[F30AM]

There is no doubt that Japenese cars are the most reliable. They are practically fault free unless you are a driver from across the pond .... ! 'nuff said!

[pjs]

Originally Posted by F30AM

Audi's look bland from the side, bland from the rear, vile and vulgar from the front and drive like sh!t!. Says lots about their owners does it not?

Ok, I'll bite. Spot my other car. Clue, its not the Merc

What exactly does it say about their owners?

[PrinceBarin]

Good news, I'm looking forward to a bit more exclusivity

[F30AM]

Originally Posted by pjs

Ok, I'll bite. Spot my other car. Clue, its not the Merc

What exactly does it say about their owners?

Don't care. You own a BMW anyway. The rest is history.

[NISFAN]

Originally Posted by F30AM

RWD or a car with RWD bias is the best. BUT, a hot hatch with FWD properly done like the VW Mk7 Golf GTI with performance pack is also amazing. The VW Mk7 Golf R might also be a sterling car. Better than any equivalent Audi.

Isn't it a slightly detuned S3?

[dazzapb]

Originally Posted by F30AM

There is no doubt that Japenese cars are the most reliable. They are practically fault free unless you are a driver from across the pond .... ! 'nuff said!

I believe Toyota are still trying to rebuild their image as you imply, recall after recall.... but that was quite unusual really.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-24576729
http://www.toyotaproblems.com/

[Pablo68]

Meh audis...

[teaston]

Originally Posted by F30AM

Audi's look bland from the side, bland from the rear, vile and vulgar from the front and drive like sh!t!. Says lots about their owners does it not?

I don't think Audi's look bad , they are just boring now because all their models look the same, and have done for about 10 years now!

Also Audi's are slower, worse economy and worse to drive!

The interiors are quite nice though.

[Tengocity]

The BMW is still the better drivers car, and also still leading he way in engines and now economy. But Audi's are generally handsome machines, if a little bland.

But some of their adverts make you want one! The advert with the R8 going up through the gears of it's new DSG gearbox and then back down again is pure automotive porn... the kind of attitude that BMW used to have!

I know a lot of people don't care about the marketing, or don't think they are influenced by it, but plenty are, and I hate that BMW have let Audi steal their ground... especially when it's not deserved. BMW is still the ultimate driving machine!

[Pablo68]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

The BMW is still the better drivers car, and also still leading he way in engines and now economy. But Audi's are generally handsome machines, if a little bland.

But some of their adverts make you want one! The advert with the R8 going up through the gears of it's new DSG gearbox and then back down again is pure automotive porn... the kind of attitude that BMW used to have!

I know a lot of people don't care about the marketing, or don't think they are influenced by it, but plenty are, and I hate that BMW have let Audi steal their ground... especially when it's not deserved. BMW is still the ultimate driving machine!

Yes I like that ad, but problem is bob in sales in his 140hp A4 boggo spec thinks he's driving a V10 R8 because he has an Audi.

[languidmandala]

Audi rise is roughly equal to VW fall. Loyal customers going premium?

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by Pablo68

Yes I like that ad, but problem is bob in sales in his 140hp A4 boggo spec thinks he's driving a V10 R8 because he has an Audi.

I think that would be the point of the R8 in many ways... classic halo model strategy.

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by languidmandala

Audi rise is roughly equal to VW fall. Loyal customers going premium?

It may be to some extent but I'm sure VW has risen over last 10 years as well, and so has Skoda. I'd suggest that most VW customers would naturally fall in to either Skoda or Audi segments very easily, so that Audi and Skoda and VW have grown so well over the years is impressive business in my mind.

There is plenty of good engineering in the whole VW group, but I still see it as much a triumph for marketing as engineering, due to the sheer number of successful brands in the one group, yet so much similarity between them all.

To me it shows that if you define clearly what your brand is supposed to represent, and that appeals to a large enough group of people, and you ensure that the product matches up to it... then you can't lose.

The brands that have been succesful have done that, the ones that haven't are missing one of those elements - either the brand stands for nothing, or just lacks broad enough appeal, or the product doesn't reflect the image/brand values.

Classic case would be Seat... the only failing VW brand.. what's the point of it?

BMW are doing great still thankfully, but shouldbe doing better in my eyes. Half the models never quite look quite as good as we all think they should, and they do some things that, to me anyway, are at odds with their positioning as the drivers choice... eg Run-flat tyres... a safety choice but a detriment to handling.... fair enough for Volvo or Renault who market themselves on safety, but not really for BMW!

[MarkG_M5Comp]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

Classic case would be Seat... the only failing VW brand.. what's the point of it?

Go ask that question in southern Europe where Seat is massive.

As a Spanish architect friend of mine told me when talking about Jaguar, lots of people in Spain '...drive Seats but aspire to drive Audis...'

Arguable another master stroke from VAG, the group has a 'brand for everyone, everywhere' and Seat is the 'feeder' brand in souther Europe - maybe we'll see some rationalisation of the brands, but I doubt it.

So long as BMW keep making cars, I am not concerned.

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by MarkG335

Go ask that question in southern Europe where Seat is massive.

As a Spanish architect friend of mine told me when talking about Jaguar, lots of people in Spain '...drive Seats but aspire to drive Audis...'

Arguable another master stroke from VAG, the group has a 'brand for everyone, everywhere' and Seat is the 'feeder' brand in souther Europe - maybe we'll see some rationalisation of the brands, but I doubt it.

So long as BMW keep making cars, I am not concerned.

Few car brands can afford to be successful in just one part of one continent. Only VW with such massive platform sharing could contemplate it. From what I understand though, they'd like to buy Alfa, or turn Seat in to a Spanish version of Alfa!

[Jules6]

IMHO I guess it must be down to marketing as my experience with Audis has not been good.

Everyone talks of the quality interiors, yet my A4 Avant didn't seem that good. Whilst the materials felt good, I had problems. Every time I went over a series of bumps the luggage cover would self retract. I placed a slightly damp towel (only with water) on the passenger seat, but was enough to leave a permanent stain on the cloth seat

The car had a problem with the handbrake where it would ease off after being left for 15 minutes, not uncommon from what I since discovered, which could be potentially catastrophic! Audi denied any such problem of course.

In the wet the brake pads would not bite without first giving a light touch on the brakes first. Not good if you need to stop quickly without warning and pretty scary!

Engine sounded typically diesel taxi, no more refined than a Ford.

Generally I was not impressed although would have been less bothered by some of the issues if it was at VW price.
Not sure how Audi are considered a premium brand along with Mercedes and BMW

Just my opinion of cousre

[MarkG_M5Comp]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

Few car brands can afford to be successful in just one part of one continent. Only VW with such massive platform sharing could contemplate it. From what I understand though, they'd like to buy Alfa, or turn Seat in to a Spanish version of Alfa!

It's a good idea though isn't it... take your least successful brand and call it a niche! That's what Toyota did with Lexus at launch to save face in the event it wasn't a huge success. Which of course it was.

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by MarkG335

It's a good idea though isn't it... take your least successful brand and call it a niche! That's what Toyota did with Lexus at launch to save face in the event it wasn't a huge success. Which of course it was.

Oh yes it's a great idea as long as you're growing market share and not stealing your own sales with a less profitable model. For me that's why BMW need a smaller car than the 1 series. There are lots of people who would buy one that would never buy a mini... they are totally different brands.

[MarkG_M5Comp]

Originally Posted by Tengocity

Oh yes it's a great idea as long as you're growing market share and not stealing your own sales with a less profitable model. For me that's why BMW need a smaller car than the 1 series. There are lots of people who would buy one that would never buy a mini... they are totally different brands.

Coming this year..... in FWD