bootmod3.net/log?id=5e303d58c090c621b75e2af1)

This would make a great advertisement for a high flow downpipe. If you account for the additional boost below 4000 RPM you can see for the same boost and timing that there is about 15 HP and 15 lbft of torque gained by adding the downpipe, up to close to 6000 RPM. As already noted by others not much difference in the actual tunes from Stage 1 to Stage 2 in BM3.

The power and torque figures here are low because you did the runs both uphill as noted in your log files.

[Isoleucine]

Originally Posted by OzBMR

Check out the ambient pressure, very low, high altitude? May explain the relatively high WGDC to achieve the load target.

Bingo, the density altitude around here is usually between 7,000 and 9,000 feet, maybe dipping to 6,500 on particularly cold days.

Originally Posted by OzBMR

I think the logs look pretty good considering the gas you have access to. E85 would help.

I do actually have access to E85 about 2 minutes away, but I haven't attempted any mixes yet. Is it possible to run an E30 mix with a stock vehicle (cats + fuel filter), and if so are you able to get enough fuel delivered to get noticeable improvements? It seems worthwhile to use just a little as an octane booster regardless, just wondering if it's worth switching to an E30 tune.

[OzBMR]

Originally Posted by Isoleucine

Bingo, the density altitude around here is usually between 7,000 and 9,000 feet, maybe dipping to 6,500 on particularly cold days

I do actually have access to E85 about 2 minutes away, but I haven't attempted any mixes yet. Is it possible to run an E30 mix with a stock vehicle (cats + fuel filter), and if so are you able to get enough fuel delivered to get noticeable improvements? It seems worthwhile to use just a little as an octane booster regardless, just wondering if it's worth switching to an E30 tune.

Yes, this is exactly what I've done for the past year. Octane booster will only assist chemically with knock resistance and it's very expensive. Ethanol will bring oxygen to the party as well as help you out with cooling the combustion mixture, which will be even hotter at altitude.

You will struggle with adding much E85 on the BM3 OTS tunes because they load up the boost around 3000 RPM, typically 18 - 19 PSI, and the high pressure fuel pump being cam based won't be able to maintain enough pressure in the fuel rail.

MHD limits low RPM boost to about 16 PSI around 3000 RPM, then ramps up from 5000 RPM towards redline. Their E30 OTS maps tend to have even lower initial boost and leaner AFR to 4500 RPM to also assist the HPFP.

I have a completely stock M140i and have been running E30 daily for over 7 months combined with MHD Stage 2 95_102 OTS.

For consistency I take 4 x 20L plastic fuel containers to my station and add 13 liters of good quality 93 and 7 liters of E85 to each.

If your E85 is actually 85% ethanol this results in E30. If it's 60% ethanol e.g. winter blend you'll end up with an E20 mix which will still give you very nice gains.

With E30 and MHD Stage 2 95_102 you'll have about 430 - 440 WHP at lower altitude. I run consistent 11.5@121mph at a drag strip inland a bit with a 2000ft DA.

Once you try it you'll find it very hard to go back to regular gas.

[Isoleucine]

That's great to hear. I know MHD actually has E30 maps directly that I'll probably try first, but otherwise I can simply run the higher octane maps with a little less E85. I know I'm a bit lucky because the local E85 station has been tested by other car folks and found to be solid year round, so that's a plus as well.

I'll have to fill it up with the Ethanol blend shortly and test again on the E30 map, hopefully with similar results to yours. The Virtual Dyno numbers for Stage 1 & 2 with stock cats/filter already pleasantly surprised me given the lower octane fuel here, but I'll never say no to additional power!

[OzBMR]

Originally Posted by Isoleucine

That's great to hear. I know MHD actually has E30 maps directly that I'll probably try first, but otherwise I can simply run the higher octane maps with a little less E85. I know I'm a bit lucky because the local E85 station has been tested by other car folks and found to be solid year round, so that's a plus as well.

I'll have to fill it up with the Ethanol blend shortly and test again on the E30 map, hopefully with similar results to yours. The Virtual Dyno numbers for Stage 1 & 2 with stock cats/filter already pleasantly surprised me given the lower octane fuel here, but I'll never say no to additional power!

I tried the MHD Stage 2 E30 map, the 95_102 map is a bit better I think