435i slow turbo

craeg · 10-14-2018, 07:13 PM

Hi
Previously had a 335i which had virtually no turbo lag. My ‘14 435i (17k miles) has pretty terrible lag - I can typically count to five before I can feel the turbo kick in.
Wondering if this is:
A) normal for a 435i
B) a result of “comfort mode”
C) indicative of an airflow or exhaust issue
D) just a normal, albeit slow , turbo

timw1 · 10-14-2018, 07:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craeg

Hi
Previously had a 335i which had virtually no turbo lag. My ‘14 435i (17k miles) has pretty terrible lag - I can typically count to five before I can feel the turbo kick in.
Wondering if this is:
A) normal for a 435i
B) a result of “comfort mode”
C) indicative of an airflow or exhaust issue
D) just a normal, albeit slow , turbo

That's why I like a boost gauge. I know most folks don't install boost gauges in their cars, but it does help with diagnostics. Boost leak = turbo lag. The charge pipe is prone to break, it's made out of plastic. A small crack can cause a boost leak.

craeg · 10-14-2018, 08:03 PM

Thanks! Would it be possible to have a small crack in the charge pipe with no codes thrown?

F32Fleet · 10-14-2018, 08:09 PM

I don't experience any lag. Perhaps it's not lag but a combination of comfort mode and the 8 speed AT.

What MY was your 335i?

craeg · 10-14-2018, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by F32Fleet

I don't experience any lag. Perhaps it's not lag but a combination of comfort mode and the 8 speed AT.

What MY was your 335i?

2011 335i

It’s def turbo lag, though it might have something to do with comfort mode.
I kick the throttle, it downshifts and 1,2,3,4 seconds it takes off

doodlebro · 10-14-2018, 10:08 PM

Guessing the 335 was an N54? It had two turbos and one was smaller, so it was pretty lag free. The N55, though twin scroll, is not perfect and doesn't reach full boost until around 3000 RPM. I recommend replacing charge/boost pipe as well as a higher flow DP, all will help the turbo have less resistance to initial spool.

jgoens · 10-14-2018, 10:38 PM

Definitely not normal. Does it feel the same in sport? Or comfort with shifter to the left. When the turbo gets going does it feel quick or do the RPM's climb yet the boost feels low? This is indicative of a boost leak. These cars stock have very little turbo lag--but that is also relative to mode/gear you are in.

If your cruising in comfort at a low RPM and hit the throttle, the tranny goes down a couple gears and it does take a couple seconds to feel the power. Some does depend on how you drive and when you time your throttle. My car with my mods is fast and it is night and day when I hit it in comfort at 2000 rpm as opposed to sport or shifter to the left. But, I can get going real good in comfort if I time the throttle right at the higher rpm of the gear I am in.

craeg · 10-15-2018, 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doodlebro

Guessing the 335 was an N54? It had two turbos and one was smaller, so it was pretty lag free. The N55, though twin scroll, is not perfect and doesn't reach full boost until around 3000 RPM. I recommend replacing charge/boost pipe as well as a higher flow DP, all will help the turbo have less resistance to initial spool.

No, that’s the thing. It was a n55. I’d be less likely to think something is wrong if my old 335i was a diff engine.

craeg · 10-15-2018, 12:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jgoens

Definitely not normal. Does it feel the same in sport? Or comfort with shifter to the left. When the turbo gets going does it feel quick or do the RPM's climb yet the boost feels low? This is indicative of a boost leak. These cars stock have very little turbo lag--but that is also relative to mode/gear you are in.

If your cruising in comfort at a low RPM and hit the throttle, the tranny goes down a couple gears and it does take a couple seconds to feel the power. Some does depend on how you drive and when you time your throttle. My car with my mods is fast and it is night and day when I hit it in comfort at 2000 rpm as opposed to sport or shifter to the left. But, I can get going real good in comfort if I time the throttle right at the higher rpm of the gear I am in.

Rpms climb but boost feels low - like come on already! I can tell when the turbo kicks in because the car just moves effortlessly. Ill do some testing tomorrow in sport, but my gut tells me something isn’t right mechanically.

TEST DRYVER · 10-15-2018, 05:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craeg

Rpms climb but boost feels low - like come on already! I can tell when the turbo kicks in because the car just moves effortlessly. Ill do some testing tomorrow in sport, but my gut tells me something isn’t right mechanically.

You're correct! I would almost bet money something is off. Even when the 15 335i was 100% stock, I was impressed with the acceleration, small amount of lag, and the 8 speed transmission. They did a good job mating this engine with this transmission (I had an 08 335i with the Steptronic a while back), and I sold it within 8 months because I didn't like the way the car felt with that transmission (I believe that car would of been better off in manual).
The car you have now, even in Comfort mode, should spool up faster than you're explaining. The comfort mode will take a bit longer because it will likely have to kick down more gears to get you in a low enough gear for power, then spool up the turbo. But again, at worst case, you're in comfort mode at 7th gear, at 2500 rpm, pin the throttle, you should be pulling hard in under 3 seconds from the time you floor it. Do that in Sport mode, it should take less than 2 seconds for you to be pulling hard. Something sounds wrong, I'm not smart enough to tell you exactly what's wrong, I can only speculate, but I'd take her to the doctor.

doodlebro · 10-15-2018, 11:57 AM

Wow OP, if you're N55 and experiencing this, that's really strange. Is it possible for you to log engine parameters using a JB4/BM3? That can help us see what's causing boost to stay so low (could be wastegates, boost solenoid, etc).

_tlink · 10-15-2018, 02:32 PM

I have close to the same spec'd car except you dont have MPPK, but that is a large amount of lag that is not normal. Even in comfort mode lag should not happen to that degree. If you can pull the logs someone should be able to diagnose your issue, or point you in the right direction.

mike@x-ph.com · 10-15-2018, 05:02 PM

If you have a tune , you can datalog boost and check if you have a boost leak.

craeg · 10-16-2018, 02:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

If you have a tune , you can datalog boost and check if you have a boost leak.

Not if you have a dinan tune... I think..

craeg · 10-16-2018, 02:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by _tlink

I have close to the same spec'd car except you dont have MPPK, but that is a large amount of lag that is not normal. Even in comfort mode lag should not happen to that degree. If you can pull the logs someone should be able to diagnose your issue, or point you in the right direction.

Thanks. I do have MPPK - as did my old 335i.
I bought a boost gauge and will install this weekend. Hopefully, that will give me additional info.

craeg · 10-16-2018, 02:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doodlebro

Wow OP, if you're N55 and experiencing this, that's really strange. Is it possible for you to log engine parameters using a JB4/BM3? That can help us see what's causing boost to stay so low (could be wastegates, boost solenoid, etc).

The tune I have (dinan) doesnt allow for logging as far as i know, but I can probably log using an IOS app. I have the OBD 2 wifi adapter and have carly, as well as obd fusion.

_tlink · 10-16-2018, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craeg

Thanks. I do have MPPK - as did my old 335i.
I bought a boost gauge and will install this weekend. Hopefully, that will give me additional info.

Oh apologies for the assumption, definitely not normal then. The boost gauge should help you narrow down the issue cause then since you can't share any logs. Hopefully its just a loose fitting that you need to tighten up

XutvJet · 10-16-2018, 02:41 PM

By an OBDII dongle and the Torque app and you can monitor and datalog boost.

craeg · 10-16-2018, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by XutvJet

By an OBDII dongle and the Torque app and you can monitor and datalog boost.

I'm IOS

doodlebro · 10-16-2018, 04:11 PM

You should be able to find an android device for pretty cheap. It doesn't have to be recent.

Logicoeur · 10-16-2018, 06:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by craeg

Quote:

Originally Posted by XutvJet

By an OBDII dongle and the Torque app and you can monitor and datalog boost.

I'm IOS

There are obdII dongles compatible with iOS devices. They're just more expensive than the kind that works with all of Android. Thanks Apple

craeg · 10-27-2018, 05:22 PM

Ok. The plot thickens. I was able to get an analog boost gauge tapped off the MAP sensor. I'm picking up boost - but pretty low levels of it with the Dinan in stage 1.
I put the Dinan in bypass mode.. and.. I'm getting a lot more boost and a lot less lag.
So I don't know where that leaves me with Dinan. Not the results that I expected.
With Dinan in bypass, max boost was maybe 5 psi. Without Dinan max boost was almost 9 psi. I should mention this car also has MPPK.
I'll be reaching out to Dinan support.

10-14-2018, 07:13 PM	#1
craeg Private 18 Rep 62 Posts Drives: 2011 335i convertible Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Norcal iTrader: (0)	435i slow turbo Hi Previously had a 335i which had virtually no turbo lag. My ‘14 435i (17k miles) has pretty terrible lag - I can typically count to five before I can feel the turbo kick in. Wondering if this is: A) normal for a 435i B) a result of “comfort mode” C) indicative of an airflow or exhaust issue D) just a normal, albeit slow , turbo
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10-14-2018, 08:03 PM	#3
craeg Private 18 Rep 62 Posts Drives: 2011 335i convertible Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Norcal iTrader: (0)	Thanks! Would it be possible to have a small crack in the charge pipe with no codes thrown?
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10-14-2018, 08:09 PM	#4
F32Fleet Lieutenant General 3570 Rep 10,351 Posts Drives: 2015 435i Join Date: May 2005 Location: Southeastern US iTrader: (0)	I don't experience any lag. Perhaps it's not lag but a combination of comfort mode and the 8 speed AT. What MY was your 335i? __________________ "Drive more, worry less. " 435i, MPPK, MPE, M-Sport Line
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10-14-2018, 10:08 PM	#6
doodlebro Lieutenant 121 Rep 470 Posts Drives: '17 X3 35i Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Denver iTrader: (1)	Guessing the 335 was an N54? It had two turbos and one was smaller, so it was pretty lag free. The N55, though twin scroll, is not perfect and doesn't reach full boost until around 3000 RPM. I recommend replacing charge/boost pipe as well as a higher flow DP, all will help the turbo have less resistance to initial spool. __________________ Current mods Rockford Fosgate P3 // JBL MS-A5001 // MiniDSP Ultra Racing Strut Brace // AFe Pro Dry S // PS2 // Custom Inlet // DV+ // FTP Boost Pipes // VRSF Race IC // VRSF Downpipe // ECUTek Protune @ 5280'
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10-14-2018, 10:38 PM	#7
jgoens Major General 3788 Rep 5,776 Posts Drives: 2013 335i msport Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: San Mateo, CA iTrader: (0)	Definitely not normal. Does it feel the same in sport? Or comfort with shifter to the left. When the turbo gets going does it feel quick or do the RPM's climb yet the boost feels low? This is indicative of a boost leak. These cars stock have very little turbo lag--but that is also relative to mode/gear you are in. If your cruising in comfort at a low RPM and hit the throttle, the tranny goes down a couple gears and it does take a couple seconds to feel the power. Some does depend on how you drive and when you time your throttle. My car with my mods is fast and it is night and day when I hit it in comfort at 2000 rpm as opposed to sport or shifter to the left. But, I can get going real good in comfort if I time the throttle right at the higher rpm of the gear I am in. __________________ 2013 335i Msport Black sapphire/Coral red. MHD. stage 2--e30 VRSF DP, ER CP, Dinan Shockware. VRSF 12mm/15mm spacers. Cobra dashcam. Various codings. Last car: 2011 335i Msport. JB4. Vrsf CP
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10-15-2018, 11:57 AM	#11
doodlebro Lieutenant 121 Rep 470 Posts Drives: '17 X3 35i Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Denver iTrader: (1)	Wow OP, if you're N55 and experiencing this, that's really strange. Is it possible for you to log engine parameters using a JB4/BM3? That can help us see what's causing boost to stay so low (could be wastegates, boost solenoid, etc). __________________ Current mods Rockford Fosgate P3 // JBL MS-A5001 // MiniDSP Ultra Racing Strut Brace // AFe Pro Dry S // PS2 // Custom Inlet // DV+ // FTP Boost Pipes // VRSF Race IC // VRSF Downpipe // ECUTek Protune @ 5280'
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10-15-2018, 02:32 PM	#12
_tlink Guy with a car 98 Rep 224 Posts Drives: 15' 435i Msport Join Date: Jul 2017 Location: Westchester, NY iTrader: (1)	I have close to the same spec'd car except you dont have MPPK, but that is a large amount of lag that is not normal. Even in comfort mode lag should not happen to that degree. If you can pull the logs someone should be able to diagnose your issue, or point you in the right direction. __________________ 15' 435i BSM on CR // BM3 Stage 2 93 OTS // NGK Plugs Gapped 0.023" // VRSF Catless DP // CTS Turbo Intake, CP, FMIC // AWE Tuning w/ Perf. Midpipe // BC Racing BR Coilovers // Apex EC-7 // Michelin PS4S // Plus a shit load of carbon
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10-15-2018, 05:02 PM	#13
mike@x-ph.com BimmerPost Supporting Vendor 24165 Rep 190,725 Posts Drives: 07-335/12-328/18-M4/21-M4CP Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Las Vegas iTrader: (23)	If you have a tune , you can datalog boost and check if you have a boost leak. __________________ Check out our current sale by clicking on this link! https://x-ph.com/sale/ Phone number 702-494-9435
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10-16-2018, 02:41 PM	#18
XutvJet Major General 5551 Rep 5,369 Posts Drives: 2011 Cayman Base, 2016 M235 Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Kansas City iTrader: (-1)	By an OBDII dongle and the Torque app and you can monitor and datalog boost. __________________ The forest was shrinking, but the Trees kept voting for the Axe, for the Axe was clever and convinced the Trees that because his handle was made of wood, he was one of them.
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10-16-2018, 04:11 PM	#20
doodlebro Lieutenant 121 Rep 470 Posts Drives: '17 X3 35i Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: Denver iTrader: (1)	You should be able to find an android device for pretty cheap. It doesn't have to be recent. __________________ Current mods Rockford Fosgate P3 // JBL MS-A5001 // MiniDSP Ultra Racing Strut Brace // AFe Pro Dry S // PS2 // Custom Inlet // DV+ // FTP Boost Pipes // VRSF Race IC // VRSF Downpipe // ECUTek Protune @ 5280'
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10-27-2018, 05:22 PM	#22
craeg Private 18 Rep 62 Posts Drives: 2011 335i convertible Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Norcal iTrader: (0)	Ok. The plot thickens. I was able to get an analog boost gauge tapped off the MAP sensor. I'm picking up boost - but pretty low levels of it with the Dinan in stage 1. I put the Dinan in bypass mode.. and.. I'm getting a lot more boost and a lot less lag. So I don't know where that leaves me with Dinan. Not the results that I expected. With Dinan in bypass, max boost was maybe 5 psi. Without Dinan max boost was almost 9 psi. I should mention this car also has MPPK. I'll be reaching out to Dinan support.
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