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      02-10-2019, 09:17 AM   #45
440iGCCB
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Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
I noticed that as well. It helps the lag below 3500 but really kicks when you open up.
So... What is your overall impression now that the tune has settled in? Worth the price of admission?

Thx
The power transformed my car so I will say 100% go for it. Warranty is big for me so I went dinan, but I can understand the want for flash for others.

I've done multiple flashes and I trust a piggyback more these days with the factory DME left to its own logic. I'm in the minority I'm sure, but I also ran 5 different piggybacks and never had a good experience with JB4/stage1, and a jerky delivery from AA active-8.
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      02-10-2019, 03:30 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
I've done multiple flashes and I trust a piggyback more these days with the factory DME left to its own logic. I'm in the minority I'm sure, but I also ran 5 different piggybacks and never had a good experience with JB4/stage1, and a jerky delivery from AA active-8.
Thatís very interesting. I am not sure I would trust a box to alter signals to the DME making it think things are one thing when they really arenít... interesting.
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      02-10-2019, 03:46 PM   #47
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Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
I've done multiple flashes and I trust a piggyback more these days with the factory DME left to its own logic. I'm in the minority I'm sure, but I also ran 5 different piggybacks and never had a good experience with JB4/stage1, and a jerky delivery from AA active-8.
That’s very interesting. I am not sure I would trust a box to alter signals to the DME making it think things are one thing when they really aren’t... interesting.
Personal experience. Protunes and flashes (APR, Cobb, GIAC) all had issues. If we are talking Bmw MPPK flash, 110% preferred. I don't trust after market engineers rewriting all the tables, eliminating bmws stock code. From experience, I have been safer with leaving Bmw tables to figure out these conservative additive 3-4psi boosts targets. Also with the b58 from what I understand, piggybacks work quite well due to the wideband O2 sensors for AFR. Seems to be fine for me so far.
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      02-11-2019, 02:58 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
Personal experience. Protunes and flashes (APR, Cobb, GIAC) all had issues. If we are talking Bmw MPPK flash, 110% preferred. I don't trust after market engineers rewriting all the tables, eliminating bmws stock code. From experience, I have been safer with leaving Bmw tables to figure out these conservative additive 3-4psi boosts targets. Also with the b58 from what I understand, piggybacks work quite well due to the wideband O2 sensors for AFR. Seems to be fine for me so far.
Going to Atco or NE Dragway anytime soon? Interested to see track times and Iíll be happy to come down and provide some friendly competition!
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      02-11-2019, 09:30 AM   #49
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Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
Personal experience. Protunes and flashes (APR, Cobb, GIAC) all had issues. If we are talking Bmw MPPK flash, 110% preferred. I don't trust after market engineers rewriting all the tables, eliminating bmws stock code. From experience, I have been safer with leaving Bmw tables to figure out these conservative additive 3-4psi boosts targets. Also with the b58 from what I understand, piggybacks work quite well due to the wideband O2 sensors for AFR. Seems to be fine for me so far.
Going to Atco or NE Dragway anytime soon? Interested to see track times and I’ll be happy to come down and provide some friendly competition!
I wish I had time to go, doubtful though
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      02-12-2019, 12:17 AM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
Personal experience. Protunes and flashes (APR, Cobb, GIAC) all had issues. If we are talking Bmw MPPK flash, 110% preferred. I don't trust after market engineers rewriting all the tables, eliminating bmws stock code. From experience, I have been safer with leaving Bmw tables to figure out these conservative additive 3-4psi boosts targets. Also with the b58 from what I understand, piggybacks work quite well due to the wideband O2 sensors for AFR. Seems to be fine for me so far.
I might have one up on you! I've been tuning my cars for over 20 years...I've flashed with APR, Neuspeed, Cobb, GIAC, Unitronic, Dinan, HCP, Mission, VF, etc....as well as piggies such as JB4s, JB+, AA8, etc.. Often I worked directly with the tuners or even writers for magazine features to get the tuning right on dynos & very heavy street logging is involved. We're talking years of dragstrip, track time, and constant renewal of my race certification often to test tunes under intense conditions. If I were to guess, I've flashed my cars over this span over 200 times cumulatively...

Unfortunately, I don't agree that flashes are more problematic than piggies. That could possibly be stated for older software management protocols but modern flashes keep most of the oem code intact and these companies are a lot more sophisticated than they have been in the past. I've often seen more cars jerking from shifts and shooting black smoke or even detonating beyond repair from piggies than from flashes. Especially on heavy track usage.

These companies are more aware than ever because of social media and forum backlash and are much more careful than they have been in the past. There's a reason they offer stages for the gas and modifications per car. For the most part I haven't heard of many engines blowing on tunes outside of very custom cars going for mega horsepower. Modern engines are always factory tuned severely under-spec to preserve longevity and reliability. But in reality for the most part these power-plants are much more robust than people believe. Maybe not Alfa Romeo..

Anyhow, take this with a grain of salt, of course. Everyone has different levels and thresholds for accepting risk imho. :
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      02-12-2019, 02:48 PM   #51
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I wish I had time to go, doubtful though
Any weekend, Iíll let you know when I go.
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      02-12-2019, 10:21 PM   #52
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TreDirtyFive View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by 440iGCCB View Post
Personal experience. Protunes and flashes (APR, Cobb, GIAC) all had issues. If we are talking Bmw MPPK flash, 110% preferred. I don't trust after market engineers rewriting all the tables, eliminating bmws stock code. From experience, I have been safer with leaving Bmw tables to figure out these conservative additive 3-4psi boosts targets. Also with the b58 from what I understand, piggybacks work quite well due to the wideband O2 sensors for AFR. Seems to be fine for me so far.
I might have one up on you! I've been tuning my cars for over 20 years...I've flashed with APR, Neuspeed, Cobb, GIAC, Unitronic, Dinan, HCP, Mission, VF, etc....as well as piggies such as JB4s, JB+, AA8, etc.. Often I worked directly with the tuners or even writers for magazine features to get the tuning right on dynos & very heavy street logging is involved. We're talking years of dragstrip, track time, and constant renewal of my race certification often to test tunes under intense conditions. If I were to guess, I've flashed my cars over this span over 200 times cumulatively...

Unfortunately, I don't agree that flashes are more problematic than piggies. That could possibly be stated for older software management protocols but modern flashes keep most of the oem code intact and these companies are a lot more sophisticated than they have been in the past. I've often seen more cars jerking from shifts and shooting black smoke or even detonating beyond repair from piggies than from flashes. Especially on heavy track usage.

These companies are more aware than ever because of social media and forum backlash and are much more careful than they have been in the past. There's a reason they offer stages for the gas and modifications per car. For the most part I haven't heard of many engines blowing on tunes outside of very custom cars going for mega horsepower. Modern engines are always factory tuned severely under-spec to preserve longevity and reliability. But in reality for the most part these power-plants are much more robust than people believe. Maybe not Alfa Romeo..

Anyhow, take this with a grain of salt, of course. Everyone has different levels and thresholds for accepting risk imho. :
I hear ya. Unfortunately I didn't have a good experience. I wouldn't sway anyone to go either route, to each their own. It's just what works for me and the limited time I'm willing to waste on cars outside of my normal life.
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