[sspade]

Originally Posted by Sanelko

It's tough to say one this one. The couple local dealerships I spoke to said they have seen the issue, but not to the proportion that people make it seem. Also said that every case they have seen was exhibiting a loud whine (described as a dying cat). My car's at about 95k now with no issues... that's not to say that it can't happen at any moment to me, but just not sure if it's worth stressing over like some people are.

Any failures to report up to 95k?

What OCI are you following?

[Sanelko]

Originally Posted by sspade

Any failures to report up to 95k?

What OCI are you following?

Only two things I had repaired were done free under CPO (got the car at 26k). This includes the passenger side window motor replacement (intermittent operation) and some faulty wiring issue that triggers a CEL, I think it was the differential temperature sensor wiring... there's a TSB out for it. 6-7k OC intervals with Lubro Moly. Started of with the High-tech but now using the Molygen.

[GpAevo]

Originally Posted by D3nns4un

I guess at least we have these now, but still pretty lame walkthroughs for non-bimmer mechanics.

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e...shaft/FYz9DVh0

https://www.newtis.info/tisv2/a/en/e...motor/FWywQ9mB

That guide suggests it's an engine out job. I was hoping it could be done still in the car, maybe just remove the front to gain access.

[MacklinUSOB]

Originally Posted by GpAevo

That guide suggests it's an engine out job. I was hoping it could be done still in the car, maybe just remove the front to gain access.

Definitely does not require engine out on N20/N26.

[seammg]

I recently had my TC changed at a specialized place which only does TC issues. They were pretty good according to all their reviews and know what they are doing. So i bit the bullet and got my TC kit changed (preventive).

I got it done with OEM BMW parts for 1300 Euros (including a loaner car for 2 days). I have to say i'm not seeing any difference but thats more because there was nothing wrong with my TC.

[johnung]

Originally Posted by seammg

I recently had my TC changed at a specialized place which only does TC issues. They were pretty good according to all their reviews and know what they are doing. So i bit the bullet and got my TC kit changed (preventive).

I got it done with OEM BMW parts for 1300 Euros (including a loaner car for 2 days). I have to say i'm not seeing any difference but thats more because there was nothing wrong with my TC.

This timing chain thread seems so odd to me. A chain is supposed to be the sign of a well designed reliable engine, unlike timing belts that need to be replaced every ~80k miles or risk catastrophic engine damage. Why would a timing chain be in danger of failing that frequently?

[sspade]

Originally Posted by seammg

I recently had my TC changed at a specialized place which only does TC issues. They were pretty good according to all their reviews and know what they are doing. So i bit the bullet and got my TC kit changed (preventive).

I got it done with OEM BMW parts for 1300 Euros (including a loaner car for 2 days). I have to say i'm not seeing any difference but thats more because there was nothing wrong with my TC.

What sort of warranty does this job come with?

Did you ask to see old parts?

Do you know exactly what parts were changed out or did you "just let them do their thing." ?

[Zanity]

Originally Posted by Sanelko

Also said that every case they have seen was exhibiting a loud whine (described as a dying cat)

Just to help us sleep better at night, the dying cat doesnt always appear tho, I heard some had the chain just went without warning so I wouldn't count on it.

[Diegov209]

Originally Posted by sspade

Also-

Are we sure the guides were revised?

I just checked and only the chain is showing as revised... the guides PN did not change...

Aye Spade you trying to buy a transmission service kit lol.

[sspade]

Originally Posted by Diegov209

Aye Spade you trying to buy a transmission service kit lol.

Not unless you want to perform the service with me in your garage

I moved into an apartment and gave up my garage unfortunately. Wont be doing this DIY in the street!

Also - for some reason my dealer is being strangely weird about doing this service. They are more than willing to take a thousand dollars out of my pocket for a sway bar install but are adamant against taking my money for the transmission service "because its not necessary and can cause more harm than good." This has kinda turned me off on the whole thing... not saying I wouldnt want my trans serviced if I had the proper kit and proper garage to do it in...

[Diegov209]

Originally Posted by sspade

Not unless you want to perform the service with me in your garage

I moved into an apartment and gave up my garage unfortunately. Wont be doing this DIY in the street!

Also - for some reason my dealer is being strangely weird about doing this service. They are more than willing to take a thousand dollars out of my pocket for a sway bar install but are adamant against taking my money for the transmission service "because its not necessary and can cause more harm than good." This has kinda turned me off on the whole thing... not saying I wouldnt want my trans serviced if I had the proper kit and proper garage to do it in...

Ahhhh okay bro gotcha lol yeah Idk bmw wierd lol 😂

[S3RIES28]

Hey everyone! just wanted to provide my occurrence with timing chain replacement. My car is currently at 113k miles and it is a N26 with a build date of 10/12. At the time, I had injen intake and Dinan Sporttronic installed and just a couple hundred miles prior to 100k the dreaded timing chain problem happened. I've always changed my oil at 3.5k intervals as i commute long distances daily and never noticed a slack in my timing chain when trying to push on it while the oil cap is off. However, i was noticing a higher pitch in engine whine which made me worried and would often be a point of discussion with my brother. I thought about changing cars to a n55 or just fixing it prior to it giving out. Needless to say, i didn't do either lol. One day i was driving and got a engine oil pressure low system on idrive, no CEL btw, so my heart sunk and pulled over and shut the car off. After a few minutes passed, i turned on the car and the message was gone and car was behaving normal so i drove home while staring at the idrive system the entire time. The car drove fine until the following Tuesday.

Next tuesday, had to drive almost two hours to my client and half way into it, the same thing happened. Cruising at 65MPH in the middle of farmland CT and message appeared, pulled over and called a tow since i was so far away from home and did not want to make the drive back. Car was dropped off at the dealership i buy parts from got a loaner for a couple of weeks. As i was out of warranty, the dealer started by replacing the oil pressure regulator valve and sending out. Turns out these two weren't the issue and the problem was that the timing chain guides were completely broken and were floating around. Only when these floating pieces of plastics got together and blocked the oil collector filter is when the oil pressure would drop which didn't occur every time.

In the end, i needed my car for work and had no choice but to fix it and now keep it as i have too much sunk cost in it. The pump, module, regulator, sending unit, and chain were all replace for $4.3k, ouch. I would suggest everyone to just change the chain and guides preventative.

[MacklinUSOB]

Originally Posted by S3RIES28

Hey everyone! just wanted to provide my occurrence with timing chain replacement. My car is currently at 113k miles and it is a N26 with a build date of 10/12. At the time, I had injen intake and Dinan Sporttronic installed and just a couple hundred miles prior to 100k the dreaded timing chain problem happened. I've always changed my oil at 3.5k intervals as i commute long distances daily and never noticed a slack in my timing chain when trying to push on it while the oil cap is off. However, i was noticing a higher pitch in engine whine which made me worried and would often be a point of discussion with my brother. I thought about changing cars to a n55 or just fixing it prior to it giving out. Needless to say, i didn't do either lol. One day i was driving and got a engine oil pressure low system on idrive, no CEL btw, so my heart sunk and pulled over and shut the car off. After a few minutes passed, i turned on the car and the message was gone and car was behaving normal so i drove home while staring at the idrive system the entire time. The car drove fine until the following Tuesday.

Next tuesday, had to drive almost two hours to my client and half way into it, the same thing happened. Cruising at 65MPH in the middle of farmland CT and message appeared, pulled over and called a tow since i was so far away from home and did not want to make the drive back. Car was dropped off at the dealership i buy parts from got a loaner for a couple of weeks. As i was out of warranty, the dealer started by replacing the oil pressure regulator valve and sending out. Turns out these two weren't the issue and the problem was that the timing chain guides were completely broken and were floating around. Only when these floating pieces of plastics got together and blocked the oil collector filter is when the oil pressure would drop which didn't occur every time.

In the end, i needed my car for work and had no choice but to fix it and now keep it as i have too much sunk cost in it. The pump, module, regulator, sending unit, and chain were all replace for $4.3k, ouch. I would suggest everyone to just change the chain and guides preventative.

Sorry that happened man. Thank you for all the information. You're the first one I've heard that was able to get away with only replacing the oil system and not the whole engine. Go buy yourself some Powerball tickets

[topside844]

Hey everyone! Just hit the timing chain issue this weekend on my 2013 328 w/N26 so I wanted to provide details and repair estimates.

I appear to be extremely lucky as BMW says the engine seems undamaged (good compression, no scratches, etc) and only the timing chain and guide assembly needs to be replaced.

Total Repair Estimate: $2858
Parts: $763.93 (MSRP, no discount)
Labor: 12.6hrs + 1hr diag @ $150/hr

Parts List:

1x	11-41-7-605-366	Chain Guide
1x	11-31-8-648-732	Timing Chain
1x	11-31-7-592-877	Rail & Guide Assembly
1x	11-31-7-603-944	Crankshaft Gear
1x	11-31-7-592-850	Rail & Guide Assembly
1x	11-31-8-685-091	Chain Tensioner
1x	11-21-7-614-270	Vibration Damper Bolt
1x	11-12-7-588-418	Valve Cover Gasket Set
1x	11-13-7-627-512	Gasket
2x	11-13-7-603-830	ASA-Bolt
20x	11-13-7-603-833	ASA-Bolt
1x	11-42-7-953-125	Oil Filter Set with Gaskets
5x	83-21-2-449-994	BMW Oil LL-01 FE 0W-30
1x	82-14-1-467-704	BMW Antifreeze Coolant

I've also called BMW USA to inquire about financial assistance as I'm at 89K miles (well beyond the 70K extended warranty). The representative over the phone couldn't guarantee anything, but she sounded more hopeful than I expected.

I'll update the thread once I receive a response from BMW USA. In the meantime, let me know if anyone has questions.

-- SYMPTOMS --

When I began my drive home, I heard noise from the engine which I assumed to be the typical lifter tick from a cold engine. Minutes later at a red light, I could tell this was a similar sound but definitely more severe than lifter tick noises. Approximately 3-5 seconds after I gently accelerate into the green light, the car entered into 'Drive-train Malfunction' mode and would not start again after I parked the vehicle (although the chain would turn when viewed from the oil cap).

I must add that prior to this, I did experience a 'Low Oil Pressure' warning in the middle of spirited driving on the interstate. However, the warning cleared and never returned after immediately shutting down and restarting the engine. Looking back, I'm certain this was a direct result of the chain guide sitting in the bottom of the oil reservoir and occasionally blocking the flow.

[RMachuca3d]

Go out right now and buy a lotto ticket.

[sspade]

@topside844

Nice details. Thx for sharing.

I think that is an awesome number from a BMW dealer. If I were in your shoes and walked away unscathed for under $3k... Id feel okay about it.

Of course Id expect to pay a bit less from an indy.

[topside844]

Originally Posted by sspade

@@[topside844]

I think that is an awesome number from a BMW dealer. If I were in your shoes and walked away unscathed for under $3k... Id feel okay about it.

Of course Id expect to pay a bit less from an indy.

It gets better... BMW USA called me back this morning to offer 25% off the total repair costs.

I then called the dealership and they gave me even better news. That 25% will come off of their “warranty rates” which are already discounted beyond their standard rates. I’m waiting on an updated quote, but instead of $150/hr it will be 25% off of $115/hr which is $86.25/hr.

13.6 * $150 = $2040 in labor
13.6 * $86.25 = $1173 in labor

The parts at warranty rates are 15% off, and when you add in BMW assistance at 25% that is a net parts discount of 36.25%.

763.93 * (1-.3625) = $487 in parts

Unofficial estimate: $1,660?

I’ll post total adjusted repair cost when I receive the official updated estimate.

[sspade]

Originally Posted by topside844

It gets better... BMW USA called me back this morning to offer 25% off the total repair costs.

I then called the dealership and they gave me even better news. That 25% will come off of their “warranty rates” which are already discounted beyond their standard rates. I’m waiting on an updated quote, but instead of $150/hr it will be 25% off of $115/hr which is $86.25/hr.

13.6 * $150 = $2040 in labor
13.6 * $86.25 = $1173 in labor

The parts at warranty rates are 15% off, and when you add in BMW assistance at 25% that is a net parts discount of 36.25%.

763.93 * (1-.3625) = $487 in parts

Unofficial estimate: $1,660?

I’ll post total adjusted repair cost when I receive the official updated estimate.

Jeepers. You are making out like a bandit... again, considering this is all happening at a BMW dealer of course.

See if you can get any details out of your SA
about what exactly failed. Would love to know.

What the chain broken? Stretched?

Were the guides broken or intact?

Etc.

[S3RIES28]

Congratulations on getting BMWNA to help pay for the costs, i tried and they would not budge as i was basically at 100k and out of warranty.

Sspade, honestly it seems like the main failure on both of our cars was the broken guides cause they block the flow and creates a sudden loss of oil pressure. My chain was not stretched according to the service advisor so i assume it's the weak plastic guides not resistant to long term exposure to heat perhaps.

[topside844]

Originally Posted by RMachuca3d

Go out right now and buy a lotto ticket.

Well, I didn’t buy a lotto ticket. However, I did go out last night to play poker. Turns out it was a good decision and I still had some luck left over.



I won 25% of the “bad beat” jackpot ($131K) which hits when someone loses with a monster hand better than quad-5s. In my case, I had J8s while my opponent had pocket 9s. I made my straight flush on the turn, and he hit quads on the river. My opponent left with over $65K since he had the losing hand.

The only “unlucky” part is the bad beat jackpot was over $450K just this past week after building up for over 1.5yrs. However, it finally hit on Wednesday(!!) and then I hit it immediately after on Friday. Crazy!!

[RMachuca3d]

Originally Posted by topside844

Well, I didn’t buy a lotto ticket. However, I did go out last night to play poker. Turns out it was a good decision and I still had some luck left over.



I won 25% of the “bad beat” jackpot ($131K) which hits when someone loses with a monster hand better than quad-5s. In my case, I had J8s while my opponent had pocket 9s. I made my straight flush on the turn, and he hit quads on the river. My opponent left with over $65K since he had the losing hand.

The only “unlucky” part is the bad beat jackpot was over $450K just this past week after building up for over 1.5yrs. However, it finally hit on Wednesday(!!) and then I hit it immediately after on Friday. Crazy!!

!!!!!!!!! trade up to an m3 now?

[Linc0909]

These engines go 12k between oil changes and that's with a factory filter. If you're doing it more often than that you're wasting your money and resources. Stop listening to grandpa or the 23 yo high school drop out at Jiffy Lube. If the dealer and manufacture that has to warranty your vehicle doesn't require it sooner why would you?

The issue is NOT the chain, it's the plastic guides which a lot of manufacturers use to keep engine noise down. If you research the TSB for the repair they replace the plastic guides with metal ones.