[jmciver]

Originally Posted by FotiosF90M5

Thanks for the tip. I didn't even know that rew could calculate it itself that's awesome. The AF software can talk to the rew? When you uploaded the values it applied it all correctly on its own? I have to learn how to do THAT. That will be a huge help. Thx! You don't happen to have an idea how I can find the video you used? I want to try your tune files but the file doesn't sync correctly because I'm not on the digital signal like the older non ram hk's. It can be done just have to reassign everything correctly. When I get the time I'm going to try them out. Thx!!
Oh yeah, I Already have the mik you use so I'm good there.

When REW calculates the new EQ settings for each band, you can export those settings to a text file format that is compatible with the AF software. Then, inside the AF software, you import that text file to the appropriate channel you are working on. I don't have any specific links to the videos I found. But between Google and a YouTube search for "REW exporting" or something similar, some videos should pop up.

Here is an example link, but there are others out there….

https://www.diymobileaudio.com/threa...ftware.359418/

Edit: One other thing, my tune file won't sound right in your car for among other reasons, the time alignment will be off. So at a minimum, once you have converted the signal routing to your setup, don't forget to adjust the time alignment values to your speaker locations. Using the tape measure method should be good enough, which is what I used to set the time alignment for my car.

[TWAZ540]

Jmciver. Did you ever add the trunk sub? This has been amazing thread to follow and just wondering as I have the same set up but kept the factory HK 8” in my 2018 G30. The 8” are good midbass but I’m definitely missing low frequency depending on music content.

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by TWAZ540

Jmciver. Did you ever add the trunk sub? This has been amazing thread to follow and just wondering as I have the same set up but kept the factory HK 8” in my 2018 G30. The 8” are good midbass but I’m definitely missing low frequency depending on music content.

No, not yet. "Life" and other projects have delayed this one a bit. The 8" underseat woofers I installed, combined with my tune, have actually provided unexpectedly decent bass - which has also contributed to my delays on this project .

However, I still want better bass to fill out the sound in my system, so a trunk sub is still on the menu and most likely will be a late Fall/early winter project. All the connections are ready so I literally just need to "plug it in"….

[NealfromNZ]

If you don’t mind a question on the use of sound deadening to this level.

Did it alter the M3 in terms of character ? No doubt far better for audio but did it dampen down of the noise of the M3 from a driving point of view ?

[devil84]

Hi, I will put up a for sale thread but I will be selling this amp that I had for a year. Will be selling with the helix sdmi 25 most converter.

Will also supply the custom tune file.

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by NealfromNZ

If you don't mind a question on the use of sound deadening to this level.

Did it alter the M3 in terms of character ? No doubt far better for audio but did it dampen down of the noise of the M3 from a driving point of view ?

Yes, it did - it made the interior of the car noticeably more quiet, especially with the windows up. It specifically cut down on the road noise (i.e. from the tires) and also the exhaust, which is what I wanted. Although, turning off the Active Sound Design (ASD) really quiets down this car a lot as well (which I did before the sound silencing upgrades).

Of course, if I want to hear all that exhaust sound goodness (I also have an exhaust valve controller), all I have to do is put the windows down…

[teachasumthin3]

Originally Posted by johnung

I have a lot of respect for Audiotec BMW amplifiers. I wouldn't touch anything BavSound sells. They are just a slick marketing company.

I have a Harman Kardon audio system that I have upgraded. Whether to choose the Match Up 10 DSP amplifier as an upgrade depends on your goals. I'll describe how I upgraded. Then it depends on any improvements that using the Match Up 10DSP may provide and the cost difference.

UNDERSEAT SUBWOOFER UPGRADE
All three BMW audio systems have excellent speakers, but are lacking in the underseat subwoofers which should be replaced. Much has been written about how the BMW underseat sub boxes are too small for a typical sub to sound good. Almost all subs sold for underseat BMW locations are typical subs that have no technology to help them to sound better. They use slick marketing to try to sell them.

One underseat subwoofer actually has unique technology as proven by its standardized specifications. The Earthquake SWS-8Xi (2-ohm) is a big improvement but it requires about 150watts per channel into 2-ohms to drive it properly.

All three BMW audio systems benefit from replacing the underseat subwoofers with Earthquake SWS-8Xi subs. They cost about $129 each and can be purchased from Walmart Online, Amazon or ECS Tuning. Also required is a pair of Earthquake R8SWS spacer rings for $25/pr either from those retailers or from Earthquake Sound directly. So the Earthquake underseat subwoofer upgrade costs about $283 total.

All three BMW audio systems require more power to the Earthquake underseat subwoofers, 2-channels of 150watts per channel [...]

This info is just what I needed!!! Thanks. I’m going with the AudioControl ACM-2.300. Can you tell me which interface harness from Technicpnp is the correct one to connect the two amps? I see several different ones.
- add a sub T harness
- MOST oem amp replacement hardware kit
- ASD Bypass harness
- add a sub harness w/ LOC-150

[johnung]

Originally Posted by teachasumthin3

This info is just what I needed!!! Thanks. I’m going with the AudioControl ACM-2.300. Can you tell me which interface harness from Technicpnp is the correct one to connect the two amps? I see several different ones.
- add a sub T harness
- MOST oem amp replacement hardware kit
- ASD Bypass harness
- add a sub harness w/ LOC-150

This is the harness that I used
https://technicpnp.com/product/logic...sub-t-harness/

[teachasumthin3]

Originally Posted by johnung

This is the harness that I used
https://technicpnp.com/product/logic...sub-t-harness/

Got it! Thanks. Can you share how you hooked everything up and where you mounted it in the trunk? Also, did you use a LOC? According to the website they say you need one or do our cars not require it. I have the HK system.

“Line Output Converter required and NOT INCLUDED. No remote signal is provided by harness.
For MOST OEM amps of 480W and below a LOC is required to handle up to 18V/70W per channel inputs.”

[johnung]

Originally Posted by teachasumthin3

Got it! Thanks. Can you share how you hooked everything up and where you mounted it in the trunk? Also, did you use a LOC? According to the website they say you need one or do our cars not require it. I have the HK system.

“Line Output Converter required and NOT INCLUDED. No remote signal is provided by harness.
For MOST OEM amps of 480W and below a LOC is required to handle up to 18V/70W per channel inputs.”

A LOC is needed but that’s the beauty of the AudioControl because it has a LOC built-in. Installed it right on top of the toolbox in the right trunk alcove.

I actually posted a ton of detail on BimmerPost already including a lot of photos. Please search and read through those. I’ll be happy to fill in any blanks later. Take care!

[teachasumthin3]

[QUOTE=johnung;29641128]A LOC is needed but that’s the beauty of the AudioControl because it has a LOC built-in. Installed it right on top of the toolbox in the right trunk alcove.

I actually posted a ton of detail on BimmerPost already including a lot of photos. Please search and read through those. I’ll be happy to fill in any blanks later. Take care!

You’re the man! Thanks so much! Gonna search for your post.

[jmciver]

So a small update to this project regarding the trunk sub…. For a myriad of reasons that I won’t bore you with, the trunk sub portion of this project has stalled. I also went back and forth A LOT over what sub/amp/enclosure combo I wanted to go with. In the end, I decided to go for a “better” amp, with a “modest” sub and enclosure. There are tons of professional acoustic opinions on this and I decided to go with the opinion that a good amp can make “average” speakers sound great when setup and tuned properly. A contributing variable for me is cost as we all know audio componants can vary widely with cost - but more expensive equipment/components does not always equate to better sound.

I also went back and forth on the power level I wanted to use: 300 watts vs 500 watts. Many go with a 500 watt trunk sub setup. I actually thought this was overkill for the amount of bass I thought I wanted. Although, some will say that the trunk in the F3x/F8x is sealed so well that it is better to use a 500 watt setup for a better bass experience. I was going to go with a 300 watt setup (which would have been cheaper), but after a few Black Friday sales I came across (the amp in particular), I decided to go with a 500 watt trunk sub setup …

So after all that, I am going with the following setup for my trunk sub…

Amp: JL Audio RD500/1
Sub: NVX VSW102v2 10” sub
Enclosure: Visual Ice F30 trunk enclosure

The long pole in the tent is the enclosure, which I am still waiting for. In the interim, I have the sub and amp. I also installed/wired the amp in my car so when the enclosure comes in, all I literally have to do is plug it in. After reading about this sub, including looking at the T/S specs, I am looking forward to how it performs in my setup. This sub choice definitely falls in the “less expensive” category. But if it doesn’t work out, I did not lose much $$ and my enclosure will still work with my next sub choice, a JL Audio 10W3v3-2 10” sub.

[Chris_DUS]

Originally Posted by jmciver

So a small update to this project regarding the trunk sub…. For a myriad of reasons that I won’t bore you with, the trunk sub portion of this project has stalled. I also went back and forth A LOT over what sub/amp/enclosure combo I wanted to go with. In the end, I decided to go for a “better” amp, with a “modest” sub and enclosure. There are tons of professional acoustic opinions on this and I decided to go with the opinion that a good amp can make “average” speakers sound great when setup and tuned properly. A contributing variable for me is cost as we all know audio componants can vary widely with cost - but more expensive equipment/components does not always equate to better sound.

I also went back and forth on the power level I wanted to use: 300 watts vs 500 watts. Many go with a 500 watt trunk sub setup. I actually thought this was overkill for the amount of bass I thought I wanted. Although, some will say that the trunk in the F3x/F8x is sealed so well that it is better to use a 500 watt setup for a better bass experience. I was going to go with a 300 watt setup (which would have been cheaper), but after a few Black Friday sales I came across (the amp in particular), I decided to go with a 500 watt trunk sub setup …

So after all that, I am going with the following setup for my trunk sub…

Amp: JL Audio RD500/1
Sub: NVX VSW102v2 10” sub
Enclosure: Visual Ice F30 trunk enclosure

The long pole in the tent is the enclosure, which I am still waiting for. In the interim, I have the sub and amp. I also installed/wired the amp in my car so when the [...]

Hi there,

Great thread and nice work!

I just finally installed the same subs (Audison) and amp in my G80. Had the amo before in my G20 to get to know it.

Can I ask a few questions:

When I turn the volume to about 75%, the subs starting to make a clunking noise, like they are hitting something (thinkikg clipping, maybe my power cables suck). I had the exact same with my HK woofers in the G20, so it must be a setting I guess. Did you encounter that issue? I turned off all the bass expanders and went with the virtual routing.

I understand that the G2x HK with RAM has crossovers set that you cant take out. Is the F80 More customizable?

[Billfitz]

What's happening is that they've run out of excursion. Too little excursion capability is the main limitation of the OEM woofers and most replacement woofers, including Audison. One reason why I recommend the Earthquake is that they have the highest excursion of any drop in replacement woofer.

[jmciver]

Originally Posted by Chris_DUS

Hi there,

Great thread and nice work!

I just finally installed the same subs (Audison) and amp in my G80. Had the amo before in my G20 to get to know it.

Can I ask a few questions:

When I turn the volume to about 75%, the subs starting to make a clunking noise, like they are hitting something (thinkikg clipping, maybe my power cables suck). I had the exact same with my HK woofers in the G20, so it must be a setting I guess. Did you encounter that issue? I turned off all the bass expanders and went with the virtual routing.

I understand that the G2x HK with RAM has crossovers set that you cant take out. Is the F80 More customizable?

Thanks! But yeah, I seem to remember a similar sound issue with my Audisons during the early trial and error phases of tuning of my system, especially when I turned on the SubXpander sound effect. I ended up not using that sound effect and just turned down the lower frequencies in my tune to prevent that type of low end distortion. I agree with Bilfitz regarding what what was causing that type of low end distortion in my underseat woofers at the time.

I purposely got the Audisons, based on their specs, to be more of a mid-bass speaker, when combined and tuned with my trunk sub. However, I was pleasantly surprised with how well the Audisons did sound, even though they could not go too low, while I waited to complete my trunk sub setup. If I did not plan to run a trunk sub, I would have gone with the Earthquakes for their better low end response.

As far as the F8x HK being more customizable than the G8x, I am not sure. But with the F8x HK system, I know the sound signal coming from the headunit is “unmolested”, so to speak, which allows me to take full advantage of the DSP features in the Match amp. Although, I thought that the interface harness between the RAM module and the Match amp was designed in a way to give you a clean signal for the Match amp to be able to process?

[Chris_DUS]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

What's happening is that they've run out of excursion. Too little excursion capability is the main limitation of the OEM woofers and most replacement woofers, including Audison. One reason why I recommend the Earthquake is that they have the highest excursion of any drop in replacement woofer.

Thanks! Are there no issues with the Earthquakes hitting the cover? The more I think of it the more it feels like a that the housing is not sealed enough, if that makes sense. Or I am just expecting too much of the system, definitely possible as it did add more bass and sounds much better. Maybe have to look into swapping the subs or add one in the trunk. I was hoping not go down my early 20's car audio rabbit hole...

Originally Posted by jmciver

Thanks! But yeah, I seem to remember a similar sound issue with my Audisons during the early trial and error phases of tuning of my system, especially when I turned on the SubXpander sound effect. I ended up not using that sound effect and just turned down the lower frequencies in my tune to prevent that type of low end distortion. I agree with Bilfitz regarding what what was causing that type of low end distortion in my underseat woofers at the time.

I purposely got the Audisons, based on their specs, to be more of a mid-bass speaker, when combined and tuned with my trunk sub. However, I was pleasantly surprised with how well the Audisons did sound, even though they could not go too low, while I waited to complete my trunk sub setup. If I did not plan to run a trunk sub, I would have gone with the Earthquakes for their better low end response.

As far as the F8x HK being more customizable than the G8x, I am not sure. But with the F8x HK system, I know the sound signal coming from the headunit is “unmolested”, so to speak, which allows me to take full advantage of the DSP features in the Match amp. Although, I thought that the interface harness between the RAM module and the Match amp was designed in a way to give you a clean signal for the Match amp to be able to process?

Thanks, that gives me hope that I likely just have to put more work into it (or add a sub, but what subtle case to use... I added a HPF today at 50hz with the steepest curve (forgot the name) I could find and it added some more volume to it without distorting. The expander sounds just horrible. When you say you turned down the lower frequencies, how did you do that?

[jmciver]

When I tuned the underseat woofers (i.e. EQ’ed them) together with the rest of the system, I lowered the gain a bit on the two woofer channels to help prevent the distortion you described (and also match the target house curve I was shooting for). I set my crossover at 35 Hz on the Audisons which seems to work well. I also use the URC3 remote, which also gives me some additional volume control over the underseat woofers. As I said before, I don’t use SubXpander which was the biggest culprit for that type of low end distortion.

Lots of different ways you can adjust the low end frequencies for good sound without distortion. But the Audison woofers do ultimately have thier limits…

[Billfitz]

The Audisons run out of response and excursion at 50Hz, so content below that is going to stress them. SubXpander creates a tone an octave down from the original, so if the bass or kick drum is at 40-60Hz it's going to add content at 20-30Hz. That's going to result in over-excursion and high distortion from both the speaker and amp. Output at those frequencies is down -10 to -20dB, so you won't hear it anyway.

[NealfromNZ]

Bill

Do you have a rough model for the underseat enclosures size and it’s extension into the sills ?

I can’t work out if they are loosely sealed or an ib setup type loading.

Interesting the Xmax specs on the earthquakes at 22mm ( wonder if this is real verse an xmech value ) 7mm ish for most drop in replacement. 7 mm obviously not a lot of travel for below 50 hz at moderate volumes.

[Billfitz]

When I measured the response of mine it came out to the equivalent of a 0.6 cu ft sealed box with Ql of 3, so they're pretty lossy. Qtc measured right at 1.000, which is right where you want it in a car. I'm sure that's not exact, but it's close enough for driver modeling. I don't have Earthquakes myself, listening to only Classic Rock I don't have the need, but I have no reason to doubt the 23mm Xmax. 7mm is OK with the response you're going to get with the typical 50Hz Fs of replacement 'upgrades' (the OEM Hi-Fi Fs is 51Hz.), but to take advantage of the 30Hz Fs of the Earthquake you need that 23mm.

[NealfromNZ]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

When I measured the response of mine it came out to the equivalent of a 0.6 cu ft sealed box with Ql of 3, so they're pretty lossy. Qtc measured right at 1.000, which is right where you want it in a car. I'm sure that's not exact, but it's close enough for driver modeling. I don't have Earthquakes myself, listening to only Classic Rock I don't have the need, but I have no reason to doubt the 23mm Xmax. 7mm is OK with the response you're going to get with the typical 50Hz Fs of replacement 'upgrades' (the OEM Hi-Fi Fs is 51Hz.), but to take advantage of the 30Hz Fs of the Earthquake you need that 23mm.

Perfect thanks.

Just planning a build to replace speakers / amp and underset enclosures and try and do a one box most/dsp/amp solution. ( 8.1.1 )

Reason for asking about the Xmax was I have an oldish Boston Acoustics SPG555 sub that has 22mm Xmax but has one of the largest surrounds I’ve seen with Xmech at 49mm. 23mm seems quite an achievement on such a slim driver. I’m heading more 7mm way with 50-60hz crossover

My f80 is uk spec and came with basic audio with 4x100mm mid basses and two 6.5 inch underseat woofers run at 25 watts x4 . It’s quite underwhelming and suspect it’s running a Bose like house curve.( boosted mid bass and treble )

This has been a great thread for info

[Billfitz]

I'd keep the underseat enclosures, just load them with standard spec eights. They're plenty good enough if high passed at 60Hz.

On the subject of the mids, I just came across these. https://products.peerless-audio.com/...-115N25AL01-04

They spec out better than any other midbasses I've found, including the ridiculously priced Focal. I'm inclined to try a pair, at less than $40 USD it's not a major gamble. That will have to wait for spring for me, I don't have a heated garage to work in. They're not drop in, you'll have to finagle them, maybe even get a grille with more clearance, but it's worth the work to save major coin and get better results than the so-called upgrades that aren't even as good as stock.