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      01-13-2019, 12:19 AM   #1
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Anyone have a 991.2 Carrera, S, T?

If so, how do you like it? Compare it to BMW if you could.

I did the track experience at the the LA PEC with a Carrera T and I liked it, but I find track days can never compare what it is like to own a car, driving it in stop and go traffic in and out of driveways etc...

I see the drawbacks being...
Price
lack of practicality
attention
low front end

Otherwise, seems like a great, great machine. I actually like the Turbo motors for 7MT daily driving.

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      01-13-2019, 08:26 AM   #2
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I have not been fortunate enough yet to own a Porsche but i have done a track event like you have. I think you hit the nail on the head in terms of primary drawbacks. Obviously if price is a consideration the Porsche will be considerably more expensive than most BMWs. But if you are comfortable with the cost then a 991.2 would likely make a great daily driver. I love the T as well and the 7mt is a must if you go that route.
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      01-13-2019, 10:15 AM   #3
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991.2 Carrera S here - Miami Blue, 7MT.

The car itself is nothing short of incredible. The turbo motor in these cars is one of if not the most tech advanced turbo motors available. The response and character of the engine are really impressive and make it very enjoyable to drive. I I have the sport package with rear axel steering and Id recommend that as the stability and maneuverability is really great. Sometimes I wish Id gotten PDK, but the manual is great overall.
I do think the car is much more enjoyable to drive than my F80/2 M3 and M4 and obviously performance and handling are better than even the M4 GTS despite its huge advantages which should tell you all you need to know. I actually think Porsche made the transition to turbo motors from atmospheric better than just about anyone in terms of not changing the overall character.
Happy to chat Ive youve got specific questions.

Last edited by Funf6cyl; 01-13-2019 at 10:25 AM.
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      01-13-2019, 10:22 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
991.2 Carrera S here - Miami Blue, 7MT.

The car itself is nothing short of incredible. The turbo motor in these cars is one of if not the most tech advanced turbo motors available. The response and character of the engine are really impressive and make it very enjoyable to drive. I I have the sport package with rear axel steering and Id recommend that as the stability and maneuverability is really great. Sometimes I wish Id gotten PDK, but the manual is great.
Happy to chat if youve got specific questions.
I'd echo this although I haven't had any seat time in the 991 yet. An acquaintance has a new 911 T, Black on Black with 7MT, he want's to drive my 993 and has offered up his 911T in exchange.....he even suggested a trade and I'm not sure if he was joking or not.

You can't go wrong with Porsche.
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      01-13-2019, 01:49 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
991.2 Carrera S here - Miami Blue, 7MT.

The car itself is nothing short of incredible. The turbo motor in these cars is one of if not the most tech advanced turbo motors available. The response and character of the engine are really impressive and make it very enjoyable to drive. I I have the sport package with rear axel steering and Id recommend that as the stability and maneuverability is really great. Sometimes I wish Id gotten PDK, but the manual is great overall.
I do think the car is much more enjoyable to drive than my F80/2 M3 and M4 and obviously performance and handling are better than even the M4 GTS despite its huge advantages which should tell you all you need to know. I actually think Porsche made the transition to turbo motors from atmospheric better than just about anyone in terms of not changing the overall character.
Happy to chat Ive youve got specific questions.
I haven't driven the 911, only the Cayman S and Cayenne. Steering felt too light and a tad numb in those cars (but not as bad as the M4). How do you like it in your car?

My gold standard for steering is the E9X M3. But I just don't imagine automakers ever going back to that.
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      01-13-2019, 01:59 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
I haven't driven the 911, only the Cayman S and Cayenne. Steering felt too light and a tad numb in those cars (but not as bad as the M4). How do you like it in your car?

My gold standard for steering is the E9X M3. But I just don't imagine automakers ever going back to that.
I had 2 e92 M3s and thought the steering was rather numb, especially off center. The 991 (and the 991.2 more so) electric has much better feel and accuracy than any hydraulic bmw ever managed - sorry to say it but its true.

To go back, Porsche hydraulic was leagues better than anything else in the industry when hydraulic was the standard and now the electric steering Porsche has is leagues better than anyone has been able to muster up and I fact their electric rack is better than just about anyones hydraulic besides their own.

You have realize bmw makes their steering artificially heavy so a rear or mid engined car will feel lighter in comparison but dont mistake that effort bmw fakes to mean feel bc it isnt. The Cayman has loads of feel, something like a GTS or GT4 is about perfect!
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      01-13-2019, 02:20 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
I had 2 e92 M3s and thought the steering was rather numb, especially off center. The 991 (and the 991.2 more so) electric has much better feel and accuracy than any hydraulic bmw ever managed - sorry to say it but it’s true.

To go back, Porsche hydraulic was leagues better than anything else in the industry when hydraulic was the standard and now the electric steering Porsche has is leagues better than anyone has been able to muster up and I fact their electric rack is better than just about anyone’s hydraulic besides their own.

You have realize bmw makes their steering artificially heavy so a rear or mid engined car will feel lighter in comparison but don’t mistake that “effort” bmw fakes to mean feel bc it isn’t. The Cayman has loads of feel, something like a GTS or GT4 is about perfect!
Yep BMW just dials in weight that does nothing for actual feedback through the wheel. It feels like playing Forza on Xbox.

I'm younger and less experienced with cars than you so I trust your judgment. But I still just loved BMW's hydraulic racks, they felt magical. Haven't yet driven a Porsche with hydraulic steering.
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      01-13-2019, 02:22 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
991.2 Carrera S here - Miami Blue, 7MT.

The car itself is nothing short of incredible. The turbo motor in these cars is one of if not the most tech advanced turbo motors available. The response and character of the engine are really impressive and make it very enjoyable to drive. I I have the sport package with rear axel steering and I’d recommend that as the stability and maneuverability is really great. Sometimes I wish I’d gotten PDK, but the manual is great overall.
I do think the car is much more enjoyable to drive than my F80/2 M3 and M4 and obviously performance and handling are better than even the M4 GTS despite its huge advantages which should tell you all you need to know. I actually think Porsche made the transition to turbo motors from atmospheric better than just about anyone in terms of not changing the overall character.
Happy to chat I’ve you’ve got specific questions.
Pics of car? I love Miami blue!
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      01-13-2019, 02:25 PM   #9
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991.2 GT3 here.

I've driven the S and T in an attempt to persuade myself against the GT3 (failed, obviously) and they're fantastic cars.

I actually think the PEC LA track doesn't do any of these cars justice. It's a somewhat neutered track (by design) and you really can't get the full feel of these cars. With that said, all of the 991 gen 911s are incredible and I would take the T or S over my old M4 in a heartbeat.

Here are my thoughts on your concerns:

Price: Fair, but everything in this world is pay-to-play. I think a CPO S is actually a great deal (heck, even look at a GTS maybe). If you look at CPO prices compared to depreciation in the next 3-4 years of ownership the opportunity cost isn't that bad (yes these cars depreciate but not like a current gen M car, especially if you're smart and just go CPO).

lack of practicality: These cars are plenty practical as long as you don't need to put people in the back seat (small kids and dogs, fine. I put my dog in the GT3 without a problem) and don't need to transport anything larger than a carry-on suitcase.

attention: Meh honestly most 911s don't get a ton of attention but I guess that depends where you live. In California, most 911s won't turn a single head but that's part of the appeal to me (if I was an attention whore I'd be in a lambo).

low front end: Also fair, but just make sure you find a car with the Front Axel Lift option. My GT3 is manageable with the lift (key word is manageable, I still scrape maybe every-other drive, but the lips on these cars are basically disposable). I scraped almost as much in my M4 with full lip. I'd imagine an S or T would be even more manageable.
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      01-13-2019, 02:30 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gatorfast View Post
Pics of car? I love Miami blue!
I was at my local Porsche dealer last week and they had a Miami Blue GTS. So beautiful, especially amongst the sea of silver/grey Porsches everybody seems to drive in the already gray Northwest.
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      01-13-2019, 02:38 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Germanauto View Post
I was at my local Porsche dealer last week and they had a Miami Blue GTS. So beautiful, especially amongst the sea of silver/grey Porsches everybody seems to drive in the already gray Northwest.
Totally agree. While the silvers and grey looks good, Porsche has many great blues and greens and racing yellow always fits them well.
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      01-13-2019, 02:41 PM   #12
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I have driven the 2012-2016 and 2017-2019 base Carreras non competively and find them to be very civilized and enjoyable. I think if you can afford it, they would make very good daily drivers. And although Id probably want PDK for the DC area, I would suffer with a 7mt too without complaint.
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      01-13-2019, 09:30 PM   #13
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991.2 GT3 here. I put my dog in the GT3 without a problem
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      01-13-2019, 09:36 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
991.2 Carrera S here - Miami Blue, 7MT.

The car itself is nothing short of incredible. The turbo motor in these cars is one of if not the most tech advanced turbo motors available. The response and character of the engine are really impressive and make it very enjoyable to drive. I I have the sport package with rear axel steering and Id recommend that as the stability and maneuverability is really great. Sometimes I wish Id gotten PDK, but the manual is great overall.
I do think the car is much more enjoyable to drive than my F80/2 M3 and M4 and obviously performance and handling are better than even the M4 GTS despite its huge advantages which should tell you all you need to know. I actually think Porsche made the transition to turbo motors from atmospheric better than just about anyone in terms of not changing the overall character.
Happy to chat Ive youve got specific questions.

except exhaust tone. Love turbos and would pick on over an N/A any day but the sound is just not there.
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      01-13-2019, 09:57 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
Totally agree. While the silvers and grey looks good, Porsche has many great blues and greens and racing yellow always fits them well.
I see so many 1-3 year old 911s for sale so I think these people buy safer colors that wont depreciate so much.
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      01-13-2019, 10:07 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Funf6cyl View Post
I had 2 e92 M3s and thought the steering was rather numb, especially off center. The 991 (and the 991.2 more so) electric has much better feel and accuracy than any hydraulic bmw ever managed - sorry to say it but it’s true.
Porsche's electronic steering may be way ahead of BMW's terrible electric steering these days---but even the best Porsche electronic steering racks are woeful compared to the hydraulic racks.

Yes Porsche hydraulic racks were great, but BMW's good hydraulic racks are MILES ahead of the best Porsche electronic steering.

I have driven a few 991s and was pretty disappointed in their lack of feel, how large they felt (for a Porsche), and how they tried to become luxury rather than sport. MUCH preferred the 993, 996s, and 997s i've driven. I hope the 992 is a big step forward because the 991 was not a positive transition, IMO.

The last time i drove a Cayman GTS and a 991 Targa; i got back into my 1M and the steering felt GLORIOUS. no comparison to the electronic racks.
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      01-13-2019, 10:32 PM   #17
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991.2 T here. I’ve also driven the 991.2S. As long as you don’t go with light weight buckets in the T, daily driving the car is not a problem. I have them as the car sees the track and they are amazing but they are a challenge getting in and out. Overall the 991.2 chassis and performance is the best version yet.
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      01-13-2019, 11:58 PM   #18
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My buddy has a 991.2 T and he is completely in love. He also owns a e92 M.

After driving a few 911s including his T, they are better in every way to any BMW. But there are a few Ms that will always have a place in my heart including my e92.

The 911 will absolutely flatter your ego as a driver and you can go wrong with any model. I can't wait to order my 992.
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      01-14-2019, 03:02 AM   #19
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I would put the 1M steering above any Porsche offering for my tastes. I love the 1M steering. It is sublime, IMO.

This Summer I drove 991.1 GT3, 987 Cayman S, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 T, 718 GTS, 718 S.

The 718 S was over a 2day period for 250 miles. It did not have PASM, but was a manual.

After driving these cars, I think Porsche has the best EPS steering going and it is not close.
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      01-14-2019, 10:10 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by seis-speed View Post
I would put the 1M steering above any Porsche offering for my tastes. I love the 1M steering. It is sublime, IMO.

This Summer I drove 991.1 GT3, 987 Cayman S, 991.2 GTS, 991.2 T, 718 GTS, 718 S.

The 718 S was over a 2day period for 250 miles. It did not have PASM, but was a manual.

After driving these cars, I think Porsche has the best EPS steering going and it is not close.
Interesting about the 1M steering, Id be curious to drive one. For me the best hydraulic steering experience is the Gen V Viper ACR-E. I have yet to drive a better drivers car.
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      01-14-2019, 11:24 AM   #21
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I put a few blankets down and it's perfect. Part of the appeal of the GT3 for me was the "back seat" for the occasional drive with the dog. Leaving adults at home is fine but I usually want my dog with me whenever possible.
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      01-14-2019, 11:45 AM   #22
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Yeah i get the back seat appeal, I rented a 911 and my 7 year old was screaming and giggling in the back as i changed down from 7th to 4th and she got all revvy and shit.

But a dog, no freaking way, vile creatures.
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