02-14-2016, 12:57 PM | #353 | ||
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02-14-2016, 11:35 PM | #354 | |
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OP close thread please this has gone way off topic..
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02-15-2016, 10:33 AM | #355 |
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saw a RC-F on the street. looked real hard and finally realized it's the $80k RC-F.
sorry it just doesn't look like a car in that price range.
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02-27-2016, 04:55 AM | #356 |
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Not quite: BMW is making the Toyota-badged sports car, and Toyota sharing with BMW the hybrid tech. Toyota cannot make 6cyl plus engines no more than Honda proved being unable the last season in F1...
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02-27-2016, 05:29 AM | #357 | |
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http://www.acme.pwr.wroc.pl/repository/196/online.pdf (also attached) Take that metallurgy as a whole, the chassis, as well as the engine block, and hence the 5k-10000$ difference in cost between the Mercedes/Audi/BMW and the Japanese. Brakes as well- unless they put German/Italian brakes on the Japanese, the standard Japanese brakes are just waiting to fail at some unpredictable point. Swedish steel is also legendary. 13th C ship making, then 19th C railroads, HQ steel designed to expand and contract in Arctic winters,never fail with a train passing on top, why Volvos are the top rated for steel quality and the UK buying Swedish steel: http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news...wedish-6718098 As if not enough, German auto steel got better at all the above starting with the e90 series; lighter, stronger, non-corrosive...Pressured, Japanese reduced further their steel quality to compete with US and KOR companies...Japanese want to sell quantity, and design cars for their climate and short-life-cycle (7-10 yrs), while posing them as North American ready. Germans design cars for cold Alpine and European winters, and why you see so many sporty Germans still driven after 15 yrs. But they need a bit more maintenance. I think Nissan and Lexus make great sports cars, in some ways a bit more reliable, but best if kept in a friendly climate, not exposed to rain, and driven only a few summer months. Last F1 season and Honda proved how inept a top rated company was at designing a 6cyl performance engine after ditching the 6cyl R&D. Toyota is the same. They don't care about it, but pretend sports crowns. Last edited by Musashi; 02-27-2016 at 05:47 AM.. |
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02-27-2016, 06:47 AM | #358 | |
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Honda has one of the most storied traditions and history in F1 racing. Last year was the first year, believe that they'll be back with a vengeance. They've got the drivers, McLaren design, and Honda engineering. Can't keep a combo like that down for long. The Toyota parter ship with BMW is questionable, but I think the new Z5 will be a hit. As much as I hate Toyota, I do respect their hybrid tech.
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03-19-2016, 09:31 AM | #359 | |
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Honda engineering is passable at best. In fact, they likely have F1 hired engineering (Europeans), but, unlike BMW, Mercedes, Ferrari, Porsche, Audi or Renault there is no link between the Honda F1 motorsport racing and their automotive engine divisions. They had. Past. Their F1 stint is for marketing. Their F1 or F3 designers are for F1/F3. Whereas the giants have a clear organic link between high performance engineering and, ultimately, their production vehicles. Honda used to have it and left that mindset. Like Pontiac. Pan Am. They have a culture problem - and this is both expert opinion as well as that of Honda bosses. They were born, grew, and decayed. Current pursuit for viability, profit margin and competition with Koreans and Big 3 has had them get rid of everything that made them cutting edge at some point. Still drive my immaculate old Civic. Brings back many fond memories, but I still look at it as the past. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/24/bu...-ito.html?_r=0 http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...ter-ceo-switch So vengeance? I find it impossible. Its culture is neither quality nor performance oriented. Hierarchical, patronal, senior-oriented, from Europe to Japan HQ, it smell decay. They can't design a good chassis, high performance alloys, and all the things that matter to connoisseurs because they now cater, as one Honda Canada salesperson pushing a new Civic/Accord, towards "the new generation just entering the job market with modest means." All they do is reliability- and engine that can run 500 000 miles while everything around it rots every few years- chassis, panels, sub-chassis, paint, brake disks, callipers (2.5 yrs average for Canadian winters), suspension and more. TIn F1, they are trying to design what they do not believe in. Can you imagine what Mercedes, BMW or Audi would look like if they had the same philosophy? "Power of dreams." Outselling KIA. LMAO - not at you, but their culture. And a fully equipped Civic is as much as a base 3series or a CPO with low mileage.. ?!? Took my mother about 15 hrs worth fo phone calls to convince Honda to re-paint her car's oxidizing, peeling-off paint. Immaculate any other way. In the US they had a class action lawsuit that solved it for Americans. In Canada they gave her the runaround. Yes, appointment, No, Yes again, appointment, No, and, finally, they gave her the repaint. Not to mention the car had a paint recall from factory but only for the hood and fenders. Car looked like a Canadian sunburnt in Mexico. Welcome to disagree. You will agree end of 2016. And, if by miracle, they do score a couple of descent points, none of it will mean anything for their auto sector. Just because a former Honda CEO realizes they need to get into it, does not mean Honda knows what that means. +1 to your Toyota/BMW comment. But let's be pragmatic: BMW is designing Toyota's supercar, from chassis to engine, and it will be the Bavarian's test bed for the much rumoured BMW supercar. In return, the Bavarians also get the hybrid technology required for for its i series. Toyota gains marketing value- they have no mass-production use for the Z5 technology, as their corporate philosophy also competes with bottom baseline pricing. So you can't use BMW grade cold or heat plated steel in your Camry or Corolla, or carbon fibre panels. Too expensive. Last edited by Musashi; 03-19-2016 at 09:46 AM.. |
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