[RPM90]

Originally Posted by oceanview

Are you sure?
Grey Calipers on 335i has
340mm disc in front with 4 Piston caliper
330mm disc in rear with 1 Piston caliper

Blue calipers on 335i has
370mm disc in front with 4 Piston caliper
345mm disc in rear with 2 Piston caliper

I've never heard of gray calipers fitting on 370/345 discs.
Just measure your front and rear disc diameter to verify.

(Edit: Just read above that sometimes they come in grey. Probably some monday production or painters on strike. However Rotor Diameter is a safe indicator)

I'm not sure on the rotor size.
They look plenty big compared to what the 328i get.
They are likely about an inch in diameter smaller to the M Performance/Msport, which is consistent with the information out there.

Info on blue Msport and M Performance is much clearer.
The LCI 340 build site shows calipers that look very similar if not identical to the blue Msport brakes
Confusing for sure.

For me I wouldn't pay $2300 for M Performance brakes if I had the $650 blue Msport brakes.
Also, the 370mm non drilled and slotted rotor is quite a bit heavier than the 340mm rotor.
I don't think going to the quite a bit heaver 370mm rotor is any improvement due to the rotating and unsprung weight.

Pad size appears to be the same and that means the same sweep area, and same brake force, given pad type.
The larger rotor will give better heat dissipation, good for track but nothing for non track driving.

[oceanview]

Originally Posted by RPM90

For me I wouldn't pay $2300 for M Performance brakes if I had the $650 blue Msport brakes.
Also, the 370mm non drilled and slotted rotor is quite a bit heavier than the 340mm rotor.
I don't think going to the quite a bit heaver 370mm rotor is any improvement due to the rotating and unsprung weight.

The larger rotor will give better heat dissipation, good for track but nothing for non track driving.

At the top of my post you can find a Link to an Excel List also including weight information.
http://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=858607

The 370mm M Performance Rotor (dimpled/slotted) is about 20% heavier then the 340mm Rotor. (10 kg vs. 11.8 kg)

The 370mm Rotor of M Sport Brake is about 70% heavier then the 340mm Rotor (16.5 kg)

Don't forget the wheels, they also count for total weight. A 405M 20" combo are a few kilogram less then most smaller combinations.

In daily driving my experience is, that brake response is much better in heavy rain situations. That's probably it.

One can "upgrade" the M Sport Brake (only the version with 370mm front rotor) with the lower weight 370 mm dimpled and slotted M Performance Rotor (front and rear).

One can also "upgrade" the M Sport Brake (340mm Rotor) with dimpled and slotted rotor (front and rear). Weight stays the same.

However, a total of about 90 kilogram of wheel weight and a total of about 60 kilogram brake weight makes about 10% of the total car mass.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by oceanview

At the top of my post you can find a Link to an Excel List also including weight information.
http://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=858607

The 370mm M Performance Rotor (dimpled/slotted) is about 20% heavier then the 340mm Rotor. (10 kg vs. 11.8 kg)

The 370mm Rotor of M Sport Brake is about 70% heavier then the 340mm Rotor (16.5 kg)

Don't forget the wheels, they also count for total weight. A 405M 20" combo are a few kilogram less then most smaller combinations.

In daily driving my experience is, that brake response is much better in heavy rain situations. That's probably it.

One can "upgrade" the M Sport Brake (only the version with 370mm front rotor) with the lower weight 370 mm dimpled and slotted M Performance Rotor (front and rear).

One can also "upgrade" the M Sport Brake (340mm Rotor) with dimpled and slotted rotor (front and rear). Weight stays the same.

However, a total of about 90 kilogram of wheel weight and a total of about 60 kilogram brake weight makes about 10% of the total car mass.

Unsprung weight has a greater effect on over all performance including braking, cornering, and acceleration.
If the blue Msport brakes don't have any positive effect on braking, then their added weight is not helping anything and is likely negatively affecting performance.
How much is not known unless it were tested to see if there is any noticeable affect given the weight differences.

At a recent BMW drive event I took a 335xi Msport out for a test drive
It had the optional sport exhaust, VERY nice for a daily driver, and the blue Msport brakes, 19" wheels/tires, with DHP, and PPK.
The blueMsport brake rotors are bigger than what's on my 335i.

My 335i doesn't have Msport brakes or 19" wheels.
Other than the cool exhaust both cars felt very similar.
Even the power felt same/similar likely because the test car is AWD and mine is RWD, so some drive line loss.
The PPK xi did have a smidge more power, but one would be hard pressed to say, "OH YEAH", because it didn't feel like that at all.

Brake pedal felt the same with no improvement and I didn't expect there to be really. I did feel the extra brake torque on a hard stop on a long straight.
Initial bite felt a bit quicker and once the pads set I could feel the extra brake force. I didn't lock the brakes to where ABS kicked in because that would show nothing really other than how ABS works.

Msport brakes on a 335i compared to the brakes on a 335i wasn't night and day and over all not very noticeable under most driving conditions.
Under hard braking there is more brake force.
If I had the blue Msport brakes I wouldn't spend the money for M Performance brakes.
Unfortunately for 2016 the blue Msport brake option is not an option as it was before. For 2016 on a 340i those brakes are only available as part of the track package.
For $650 I may have ordered them just because I like how the blue calipers look.

It's worth mentioning again as I may be the only one who's posted about this, on the demo 2016 BMW build site, when you build a 340i with Msport package it shows gray calipers that are 4 pot up front, but the rear looks like a 2 pot. I don't know if this is some anomaly of the demo site, or, did BMW change what brakes they will put on cars with the Msport package.
We'll know soon. My 2016 340i Msport, no brake option no track pack, should be here by the end of September or early October.

[oceanview]

Originally Posted by RPM90

My 2016 340i Msport, no brake option no track pack, should be here by the end of September or early October.

On the parts catalog of bmw.de website they list the same brake configuration for the 340i as for the 335i.
So factory with no options should deliver
4-pot front with 340mm rotor
1-pot rear with 330mm rotor
This refers to German builts. No US Version catalog online so far. LCI models not yet listed on realoem.com

Total weight of M Performance Brakes are more or less the same as factory, but less than S2NHA option for the 335i/340i because of lightweight Rotors compared to "normal" 370mm rotors.

If one chooses a 335i/340i with S2NHA option, he could change front/rear rotors to dimpled/slotted version and would then have the same as M Performance Brakes (but with blue calippers instead of red,gold,orange).

Is a brake upgrade on cars with factory 340mm rotor worth the money?
From a technical point of view (as far as I can judge) probably only when driving in hard conditions (pulling trailer, track) where the brake are getting very hot. Lager rotor will have an advantage and slotted rotors will give better cooling / degasing of brake pads.
For cars with 330mm, 312mm or even 300mm rotor an upgrade to M Performance Brakes is probably like day/night driving.

From an optical point of view?

An USA factory no-option version 328iX has 312mm front rotor and 300mm rear rotor (both with a one pot caliper).
If pulling a heavy trailer with this 245hp car (which is possible because of xDrive and Engine Power) and driving down a long pass, brakes are under massive load!

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by oceanview

On the parts catalog of bmw.de website they list the same brake configuration for the 340i as for the 335i.
So factory with no options should deliver
4-pot front with 340mm rotor
1-pot rear with 330mm rotor
This refers to German builts. No US Version catalog online so far. LCI models not yet listed on realoem.com

Total weight of M Performance Brakes are more or less the same as factory, but less than S2NHA option for the 335i/340i because of lightweight Rotors compared to "normal" 370mm rotors.

If one chooses a 335i/340i with S2NHA option, he could change front/rear rotors to dimpled/slotted version and would then have the same as M Performance Brakes (but with blue calippers instead of red,gold,orange).

Is a brake upgrade on cars with factory 340mm rotor worth the money?
From a technical point of view (as far as I can judge) probably only when driving in hard conditions (pulling trailer, track) where the brake are getting very hot. Lager rotor will have an advantage and slotted rotors will give better cooling / degasing of brake pads.
For cars with 330mm, 312mm or even 300mm rotor an upgrade to M Performance Brakes is probably like day/night driving.

From an optical point of view?

An USA factory no-option version 328iX has 312mm front rotor and 300mm rear rotor (both with a one pot caliper).
If pulling a heavy trailer with this 245hp car (which is possible because of xDrive and Engine Power) and driving down a long pass, brakes are under massive load!

That makes sense.
If that info holds for US cars as well, then the US demo website shows the incorrect brakes with the Msport pkg option.

On the site right now if you select the Msport pkg the brakes are different.
There are 4 pots on the front that are covered like the optional Msport brakes except they are gray and have the M logo on them.
The rears are also covered in gray and are 2 pot.
But the rotors appear to be the same size as the standard brakes.
Odd.

I test drove a BMW drive event 335xi Msport with the M Performance exhaust, PPK, and Msport brakes.
It was nice to compare the Msport brakes to my standard 335i brakes.
There isn't any appreciable difference in daily driving.
On a very heavy braking test I could notice a touch more brake torque especially at the rear of the car. It felt like the rear end was hunkering down a bit more so than in my 335i.
The Msport brakes are definitely something I would option if I tracked my car, but for a daily driver they are not needed.
They look cool if you want the blue calipers.
It would be nice if BMW offered them in black or sliver/gray for those that don't a "look at me!" caliper color.
The gray painted calipers on the demo build site are nice and I wouldn't mind having those.

I still say the Msport package should INCLUDE the Msport brakes.
Frankly it's stupid of BMW not to include them on a package they name "M sport".
Just rename it the "M sport body kit package", because that's pretty much what it is other than the steering wheel, and they sure charge enough for the package that a $650 Msport brake option can be included.

[Prissy]

Tell you the truth... I don't feel a difference.

[DJ Rocc]

I have read on here that some Vehicles with MSport Brakes dont come programmed correctly for them. Has this been proven? And have any of you guys checked this?

[Tim182]

Originally Posted by DJ Rocc

I have read on here that some Vehicles with MSport Brakes dont come programmed correctly for them. Has this been proven? And have any of you guys checked this?

Does anyone know what the situation is like on the new 3/440i (LCI) models? I am looking at a 440i M Sport and am wondering whether to add the M Sport Plus package, which includes the "M Sport braking system" with blue callipers. According to the description, "the front brake callipers are each equipped with four pistons, the rear callipers with two pistons. The discs are particularly large with interior ventilation, providing superior heat dissipation. The wide diameter of the brake discs also means that the effective surface of the brakes is larger, optimising brake performance."

I can't find info on the standard ones.

[bateau]

3/440 brakes are same as 3/435.

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/part...0i&mg=34&sg=05


http://www.realoem.com/bmw/enUS/part...0i&mg=34&sg=10

[lordcandle]

I recommend you get the M sport brake option. I had the stock brakes on my 335i (gray), I upgraded to the m performance brakes (red), same size as M sport brakes (blue), Big difference in stopping power and no fade when driving for fun.

[Cammy5]

Originally Posted by RPM90

That makes sense.
If that info holds for US cars as well, then the US demo website shows the incorrect brakes with the Msport pkg option.

On the site right now if you select the Msport pkg the brakes are different.
There are 4 pots on the front that are covered like the optional Msport brakes except they are gray and have the M logo on them.
The rears are also covered in gray and are 2 pot.
But the rotors appear to be the same size as the standard brakes.
Odd.

I test drove a BMW drive event 335xi Msport with the M Performance exhaust, PPK, and Msport brakes.
It was nice to compare the Msport brakes to my standard 335i brakes.
There isn't any appreciable difference in daily driving.
On a very heavy braking test I could notice a touch more brake torque especially at the rear of the car. It felt like the rear end was hunkering down a bit more so than in my 335i.
The Msport brakes are definitely something I would option if I tracked my car, but for a daily driver they are not needed.
They look cool if you want the blue calipers.
It would be nice if BMW offered them in black or sliver/gray for those that don't a "look at me!" caliper color.
The gray painted calipers on the demo build site are nice and I wouldn't mind having those.

I still say the Msport package should INCLUDE the Msport brakes.
Frankly it's stupid of BMW not to include them on a package they name "M sport".
Just rename it the "M sport body kit package", because that's pretty much what it is other than the steering wheel, and they sure charge enough for the package that a $650 Msport brake option can be included.

I'm with you 1000000% on the whole M Sport pkg should have M Sport brakes. My car has the 4piston front/1 piston rear brakes on my 328i M Sport and every time I've looked for replacement pads I get conflicting accounts of what will and won't work. I just switched out to Hawk 5.0 pads which I wrote about in another thread and am very happy that I did.

[Polo08816]

Originally Posted by RPM90

That makes sense.
If that info holds for US cars as well, then the US demo website shows the incorrect brakes with the Msport pkg option.

On the site right now if you select the Msport pkg the brakes are different.
There are 4 pots on the front that are covered like the optional Msport brakes except they are gray and have the M logo on them.
The rears are also covered in gray and are 2 pot.
But the rotors appear to be the same size as the standard brakes.
Odd.

I test drove a BMW drive event 335xi Msport with the M Performance exhaust, PPK, and Msport brakes.
It was nice to compare the Msport brakes to my standard 335i brakes.
There isn't any appreciable difference in daily driving.
On a very heavy braking test I could notice a touch more brake torque especially at the rear of the car. It felt like the rear end was hunkering down a bit more so than in my 335i.
The Msport brakes are definitely something I would option if I tracked my car, but for a daily driver they are not needed.
They look cool if you want the blue calipers.
It would be nice if BMW offered them in black or sliver/gray for those that don't a "look at me!" caliper color.
The gray painted calipers on the demo build site are nice and I wouldn't mind having those.

I still say the Msport package should INCLUDE the Msport brakes.
Frankly it's stupid of BMW not to include them on a package they name "M sport".
Just rename it the "M sport body kit package", because that's pretty much what it is other than the steering wheel, and they sure charge enough for the package that a $650 Msport brake option can be included.

Well, there is that extra cooler....

Either way, a $650 M Sport brake option from the factory is a no brainer.

[bimmer456]

Originally Posted by SergioK

Yes. CBS called for front brakes, they ended up putting new pads in all four corners.

I was told they even replace the rotors with new ones rather than resurfacing them. Though this was told to me by the finance person who also said you literally have to drive it 20 miles every day or the battery will die or the fluids will go bad. Maybe a bit exaggerated I think and he's not a mechanic. UPDATE I just read on another thread they do replace the disc and wear sensors.

[oceanview]

Originally Posted by bimmer456

I was told they even replace the rotors with new ones rather than resurfacing them.

That's my recommendation as well.
When the pads are worn, the rotor thickness is also worn. Resurfacing the rotor takes some additional material off.
Even if the rotor is not yet down to the minimal thickness written on the rotor, the surfaced rotor will not hold one more pad.
People often don't pay attention to the fact, that the rotor should last another pad life size!

Now, if the rotor type is dimpled/slotted, the thinner the rotor gets, the more you loose the advantage of the dimples and slots.

So I always (like an iron rule) replace pads and rotors as a whole unit on my car. I pay the price difference from surfacing to a new set of rotors. Worth for me.

[e90reborn]

Originally Posted by ipilcher

It goes just as far, but it's slower.

LEDs warp space around them so light have to travel a greater distance, that’s why you perceive it slower but in fact it isn’t.

[fuxshiba]

I just got a full set of brakes from an 2018 M4, with big front and rear disks, being 380 and 370.

The disks difference is clear, which wont fit on my car without adapters. But could anyone confirm for me, if the calipers are the same as M Performance and M Sport blue ones.

Or really, are they all the same 4 pot front and 2 pot rear Brembo calipers with the same mounting?

[SoCalCarGuy]

Originally Posted by DJ Rocc

Has anyone had any experience with both brakes? Did the Msport brakes really do a better job at stopping? Did they fade less?

Any specs on each, ie stopping distance?

Originally Posted by DJ Rocc

Has anyone had any experience with both brakes? Did the Msport brakes really do a better job at stopping? Did they fade less?

Any specs on each, ie stopping distance?

Dv

[paltsevk]

Originally Posted by lordcandle

I recommend you get the M sport brake option. I had the stock brakes on my 335i (gray), I upgraded to the m performance brakes (red), same size as M sport brakes (blue), Big difference in stopping power and no fade when driving for fun.

How much were m performance brakes?

[DriveS]

I gots some M-performance discs and EBC yellow pads, then VO coded 2NH for m-performance brakes.
Made a significant difference in initial bite and I have not managed to get them to fade yet which gives you confidence

[BigRedG80]

I have had the opportunity use the BMW Big Brake Kit as well as the M-Sport Brakes. I had the BMW Big Brake Kit installed on my 2012 BMW 335i. They looked great and provided lots of additional breaking power. See below for a picture of dimpled and slotted rotors on my car.

However, I had some frustrating difficulties with these brakes. I owned my 335i for six years with installed new rotors and pads twice. About a year after installing the rotors would warp (usually after the first winter). So when I would depress my brake pedal I could feel the pulsing in the pedal from a warped rotor(s). This is not the antilock system as it would do it every time I would brake. The warping was the worst at the end of the winter and would smooth out once the warm weather returned.

I thought this was a one off situation but the warping happened again when I replaced the dimpled/slotted rotors and pads with new ones. It was quite disappointing to have this happen again. Both times I had the rotors/pads installed professionally. I live in Canada and do quite a bit of winter driving. Given how dirty cars in Canada get after winter driving I would frequently wash it to keep the car clean. I am not sure if the winter weather or washing the car in winter did a number on my rotors. Or perhaps there is some other reason for the warping. Has anyone else had this problem.

In any event I just replaced my 2012 335i with a 2017 340i equipped with M-sport brakes. I have the new car a week now and I prefer the M-Sport setup over the BMW Big Brake Kit by far. I love how much more bit the M-Sport brakes have over the Big Brake Kit. Plus the M-Sport brakes use normal pads and not those ceramic ones which create a lot of brake dust. I was constantly cleaning the brake dust from my 335i rims.

[Logicoeur]

Originally Posted by F30_Fahrer

I have had the opportunity use the BMW Big Brake Kit as well as the M-Sport Brakes. I had the BMW Big Brake Kit installed on my 2012 BMW 335i. They looked great and provided lots of additional breaking power. See below for a picture of dimpled and slotted rotors on my car.

However, I had some frustrating difficulties with these brakes. I owned my 335i for six years with installed new rotors and pads twice. About a year after installing the rotors would warp (usually after the first winter). So when I would depress my brake pedal I could feel the pulsing in the pedal from a warped rotor(s). This is not the antilock system as it would do it every time I would brake. The warping was the worst at the end of the winter and would smooth out once the warm weather returned.

I thought this was a one off situation but the warping happened again when I replaced the dimpled/slotted rotors and pads with new ones. It was quite disappointing to have this happen again. Both times I had the rotors/pads installed professionally. I live in Canada and do quite a bit of winter driving. Given how dirty cars in Canada get after winter driving I would frequently wash it to keep the car clean. I am not sure if the winter weather or washing the car in winter did a number on my rotors. Or perhaps there is some other reason for the warping. Has anyone else had this problem.

In any event I just replaced my 2012 335i with a 2017 340i equipped with M-sport brakes. I have the new car a week now and I prefer the M-Sport setup over the BMW Big Brake Kit by far. I love how much more bit the M-Sport brakes have over the Big Brake Kit. Plus the M-Sport brakes use normal pads and not those ceramic ones which create a lot of brake dust. I was constantly cleaning the brake dust from my 335i rims.

Rotors don't warp.

Msport and Mperformance are the very same brake packages. Bmw just likes to complicate things. Also, ceramic pads create less dust, not more, than the OE semi-metallic pads bmw uses. Most OE turn to semi metallic pads because the initial bite is always there. That same great initial bite is why they create so much dust.

[BigRedG80]

If you say rotors don't warp then what would cause all pulsing in the brakes? When I put the new rotors on the problem went away till the following winter and then it came back.

I never had this kind of problem with the stock brakes that came with the car.

We have winter temperatures here going down to -35 to -40C. I park the car in a warm garage and then go out in the freezing cold