[Polo08816]

Originally Posted by Raptor7

wow thank you all for all the responses, I think im going to go with an xdrive with winter tires for peace of mind and not worrying about getting stuck or slipping and sliding

xDrive will not prevent you from sliding anymore than RWD will. Sliding is lateral movement.

[tjlees]

Originally Posted by Raptor7

wow thank you all for all the responses, I think im going to go with an xdrive with winter tires for peace of mind and not worrying about getting stuck or slipping and sliding

Good choice. it might be boring compared to RWD, but I seem to have no problem power sliding the car round - even in the wet!

[F87_LCI]

Originally Posted by Thrillbilly

The only think I didn't initially like about the xDrive was the "stance", i.e. ride height. I went the "RWD Sport Spring" route before they came out with the HR xDrive springs and I couldn't be happier. It got the ride height down a bit and the DHP still works great.

WRT "stance". Agreed. A little "before and after":

Stock ride height made me want to vomit:



Easily corrected with a set of H&R Sports:




As for all the guys touting how much more "fun" RWD is than AWD, I suppose that all comes down to your point of view and what your definition of "fun" is. Personally, I have no problems getting the rear end to step out on my AWD whenever I want to simply by putting the car in Sport+ mode and using my 6MT to modulate the power delivery. So if that is what makes it "fun" to drive a RWD, it can be done with AWD as well. If your talking about drifting on the track, I would agree that is easier to do with a RWD than an AWD...but then again I'd rather have more fun by getting a better lap time, not wasting time sliding around. Add to that the ability to get through pretty much any amount of snow in the winter...I'm just fine with AWD. But that's my experience and what works for me. To each their own, but I don't think anyone can categorically say which is "better".

[Fronzdan]

Way to go Raptor! Very decisive. You'll be happy with your choice.

[Fronzdan]

Hey Laguna...you have the H&R xDrive version springs? Do you have any issues? I've been reading posts where people say a) it puts stress on your AWD, b) kills your ride comfort, c) wears down your struts quickly. Granted some of the people saying that might not even have xDrive with the H&Rs installed.

[tjlees]

Originally Posted by LagunaSecaBlue

WRT "stance". Agreed. A little "before and after":

Stock ride height made me want to vomit:



Easily corrected with a set of H&R Sports:



.

(But do need those windows tinted and carbon fibre wing mirrors)

[F87_LCI]

Originally Posted by tjlees

(But do need those windows tinted and carbon fibre wing mirrors)

It's a $5,000 Individual Paint option...why would I cover it up with CF?

besides...I have CF...on the inside

[tjlees]

Originally Posted by LagunaSecaBlue

It's a $5,000 Individual Paint option...why would I cover it up with CF?

besides...I have CF...on the inside

Yep liking that ... Tints then???

[F87_LCI]

Originally Posted by Fronzdan

Hey Laguna...you have the H&R xDrive version springs? Do you have any issues? I've been reading posts where people say a) it puts stress on your AWD, b) kills your ride comfort, c) wears down your struts quickly. Granted some of the people saying that might not even have xDrive with the H&Rs installed.

Haters.

I have the correct xDrive part numbers - slightly less drop than RWD version to account for xDrive half shaft angles. No issues. I also have DHC. No issues.

Ride comfort? It's a lowered vehicle...for those who want ride comfort, go drive your dad's 1995 Buick Roadmaster...and while your at it get a porch swing and buy a cardigan. Cause you're old.



What kills your struts (and rims) is driving on GTA (Greater Toronto Area) roads! F'n potholes!!

[Blubaron79]

Originally Posted by LagunaSecaBlue

It's a $5,000 Individual Paint option...why would I cover it up with CF?

besides...I have CF...on the inside

Yea. What blue is that again?

Edit: Oh wait.. I'm a moron.. It's in your profile!!!!

[F87_LCI]

Originally Posted by tjlees

Yep liking that ... Tints then???

Cops are a real pain in the ass when it comes to Tinted windows here in Toronto. Most don't care and will leave you alone, but every now and then...there's "that guy". The Cop that feels it's his personal mission in life to ruin your day by being a prick...just because he can.

Sorry OP, this thread has come a bit

You won't regret your decision to go with xDrive. Just remember to get winter tires as well when the time comes. Go see Allen at Simply Tire in the GTA...he will set you up with a good deal. If you're concerned about ride height get a set of H&R Sport Springs, just make sure you get the xDrive version...product number for 2014-15 435 xDrive is 28832-1

[Mike_L]

Originally Posted by tex2670

According to AutoTrader, 55% of BMWs are sold with AWD:

http://www.philly.com/philly/classif..._security.html

The real number is closer to 70%, including SUVs.

[Thumper333]

Originally Posted by LagunaSecaBlue

I'm over 40 (wow, that's more painfiul to type than I thought it would be!), lived in Canada my whole life. If this is a daily driver, xDrive and snow tires in the winter. Full stop.

Because if I have to sit behind you on the QEW during a snow storm because you listened to some guy in California tell you "xDrive is for girls" and are now driving 25 km/hr and sliding all over the place, I'm going to pull you out of your car, punch you in the face, and tell you "I told you so."

Originally Posted by KG3356MT

LMAO best post ever!!

LMAO

I was going to turn around and walk right out of this one but this post caught my eye too.


Carry on with the pointless back and forth................you can see from my cars what side of the fence I live on.

[Ali Shiralian]

Originally Posted by Polo08816

Here we go again....

The main advantage xDrive has over RWD is forward acceleration in deep snow. It has little to no impact on control, safety, and stopping. xDrive doesn't stop any better than RWD does. Stopping is a function of the amount of grip you have between the road surface and your tires. What type of tires you have will have the most impact on control, safety, and stopping.

Yes here we go again, if you look up my comment, I did mention that he need to equip his car with winter tires, something you conveniently ignored. I've had rear drive bimmers and XDrive bimmers. Both being equipped with winter tires, there is no question XDrive is superior to rear drive in winter conditions. OP leaves in Canada, meaning snow six months a year. If you talk about which car is more FUN, drifting etc, ok you maybe right but for a 22year old driving in Canada, I strongly recommend XDrive no question.

[Polo08816]

Originally Posted by Ali Shiralian

Sorry but it's the wrong kind of advise you are giving a 22 year old who is looking to buy a 428/435. He lives in Canada and deals with snow on winter time for about six months. I think I rather see him save his life and others by getting Xdrive with four winter tires and have less FUN. with no disrespect to OP, because he is young, his driving skills are limited plus Xdrive is actually FUN in winter because you wI'll be able to control the car better and actually stop.

Originally Posted by Polo08816

Here we go again....

The main advantage xDrive has over RWD is forward acceleration in deep snow. It has little to no impact on control, safety, and stopping. xDrive doesn't stop any better than RWD does. Stopping is a function of the amount of grip you have between the road surface and your tires. What type of tires you have will have the most impact on control, safety, and stopping.

Originally Posted by Ali Shiralian

Yes here we go again, if you look up my comment, I did mention that he need to equip his car with winter tires, something you conveniently ignored. I've had rear drive bimmers and XDrive bimmers. Both being equipped with winter tires, there is no question XDrive is superior to rear drive in winter conditions. OP leaves in Canada, meaning snow six months a year. If you talk about which car is more FUN, drifting etc, ok you maybe right but for a 22year old driving in Canada, I strongly recommend XDrive no question.

I'll do one better than just looking up. I'll quote it all so there's no confusion.

You said xDrive is better because it'll stop better. Better is a comparative term. Better than what? Better when equipped with snow tires as opposed to all seasons. Well, no shit! That's obvious.

Your post implied that the xDrive was better for control and stopping than RWD. That's not true. If an xDrive car and a RWD are equipped with identical winter tires, there's no significant difference in "control" - lateral grip - and stopping. Those are simply a function of the level of static traction your winter tires would provide.

[educated_layman]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

True. So long as the road conditions won't cause fishtail it's not a problem. When they will cause fishtailing you're better off with more braking applied to the rear wheels. The best way to do that is with engine braking.

I'm not sure I agree. There are two broad categories of scenarios in which a vehicle will fishtail. The first is when going around a curve at a speed that requires centripetal force in excess of the force of static friction between the rear wheels and the road surface, which has just about nothing to do with braking. The second is when coming to a sudden stop on a slippery surface. In this situation, what generally happens is that the rear wheels lock up due to too *much*, not too *little*, braking force applied. The result is that the front wheels, which for an instant have not yet lost traction, apply a greater moment about the vehicle's center of mass (orthogonal to the driving surface) which causes the vehicle to yaw with respect to its direction of travel. Once the vehicle yaws, it's all over. You can't do anything to apply more braking force to the rear wheels because they've already lost traction. And even if you were able to perfectly adjust the steering to keep the front wheels aligned with the direction of travel, any additional braking force applied there would simply increase the fishtailing because at this point the vehicle is acting like an inverted pendulum. The only way to recover from that situation is to release the brakes completely and keep the front wheels oriented in the direction of travel. This will cause the very slight force of dynamic friction between the rear (sliding) wheels and the road to act as a restoring force (because it will exceed any rolling resistance from the front wheels, which won't be sliding if they're oriented in the direction of travel)t, and thus reduce the yaw angle (until the angle vanishes and the vehicle straightens out, or you slide off the road -- whichever comes first).

I can't see how any additional braking force applied to the rear wheels (either through use of the emergency brake or engine braking) would the effects described above. If anything, it would tend to make you more likely to exceed the maximum tractive force at the rear wheels, which itself would cause a fishtail.

That said, I think it is plausible that additional braking force applied to the rear wheels only could help you recover from, but not prevent, a fishtail. That's because if the rear wheels are sliding out, you want to apply the maximum braking force possible at the rear wheels because this force will act to restore the vehicle to its direction of travel and reduce the yaw angle. So a vehicle with locked up rear wheels and unbraked front wheels will probably straighten out more quickly than one in which the rear wheels are still rolling. But I don't see how this effect could help until the vehicle has already begun to fishtail.

Originally Posted by Billfitz

The only advantage to engine braking with FWD is that it's less likely to cause wheel lock up, unless you have a very good ABS system.

How so? If you take the same vehicle with the same rate of deceleration, and in one instance you're achieving that deceleration through engine braking (applied to only the front wheels, since it's FWD) and in the other instance you're achieving it through use of the service brake, you have to apply the same net force to the vehicle (because force is directly proportional to acceleration). Therefore, the force applied by the front tires in the engine braking scenario is going to be approximately twice the force applied by the front tires in the service braking scenario. As a result, the front tires are much closer to reaching their maximum force of static friction (which, if exceeded, causes the wheels to lock up) in the engine braking scenario. This does not seem like the effect desired.

[Earthmaster]

So I live in the GTA and I decided to get Xdrive because snow driving was absolutely BRUTAL in my G37s coupe even with winters (albeit not top of the line winters). With brand new Micheline Alpine PA4s I have never had an issue and I'm super happy with the Xdrive and the winters. I can tell you that top of the line winter tires make more of a difference than Xdrive. However, since you live in stouffville I'm not sure if you guys get more snow or if it gets plowed less often. As roads are usually plowed relatively well in one day so personally I think I would have been okay with RWD but if you live in any place that takes a bit longer to plow some areas its much better to just get Xdrive. Also in Canada the resale value is SO much better with xdrive, and I would get it just for this option of re sale. Unless your hardcore track guy, of which then you would probably just get a dedicated track car, then there really is no reason to get RWD in GTA. If I lived in sunnier states I would never get AWD cause burnouts haha.

[Pauleebe]

Originally Posted by Mike_L

The real number is closer to 70%, including SUVs.

I still find this suprisingly low. Non-xDrive BMW's are like unicorns.

Of course if you go to FL or CA, I'm sure they're more common.

[Mike_L]

Originally Posted by dwalls90

I still find this suprisingly low. Non-xDrive BMW's are like unicorns.

Of course if you go to FL or CA, I'm sure they're more common.

Yeah, you expect to see more rear drivers down south. However, I'm currently driving down the coast and am in Myrtle Beach, SC right now. There are NO BMWs to be found. No rear drivers, no xDrive, no nothing. I've seen more Chevy Police Caprices down here than BMWs, which I never see in NY (we have the Charger PPVs).

[tturedraider]

Originally Posted by dwalls90

I still find this suprisingly low. Non-xDrive BMW's are like unicorns.

Of course if you go to FL or CA, I'm sure they're more common.

In the south and west xDrive is like a unicorn. I still can't get used to the fact that every car on Chicagoland BMW lots is an xDrive. Coming from a long history of RWD being one of the defining characteristics of BMW it is just so weird.

[ska///235i]

Originally Posted by Polo08816

xDrive will not prevent you from sliding anymore than RWD will. Sliding is lateral movement.

Yea but with awd you wouldnt be sliding in the first place *if both have winter tires* the rwd will slide and the awd will drive thru Mount Mckinley 3x times without any issues

Im coming from both rwd and awd

[tturedraider]

Originally Posted by Mike_L

Yeah, you expect to see more rear drivers down south. However, I'm currently driving down the coast and am in Myrtle Beach, SC right now. There are NO BMWs to be found. No rear drivers, no xDrive, no nothing. I've seen more Chevy Police Caprices down here than BMWs, which I never see in NY (we have the Charger PPVs).

This is something folks outside major metropolitan areas and California don't get. BMW still only represents about 2.5% of the U.S. market each year. In the vast majority of the country you don't see oodles of BMWs every day. When I drive from Chicago to Texas I typically encounter fewer than twenty BMWs on a 1,100 mile trip.