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      12-04-2018, 12:52 AM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XutvJet View Post
That is a forged crank.
i did some googling and realised it is forged due to the wide parting line and smooth edges. it also made a harmonic singing noise when i tapped it vs a thud a cast crank would make.

this then means that a pwg m135i which looks identical also has a forged crank as i have seen one as well.

what i dont understand is if the crank is forged and the rods are as well what makes the n54 internals stronger?
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      12-04-2018, 02:55 AM   #24
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I'm not sure if rods are forged. In n54 technical training from bmw ag they state that they are forged. in s55 or n55 documentation I haven't found that rods are forged.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristosD View Post
i did some googling and realised it is forged due to the wide parting line and smooth edges. it also made a harmonic singing noise when i tapped it vs a thud a cast crank would make.

this then means that a pwg m135i which looks identical also has a forged crank as i have seen one as well.

what i dont understand is if the crank is forged and the rods are as well what makes the n54 internals stronger?
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      12-04-2018, 01:24 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
Difference is in manifold and N55 turbo comes together with the manifold, that's why M2 turbo has another part no.
Sorry Im not too clear but then what are the obvious physical manifold turbo differences between the M2 N55 and the other N55 cars that you see so that we all can know, because I always wanted to know this? Fine you say the turbos are the same compressor and turbine wheels then what is the story between the two manifolds? Please show us a stock M2 turbofold setup. I am not saying you are wrong so I will make that clear.

Do you have a pic of the differences as well? Would love to see.
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      12-04-2018, 07:05 PM   #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
Difference is in manifold and N55 turbo comes together with the manifold, that's why M2 turbo has another part no.
I'd be interested to see this difference and if it's just a change for packaging or one for performance.
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      12-04-2018, 09:00 PM   #27
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Guys, I made a list for you. See the attached picture. To the best of my knowledge.

Outside of the obvious EWG big turbo, keep in mind the following two points that is critical but is not often talked about.
1) Steel forged crankshaft is the key to M135/235/M2 making noticeably more power everything else being equal.
2) M2 manifold is why it easily holds up 16+psi at 6k+ rpm, with stock turbo and pump gas.
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      12-04-2018, 09:20 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
Guys, I made a list for you. See the attached picture. To the best of my knowledge.

Outside of the obvious EWG big turbo, keep in mind the following two points that is critical but is not often talked about.
1) Steel forged crankshaft is the key to M135/235/M2 making noticeably more power everything else being equal.
2) M2 manifold is why it easily holds up 16+psi at 6k+ rpm, with stock turbo and pump gas.
I believe all of the rods would be forged. Forged rods are so common these days, manufacturers don't even mention that they're forged, hence why some people presumed that they're cast.

We really need to see the visual differences on the M2 manifold to understand.
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      12-04-2018, 09:25 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bradsm87 View Post
I believe all of the rods would be forged. Forged rods are so common these days, manufacturers don't even mention that they're forged, hence why some people presumed that they're cast.

We really need to see the visual differences on the M2 manifold to understand.
It was my typo. I really meant to show all N55 rods are the same.

And yes they're forged.

Chart updated.
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      12-05-2018, 02:02 AM   #30
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please correct your chart, intercoolers are the same part number either it is F30, F22 M235i or F87 M2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
It was my typo. I really meant to show all N55 rods are the same.

And yes they're forged.

Chart updated.
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      12-05-2018, 02:42 AM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
please correct your chart, intercoolers are the same part number either it is F30, F22 M235i or F87 M2.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
It was my typo. I really meant to show all N55 rods are the same.

And yes they're forged.

Chart updated.
I thought they're the same until the day of Wagner IC install. There was a F30 doing IC upgrade at the shop as well. We compared the two stock ICs and saw M2 was like 10% taller if memory serves right.

Didn't care too much as stock IC is the first thing to go once you power mod.
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      12-05-2018, 07:08 AM   #32
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it is the same part number.

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeanWRT View Post
I thought they're the same until the day of Wagner IC install. There was a F30 doing IC upgrade at the shop as well. We compared the two stock ICs and saw M2 was like 10% taller if memory serves right.

Didn't care too much as stock IC is the first thing to go once you power mod.
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      12-05-2018, 10:49 AM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
for unknown reasons you're confusing superseded and just different parts. e.g. maybe you will remove M2 turbo, then compare with usual N55 ewg turbo and will report - guys, part numbers are different but I've checked turbine/compressor wheels dimensions - they're actually the same turbos! But they're not. Difference is in manifold and N55 turbo comes together with the manifold, that's why M2 turbo has another part no.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ceedawg View Post
I will not go strictly by part numbers when it comes to engines in the same family. This can also be true with transmission parts for these cars as well. Yes years can vary with different parts it is a real mess Like I said
I have seen this with MB/AMG . The only true and accurate way to confirm what you have is when you have the actual motors from the different cars broken down right in front of your face. M235,335i,M2 let me see an actual motor broken down and each part compared. You will be surprised to find out how the different part numbers can actually be for the same part and sometimes depending on year. Some part numbers become discontinued and they will give a totally different part number for the same exact part. Happens to Engine parts,tranny parts and even suspension parts.

I have seen this with M50,52,S50,52 motors in the E36. Many interchangeable parts ,some with different part #s but the exact same part.

Just to throw this they also have an aluminum block M52 motor and a cast iron M52 block. Lots of folks did not know this. I always like to see the motors in person before the car maker starts spewing out differences for marketing purposes. Sometimes they are correct and sometimes the info is way off.
I've actually been looking for those turbo specs. Do you mind sharing what numbers you found for wheel and housing sizes? Maybe even A/R?
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      12-05-2018, 11:37 AM   #34
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M135/M235/M2 also have different oil cooler system than regular N55 equipped cars, although it looks like F30 with M-Sport has the same system.
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      12-05-2018, 01:38 PM   #35
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so its basically safe to assume the n55 can handle 400-450rwhp daily comfortably.
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      12-05-2018, 07:07 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChristosD View Post
so its basically safe to assume the n55 can handle 400-450rwhp daily comfortably.
The engine itself, yes no sweat as long as you have the mods to safely achieve it such as turbo upgrade.
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      12-06-2018, 12:57 AM   #37
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strange that in B58 technical training it is mentioned that rods are drop forged, while not a word about it in n55 or s55 pdfs. But I agree, it would be nonsense to use non-forged rods in s55 and part numbers are the same with n55. Interesting thing that s55 holds higher power than n55 which tends to bend rods at lower power level than s55..
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      12-06-2018, 04:08 AM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
it is the same part number.
Do you have Pics /info on the difference between the two manifolds 335 vs M2 ?
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      12-06-2018, 07:34 AM   #39
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ceedawg View Post
Do you have Pics /info on the difference between the two manifolds 335 vs M2 ?
exhaust manifolds? sadly not..
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      12-07-2018, 12:28 AM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
strange that in B58 technical training it is mentioned that rods are drop forged, while not a word about it in n55 or s55 pdfs. But I agree, it would be nonsense to use non-forged rods in s55 and part numbers are the same with n55. Interesting thing that s55 holds higher power than n55 which tends to bend rods at lower power level than s55..
I think those bent rods might be tune related rather than hardware. Achieving tuned S55 power on a N55 require going PS2+++ on the turbo which not many do; hence the experience tuning these turbos is less and more mistakes are made. Just a theory
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      12-07-2018, 01:33 AM   #41
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PS2 is only capable of max max ~550hp, to make 600+ on n55, PS2 is not enough for sure, need to go speedtech, but not many people went that way and almost no info about blown engines..

Quote:
Originally Posted by harkes View Post
I think those bent rods might be tune related rather than hardware. Achieving tuned S55 power on a N55 require going PS2+++ on the turbo which not many do; hence the experience tuning these turbos is less and more mistakes are made. Just a theory
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      12-09-2018, 03:33 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by harkes View Post
I think those bent rods might be tune related rather than hardware. Achieving tuned S55 power on a N55 require going PS2+++ on the turbo which not many do; hence the experience tuning these turbos is less and more mistakes are made. Just a theory
Quote:
Originally Posted by enemigo13 View Post
PS2 is only capable of max max ~550hp, to make 600+ on n55, PS2 is not enough for sure, need to go speedtech, but not many people went that way and almost no info about blown engines..
N55 bent rods are most likely due to people targeting ~19psi at as early as possible RPM with the stock turbo without great tunes. It's this low RPM extreme cylinder pressures that bend rods.
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      08-13-2022, 08:05 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 6SpeedCrewCab View Post
I plan on making somewhere around 400-450whp so that's good to know. Do you know if a clutch upgrade is required to hold that much power?
not required, but recommended. the more power youre making the sooner your clutch disk will need to be swapped out, apparently the synchro’s start to get eaten alive with mods as well, the ZF 6 speed MT is a good trans but its not known to be very mod friendly
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      08-13-2022, 08:16 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by perryreid90 View Post
not required, but recommended. the more power youre making the sooner your clutch disk will need to be swapped out, apparently the synchro’s start to get eaten alive with mods as well, the ZF 6 speed MT is a good trans but its not known to be very mod friendly
Why did you reply to a post from 4 years ago
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