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BMW 3-Series and 4-Series Forum (F30 / F32) | F30POST > Technical Forums > N20, N26, B46, B48 Turbo Engine / Drivetrain / Exhaust Modifications > N20 spa custom turbo manifold interest post
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View Poll Results: INTEREST IN SPA N20 CUSTOM TURBO MANIFOLD
Yes I'm interested. 19 90.48%
No I am not interested. 2 9.52%
Voters: 21. You may not vote on this poll

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      10-27-2020, 03:48 PM   #1
navardi
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N20 spa custom turbo manifold interest post

Hi gang, I am in talks with SPA USA regarding production of a N20 Turbo Manifold for external turbo setups, since current off the shelf turbos limit the max power to around 380hp (dyno dependent) there is room for more power.
You might go "stage 2 turbo's blow up N20s" yes if you just increase the boost especially in the low rpm band, however a bigger turbo allows more air flow at a lower boost level and since I am well experienced in this motor, its confident to say the N20 can see over 400whp with the right turbo configuration.

SPA have said they need at a minimum of 50 people interested in the community to justify making the tooling and start production if you're interested let me know in the polls and I will get back to them and see if we can start talking pricing 🙂.

This is just an interest poll not a commitment to purchase poll. Please keep it specific to the N20 in the comments Cheers.

If you're interested please select "yes" if you're not interested please refrain from commenting. Thank you all. 💪

Last edited by navardi; 10-28-2020 at 02:42 PM..
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      10-27-2020, 07:27 PM   #2
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Is this just n20 or n26 as well?
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      10-27-2020, 08:23 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rcaso26 View Post
Is this just n20 or n26 as well?
Same physical engine, so this goes for both N20 and N26 yes.
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      11-03-2020, 09:47 PM   #4
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Across 3 other platforms we're now at 60 votes and SPA are now talking design format etc. There is definitely something on the horizon.
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      11-05-2020, 05:55 PM   #5
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Hopefully you mentioned and they can accommodate external wastegate setups for turbos? Most aftermarket options do not have internal gates and I would never have a internal gated aftermarket turbo as boost control is far superior with an external boost controller.
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      11-08-2020, 06:47 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D041987 View Post
Hopefully you mentioned and they can accommodate external wastegate setups for turbos? Most aftermarket options do not have internal gates and I would never have a internal gated aftermarket turbo as boost control is far superior with an external boost controller.
A few options are in the works, from a simplicity pov internally wastegated setups might appeal to more people especially since it allows for an individual to retain the EWG solenoid on EWG cars not to mention the ability for those members to maintain tuning from the factory ecu. But both options of internal WG and external WG are being bounced around currently with SPA. Across 2 sites we have 60 people interested the more people voting the better. However already talking directly with the engineers at spa for a setup.

As per your comment regarding external boost controllers having far superior boost control over factory. That doesn't make alot of sense factory setup whilst complicated to alot of people who are unfamiliar with load based tuning, its extremely accurate and will always deliver the same consistent power and tq regardless of factors such as altitude etc. Not to mention that the factory DME software can be tuned up to 5Bar of boost with the right supporting setup, whilst maintaining things like PID etc.

On another note turbo smarts External electronic wastegates should interface with the factory ewg setup on ewg N20s, however needs to be tested. This would bridge the gap with EWG N20s and using external WG on them relying on an external boost control system piggybacking on the factory DME.

Last edited by navardi; 11-08-2020 at 06:56 AM..
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      11-09-2020, 02:57 PM   #7
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Sorry, I guess I am a little old school in terms of tuning cars. Coming from Subaru, Evo, Supra days. You are correct, simplicity is the masses here for BMW and most are not willing to build their cars to get High HP and prices are high on BMW parts compared to other manufacturers. Not to mention you need to fork over about 5K for a built motor and when doing big turbo that's gonna be another 5 k cause you need to factor in fuel upgrades as well. Pretty standard 10K for most cars when doing all out big turbo to support 600WHP+.

You made good points and I do not disagree but there are advantages to both setups and disadvantages.

Three advantages to External wastegate and controller is that fact that you can tune the GAIN and BOOST control on the fly in the cabin in matter of seconds to modulate the amount of power and how it comes on.
Also with having a external gate you can change the springs which it allows for better control during tuning and when boost comes on.
Lastly you can choose the gate size. This can eliminate boost creep which can and does occur on small internal gated setups or small fast spooling turbos and also large turbos that push a lot of air.

Also BM3 has the option to completely turn off the EWG now and they did this because when going to bigger turbos control is better with an external gated setup and you have far more choices for turbos at that point as well.

But either way. I think it's great N20 will be getting some kind of love to venture into the big turbo setups with built motors. You are doing a great job into brining this to this platform! Be nice to see internal gated options and external gated options with dump to atmosphere to suit both flavors. Or maybe make the merg collector to turbo flange a little longer so one can modify and add the external gate if they choose to.
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      11-09-2020, 04:28 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by D041987 View Post
Sorry, I guess I am a little old school in terms of tuning cars. Coming from Subaru, Evo, Supra days. You are correct, simplicity is the masses here for BMW and most are not willing to build their cars to get High HP and prices are high on BMW parts compared to other manufacturers. Not to mention you need to fork over about 5K for a built motor and when doing big turbo that's gonna be another 5 k cause you need to factor in fuel upgrades as well. Pretty standard 10K for most cars when doing all out big turbo to support 600WHP+.

You made good points and I do not disagree but there are advantages to both setups and disadvantages.

Three advantages to External wastegate and controller is that fact that you can tune the GAIN and BOOST control on the fly in the cabin in matter of seconds to modulate the amount of power and how it comes on.
Also with having a external gate you can change the springs which it allows for better control during tuning and when boost comes on.
Lastly you can choose the gate size. This can eliminate boost creep which can and does occur on small internal gated setups or small fast spooling turbos and also large turbos that push a lot of air.

Also BM3 has the option to completely turn off the EWG now and they did this because when going to bigger turbos control is better with an external gated setup and you have far more choices for turbos at that point as well.

But either way. I think it's great N20 will be getting some kind of love to venture into the big turbo setups with built motors. You are doing a great job into brining this to this platform! Be nice to see internal gated options and external gated options with dump to atmosphere to suit both flavors. Or maybe make the merg collector to turbo flange a little longer so one can modify and add the external gate if they choose to.

Well said couldn't agree more. Appreciate your input.

I think SPA will focus on internal gates options to start, with external gates coming at a later date.


Big things are happening for our little motor!
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