[n55david]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Another quick update that my setup is currently holding 22.9psi @ 15.5deg to redline, and it's fast & buttery smooth. Can't share logs, yet, tho...

Also, Chris at Dorch changed up the HPFP tables for my Stage 1 HPFP to get some increased flow, which is now allowing me to do 4th/5th gear pulls with E50 @ 30F without HPFP drop-outs!

Chris said once they get more testing with the settings, they may get pushed out to Dorch Stg 1 users at some point. So, you guys are welcome! Actually, just go buy a Stg 2 HPFP!

sounds good.

is this a single map or multimap?

how is the part throttle stuff? if I run the current multimap qith my setup it will have all kinds of throttle boost issues and I'll get a check engine light and map code and all kinds of bad harsh issues. single map I'm fine.

[ZM2]

Originally Posted by Phantom10R

sounds good.

is this a single map or multimap?

how is the part throttle stuff? if I run the current multimap qith my setup it will have all kinds of throttle boost issues and I'll get a check engine light and map code and all kinds of bad harsh issues. single map I'm fine.

Single map for now, and the idea is to bake in the outcome into the Multimap down the road.

No part throttle issues. The map runs super smooth and strong!

One clarifying point I'll make for the Dorch Stg 1 users is even with Chris's updates it's still not strong enough to handle an abrupt kickdown at this power level with E50 and ambient temps <40F--I'll still get HPFP drop-outs.

So, I'm just going to stick to the single gear pulls to help with map development, and then will personally decide if I'll just run Stg 2+ E30 in colder weather to not have HPFP kickdown drop-outs, or get a Stg 2 HPFP and run the Stg 2+ E50 map and E50 all year round and just cringe when it takes my car 5-10sec to crank over on a cold winter start.

[n55david]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Single map for now, and the idea is to bake in the outcome into the Multimap down the road.

No part throttle issues. The map runs super smooth and strong!

One clarifying point I'll make for the Dorch Stg 1 users is even with Chris's updates it's still not strong enough to handle an abrupt kickdown at this power level with E50 and ambient temps <40F--I'll still get HPFP drop-outs.

So, I'm just going to stick to the single gear pulls to help with map development, and then will personally decide if I'll just run Stg 2+ E30 in colder weather to not have HPFP kickdown drop-outs, or get a Stg 2 HPFP and run the Stg 2+ E50 map and E50 all year round and just cringe when it takes my car 5-10sec to crank over on a cold winter start.

all good info. now correctly me if I'm wrong.. but with the single map, even if it's custom rom enabled you'd have to run at least e50 since it won't adjust, correct?

[ZM2]

Originally Posted by Phantom10R

all good info. now correctly me if I'm wrong.. but with the single map, even if it's custom rom enabled you'd have to run at least e50 since it won't adjust, correct?

That's right.

Halim tends to be slightly conservative since he knows not everyone is running an ethanol sensor and might accidently mix lower to say E45, so I'm guessing E45 and up will be fine.

Once/if this gets integrated into the Multimap, it'll be interesting to see the differences with the current Multimap since it does not change boost target and I do not see any way to push 93 octane to 23psi even with lower timing.

Maybe both live boost & timing adjustments in a Multimap based on fuel is coming in CustomROM v2? IDK.

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by ZM2

That's right.

Halim tends to be slightly conservative since he knows not everyone is running an ethanol sensor and might accidently mix lower to say E45, so I'm guessing E45 and up will be fine.

Once/if this gets integrated into the Multimap, it'll be interesting to see the differences with the current Multimap, as it does not change boost target and I do not see any way to push 93 octane to 23psi even with lower timing.

Maybe both live boost & timing adjustments in the Multimap based on fuel is coming in CustomROM v2? IDK.

Wait so are you saying this is the same boost target as 2+ E30 map?

[n55david]

Originally Posted by thejeremyman9

Wait so are you saying this is the same boost target as 2+ E30 map?

not what he's saying

[n55david]

Originally Posted by ZM2

That's right.

Halim tends to be slightly conservative since he knows not everyone is running an ethanol sensor and might accidently mix lower to say E45, so I'm guessing E45 and up will be fine.

Once/if this gets integrated into the Multimap, it'll be interesting to see the differences with the current Multimap, as it does not change boost target and I do not see any way to push 93 octane to 23psi even with lower timing.

Maybe both live boost & timing adjustments in the Multimap based on fuel is coming in CustomROM v2? IDK.

shooting you a dm

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by Phantom10R

not what he's saying

ah i just re-read: he saying mulitmap doesnt change the boost target

[rtl32]

Originally Posted by ZM2

That's right.

Halim tends to be slightly conservative since he knows not everyone is running an ethanol sensor and might accidently mix lower to say E45, so I'm guessing E45 and up will be fine.

Once/if this gets integrated into the Multimap, it'll be interesting to see the differences with the current Multimap since it does not change boost target and I do not see any way to push 93 octane to 23psi even with lower timing.

Maybe both live boost & timing adjustments in a Multimap based on fuel is coming in CustomROM v2? IDK.

Hold on, I thought you said in the Stage 2+ E30 thread that the 2+ multimap does scale down to pump when the sensor detects less ethanol?? Is this not the case?

EDIT:

I am now seeing that I am not only participating in both f87 and f30 flexfuel threads, but that m2 n55 stg2+ multimap has both 93 and the e30/r100 slots. So they scale to the lowest option on the map but not below that.

[NEWTRON]

Originally Posted by rtl32

Hold on, I thought you said in the Stage 2+ E30 thread that the 2+ multimap does scale down to pump when the sensor detects less ethanol?? Is this not the case?

It scales down the timing. The boost is constant.

[rtl32]

Originally Posted by NEWTRON

It scales down the timing. The boost is constant.

But what about fueling? Fuel tables for e30 are not appropriate for pump and vice versa. Timing already adjusts itself in a way- if I run 93 on a e30 map and it adjusts timing to not knock, great but if I'm still super rich/lean at full trim levels that's still not safe.

[ZM2]

Originally Posted by rtl32

Hold on, I thought you said in the Stage 2+ E30 thread that the 2+ multimap does scale down to pump when the sensor detects less ethanol?? Is this not the case?

EDIT:

I am now seeing that I am not only participating in both f87 and f30 flexfuel threads, but that m2 n55 stg2+ multimap has both 93 and the e30/r100 slots. So they scale to the lowest option on the map but not below that.

Yeah, the N55 EWG and M2 Stg 2+ Multimap map options are different, but it sounds like folks want them to be similar, and we were all trying to see how the Multimap's work with varying fuel, and my N55 EWG brethern seem to be more active over here in the F30 forum vs the F87 forum, so been posting details in both places to get input.

As for the Stg 2+ E50 beta map hitting 23psi, I don't see how that could be fully incorporated into a Stg 2H+++, Stg 3 (or whatever you want to call it, Phantom10R has some ideas ) Multimap, as I don't see how you could run that high of psi with just 93, even with reduced timing. But, I'm not the master tuner, so IDK.

I just got V5 of the Stg 2+ E50 beta this morning, so will send logs to Halim later today. From there, I'll see if he wants to recruit others to test this map, and then we'll see how Stg 2+ E50 OTS like boost & timing gets integrated into a new Multimap now, or if it needs to wait until CustomROM v2.

Everyone get all that? Simple, right? Hah!

[n55david]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Yeah, the N55 EWG and M2 Stg 2+ Multimap map options are different, but it sounds like folks want them to be similar, and we were all trying to see how the Multimap's work with varying fuel, and my N55 EWG brethern seem to be more active over here in the F30 forum vs the F87 forum, so been posting details in both places.

As for the Stg 2+ E50 beta map hitting 23psi, I don't see how that could be fully incorporated into a Stg 2H+++, Stg 3 (or whatever you want to call it, Phantom10R has some ideas ) Multimap, as I don't see how you could run that high of psi with just 93, even with reduced timing. But, I'm not the master tuner, so IDK.

I just got V5 of the Stg 2+ E50 beta this morning, so will send logs to Halim later today. From there, I'll see if he wants to recruit others to test this map, and then we'll see how Stg 2+ E50 OTS like boost & timing gets integrated into a new Multimap now, or if it needs to wait until CustomROM v2.

Everyone get all that? Simple, right? Hah!

LOL.. it either needs to be stage 3 OR and I'm leaning more towards a "stage 2h ++ r" just to be even more confusing.

this map needs to require hpfp, lpfp, turbo, map sensor and allow you to run e30 to e50 under the multimap name of stage 3 multimap

[MadToy]

Originally Posted by rtl32

Hold on, I thought you said in the Stage 2+ E30 thread that the 2+ multimap does scale down to pump when the sensor detects less ethanol?? Is this not the case?

EDIT:

I am now seeing that I am not only participating in both f87 and f30 flexfuel threads, but that m2 n55 stg2+ multimap has both 93 and the e30/r100 slots. So they scale to the lowest option on the map but not below that.

The M2 multi-map has a 93 option, so that would scale down. The standard N55 models only have E30 or race gas options, so they would be the base targets - so no 93 pump on that file yet (posted this before seeing that was added already)

I've built my own pump gas/E85 multi-map tune with my stock turbo and fuel system for now. It does indeed increase boost if you design it that way, but reality is the stock fueling and turbo can be pretty close to max on 93, so not much room to bump boost up with an E mix with stock HPFP. I would think the OTS multi-map was built around stock hardware limitations. So you're biggest gains are just in timing bumps. But I'll easily be able to turn it up a bit more once I get an HPFP upgrade.

[rtl32]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Yeah, the N55 EWG and M2 Stg 2+ Multimap map options are different, but it sounds like folks want them to be similar, and we were all trying to see how the Multimap's work with varying fuel, and my N55 EWG brethern seem to be more active over here in the F30 forum vs the F87 forum, so been posting details in both places to get input.

As for the Stg 2+ E50 beta map hitting 23psi, I don't see how that could be fully incorporated into a Stg 2H+++, Stg 3 (or whatever you want to call it, Phantom10R has some ideas ) Multimap, as I don't see how you could run that high of psi with just 93, even with reduced timing. But, I'm not the master tuner, so IDK.

I just got V5 of the Stg 2+ E50 beta this morning, so will send logs to Halim later today. From there, I'll see if he wants to recruit others to test this map, and then we'll see how Stg 2+ E50 OTS like boost & timing gets integrated into a new Multimap now, or if it needs to wait until CustomROM v2.

Everyone get all that? Simple, right? Hah!

So what we are really hoping for is customrom V2 to allow not only timing and fueling but also boost changes in the flexfuel integration. That would be amazing!!

Seems the multimaps all have their own boost level. Previously the multimap suggestions said deal with it, these are the fuels you can use at each stage because these are the boost levels we've tuned in. Now that they are pushing boundaries even further into E50 with more boost, like you said, they might be prompted to start bunching the maps together in a more useable way!

The current f2/3x flexfuel right now is basically neutered because of the software choices. Great I can see the percentage on my dash. But I still can't fill 93 or emixes flexibly on the spicy OTS 2+ tune that I am so used to. Obviously the tune will be more bland on 93, but the stage 2 tune that I need for 93 is even more bland on E30 considering what it is capable of!

I for one (and know the community) would love a simple, 2+ multimap that runs pump to E50 at each of their respective OTS limits. No Stage 2 compromise so that I can use 93, or stage 2+ high fueling standards that require an emix at baseline and leave me stuck between E30 and E45 on stage1 pump. An actual flexfuel setup at the full OTS potential.

And none is this is meant to slander PTF- let me note that flexfuel is SO new on this platform I am impressed that it is even at this level already.

This is groundbreaking stuff. Each time I say I'm gonna go custom PTF releases something new, and I love it. Now that I'm done with hardware on this build the software progression is what is keeping me reeled in!

[ZM2]

Halim is very happy with the Stg 2+ E50 V5 beta! He wants to see how logs look on a stock turbo car. Who wants to give it a shot?!

Just to be clear for anyone that wants to try, just make sure you already have solid Stg 2+ E30 logs and a 3.5-bar TMAP installed since we're upping the boost!

Lastly, if you have a Stage 1 HPFP, let me know if you have any HPFP drop outs. Between Chris Dorch's HPFP and Halim's tune updates, I no longer have any HPFP drop outs! I'm dipping to 1900psi under load and recovering back to 2800psi, but no drop outs during logs or kickdowns!

[johnung]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Halim is very happy with the Stg 2+ E50 V5 beta! He wants to see how logs look on a stock turbo car.

Who wants to give it a shot?!

I can do that pretty easily.

[ZM2]

Originally Posted by johnung

I can do that pretty easily.

Cool, I'll shoot you a PM.

Just to be clear for anyone that wants to try, just make sure you already have solid Stg 2+ E30 logs and a 3.5-bar TMAP installed since we're upping the boost!

johnung Your PM's are full!

[ctt300]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Halim is very happy with the Stg 2+ E50 V5 beta! He wants to see how logs look on a stock turbo car.

Who wants to give it a shot?!

I'll be glad to help out too!

[johnung]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Cool, I'll shoot you a PM.

Just to be clear for anyone that wants to try, just make sure you already have solid Stg 2+ E30 logs and a 3.5-bar TMAP installed since we're upping the boost!

johnung Your PM's are full!

PM'd you

[ZM2]

Hey guys, here's the update on what we're calling the N55 Stg 3 E50 beta map: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&postcount=439

Shout out to johnung for driving down to watch the dyno pulls and grabbing lunch together!

[thejeremyman9]

Originally Posted by ZM2

Hey guys, here's the update on what we're calling the N55 Stg 3 E50 beta map: https://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&postcount=439

Shout out to johnung for driving down to watch the dyno pulls and grabbing lunch together!

Do you have logs from those runs and what E% were you actually running in each?