[harveybajwa]

Hi all,

Going to check out a 2015 420d tomorrow with only 23k on the clock. Advertised with service history however rang BMW and found that it is not from main dealer, my concern is that with somebody who is unwilling to pay the little extra for dealer service, could they have clocked before selling?

Its at a well reviewed dealership so I do think Id have some sort of protection legal wise, however wandering whether there would be any tell tale signs on newer cars? I know the obvious ones, extra wear to interior, check service stamp mileages/reciepts etc. but are there any others ie. Should it still be on original pads/tyres etc? Checked the MOT and it was last MOTed March 2019 on 23k, MOT previous to that was April 2018 with 19k.

Also, has anyone any experience with buying a clocked car? How are you protected? In the event it is clocked, what rights do you have?

Further to this, anyone aware of any issues of the 2015 420D manuals?

Thanks in advance

[Billfitz]

Spinning back the odometer isn't as easy as it used to be, so it's probably legit. I only have 15k miles on my 2015.

[328iX]

I'd at least expect records for two oil changes, but then again I've seen lots of 15s with that mileage when searching for my car.

[harveybajwa]

Ah, maybe i'm thinking to deep into it. I wish I only travelled 4k a year, last year I clocked over 50k on my e90!

Ive seen plenty of 2015s with that kind of mileage, however the price on this is a bit lower than the others which has made me get my microscope out. However I guess the lower price (aprox 1k lower than similar cars) could be due to non-oem competition style wheels and non-dealer history?

[328iX]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Ah, maybe i'm thinking to deep into it. I wish I only travelled 4k a year, last year I clocked over 50k on my e90!

Ive seen plenty of 2015s with that kind of mileage, however the price on this is a bit lower than the others which has made me get my microscope out. However I guess the lower price (aprox 1k lower than similar cars) could be due to non-oem competition style wheels and non-dealer history?

Probably due to options and the market. With new g20

[harveybajwa]

Originally Posted by 328dX

Probably due to options and the market. With new g20

Thanks for help guys, will see what the deal is with it tomorrow. Hopefully new car day tomorrow if all is well

Any idea how I stand as a consumer if I take it to BMW and find it has been tampered with?

[328iX]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Thanks for help guys, will see what the deal is with it tomorrow. Hopefully new car day tomorrow if all is well

Any idea how I stand as a consumer if I take it to BMW and find it has been tampered with?

Probably not much you can do. They expect you to do research prior to purchase but if you have a warranty or something. Who knows. Also the physical appearance of the car should show low miles. Check the condition of the driver seat, under carriage etc.

[kingmonkey8]

Originally Posted by 328dX

Probably not much you can do. They expect you to do research prior to purchase but if you have a warranty or something. Who knows. Also the physical appearance of the car should show low miles. Check the condition of the driver seat, under carriage etc.

I remember seeing a Mercedes in a Mercedes dealership years ago that had low mileage but looking at the condition you could tell it had done more.
I don't think the beemers are as easy to clock as older cars.
For 23k miles, I would expect the car to look pretty much brand new.
Check the steering wheel, gear lever, seats and carpet for wear, these should be minimal.
Check to see how much stone chips on the front headlights and bumper. If it has a lot then it's a sign it's done high motorway miles.
For 23k it should still be on the original brake discs and pads. Also for the tyres. My tyres lasted for at least 35k miles.
For a newish car I would expect the oil changes to be done at the dealer as oil changes are not overly expensive.
Am a bit wary of buying cars with low, low mileage for the year. But my previous car, I only used on weekends as I worked away and travelled by train so was averaging around 5k a year.

[harveybajwa]

Went to view it today, trying to feed me a whole load of lies about how BMW must have forgotten to put the service history on and he'd chace it. Front pads needed replacing along with discs, back pads had recently been changed and the handbrake pads either were worn or the needed adjusting as it rolled if not left in gear! Seat bolsters were also worn, and the front BMW bonnet badge had a slight bit of corrosion? (Never seen this before) Car clearly had higher mileage. Was reluctant to give me a test drive, something regarding how fully booked they were with hand overs until he spoke with one of the owners who gave him the nod to let me test drive. Rear bumper also had some damage they tried to hide, told me they would paint the quarter panel as not even BMW can match a whole bumper repaint?

Told me they had only recieved the car last night and so hadn't had a chance to look the car over/get the paperwork sorted, however in the next sentence explained how the M performance kits were their own and not OEM, they supplied and fit them, along with the rep wheels and new tyres - so my question is when was this all fitted?

I was walking back up the road and overhead one of the owners on the phone to what I thought was a customer with the other owner quoting "well we've given him the warranties phone number its not our problem any more". Came across sly and told some blatant lies. Frustrating to see that they are operating as a legit front with 150+ reviews online, however a quick internet search clearly shows reviews from disgruntled ex-customers

The search continues

[kent11202]

Keep looking and don't engage them any further - this dealership, or at least the salesperson, cause me to doubt anything they say.

[Billfitz]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Any idea how I stand as a consumer if I take it to BMW and find it has been tampered with?

I can't say what BMW would do, but on this side of the pond rolling back an odometer is a felony, a Federal offense no less.

[DonJuan]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

I can't say what BMW would do, but on this side of the pond rolling back an odometer is a felony, a Federal offense no less.

How do you even roll back a digital odometer?

Is it that common over there that you have to worry about it? In the USA there are companies like Carfax that you buy a full report and history about the car. Besides no reputable dealer will risk their license.

[harveybajwa]

Originally Posted by DonJuan

How do you even roll back a digital odometer?

Is it that common over there that you have to worry about it? In the USA there are companies like Carfax that you buy a full report and history about the car. Besides no reputable dealer will risk their license.

Yeah very common in the UK, we have HPI checks/MOT checks etc. however as long as you roll back prior to going in for a service/MOT it all checks out through the checks. Frustrating as I have no issue with higher mileage cars or cars with issues, as long as there is honesty there and I know exactly what im spending my money on

[harveybajwa]

Originally Posted by kent11202

Keep looking and don't engage them any further - this dealership, or at least the salesperson, cause me to doubt anything they say.

Definitely will not be returning and will be letting anybody I know to atleast be cautious if dealing with them

[Billfitz]

Originally Posted by DonJuan

How do you even roll back a digital odometer?

AFAIK the odometer only shows the readout of what's stored in iDrive, so it wouldn't be easy. But iDrive is just a computer, and any computer can be hacked, so I guess it's possible.

[kingmonkey8]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Yeah very common in the UK, we have HPI checks/MOT checks etc. however as long as you roll back prior to going in for a service/MOT it all checks out through the checks. Frustrating as I have no issue with higher mileage cars or cars with issues, as long as there is honesty there and I know exactly what im spending my money on

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Yeah very common in the UK, we have HPI checks/MOT checks etc. however as long as you roll back prior to going in for a service/MOT it all checks out through the checks. Frustrating as I have no issue with higher mileage cars or cars with issues, as long as there is honesty there and I know exactly what im spending my money on

Yeah, it's funny when you check the MOT history and it shows the mileage being rolled back or the car's only done a few hundred miles in one year.

[kingmonkey8]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Told me they had only recieved the car last night and so hadn't had a chance to look the car over/get the paperwork sorted, however in the next sentence explained how the M performance kits were their own and not OEM, they supplied and fit them, along with the rep wheels and new tyres - so my question is when was this all fitted?

So it wasn't even a proper MSport...

[Derek Mc]

Hi,
A couple of observations to put forward:-
Having bought a "clocked" car I can tell you it is a 5 minute job with OBD to interrogate the ECU as mileage is logged on the odometer and in the ECU so hard to clock a car convincingly now. you can access the dash but would need to swap out the ECU I believe.
It would be worth looking at the geography possibly due to distance Main Dealer servicing is not practical?
Main Dealer (especially BMW and the like) is so far over the top that many buyers do choose to go off grid, My wife chose to do this even though her car is only an Astra Main Dealer servicing is three times the cost of non-franchise! all OEM parts and oils (well actually more expensive oil than Vx specify)

However all that said, this car still sounds like a true RVM car,,,,,
Whats an RVM car it's one that looks it's best as you see it shrink in your Rear View Mirror

[KRS_SN]

I went to see a car that had supposedly only done 25k miles. the dealer was based near Loughborough and name started with 'motor'. Since I already own bmws i was able to spot that a. idrive had no service history and b. the agent showed me a printout that showed how service had been carried out at 10k 20 k and finally ar 26k miles(though odometer only showed 25500 miles. Also the car had a bmw 5 year service pack but had no bmw dealer services.
Sad thing is once I rejected the car another buyer came along to buy it and it was gone in 3 hours. Poor fella.

[harveybajwa]

Originally Posted by KRS_SN

Sad thing is once I rejected the car another buyer came along to buy it and it was gone in 3 hours. Poor fella.

Sad thing is I keep seeing plenty of cars for sale on auto trader and the likes from this nottingham based dealer.. all the cars look shiny with the cheap m performance bits on, feel for the poor guys and gals that may end up with something they did not expect. Any place that such traders can be reported too?

[Derek Mc]

Originally Posted by harveybajwa

Sad thing is I keep seeing plenty of cars for sale on auto trader and the likes from this nottingham based dealer.. all the cars look shiny with the cheap m performance bits on, feel for the poor guys and gals that may end up with something they did not expect. Any place that such traders can be reported too?

Ping up a link I'd like to have a look at this "inventory"

[laser]

Carly OBD reader will check mileage from 3 or more ECUs on the car ......