06-07-2018, 11:34 AM | #23 | |
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Unfortunately, it is apparently currently unavailable on Amazon:https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...ustomerReviews |
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06-07-2018, 01:06 PM | #24 |
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Pretty much as long as you dont go too big for a stock car
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06-07-2018, 01:43 PM | #25 | |
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06-07-2018, 02:21 PM | #26 |
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I tested wagner EVO1 performance FMIC, it's not so big as EVO2, and wagner declares that it has less pressure drop than stock which is not true, I get ~50-60mbar (0.7-0.8psi) less top end boost pressure in the same gears same temperature same road. Temperatures on long pulls are far better of course I get ~25-30 degrees C lower IAT comparing to stock, but in general bigger the intercooler, bigger the drop.
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06-07-2018, 02:48 PM | #27 | |
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Your measurement is not conclusive of how pressure drop is measured. These cars are tuned by load not boost. That means day to day, you will not have the same boost pressures exactly. They target a load on the engine and boost is a derivative of the load. In layman's terms, if you did a pull with this car to Sea Level and did another at 10,000 foot elevation, you'd see more boost at the high elevation (contrary to popular belief) because the car will actually run more boost to compensate for less oxygen in the air and it does this by targeting load. On the same token, it will run less boost in winter and more boost in the summer, again to compensate on trying to achieve a specific load. By no accident, with a better performing FMIC, you have reduced IAT, increased oxygen per molecule and therefore need less boost to maintain the same load. If you want to measure pressure drop it has to be in a controlled environment just with the FMIC itself and pressurized with proper equipment. You'll chase your tail trying to get a controlled environment on a car that doesn't target boost but actually targets load. Last edited by Jeff@TopGearSolutions; 06-07-2018 at 03:02 PM.. |
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06-07-2018, 03:19 PM | #28 |
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For daily driving and a short pull here and there, even with a tune, a larger intercooler won't do you much good. During normal driving, there's hardly any air moving through the various intake pipes and IC, thus they get heat soaked. When you're stopped at a light or parked the car for a while and then start driving, everything is heat soaked thus IATs are higher, especially in the summer. The larger IC isn't going to help you here because the air movement is low. The advantage to the larger IC is heat management under hard driving, not normal, low rpm, low speed driving. If anything, I'd argue that a larger, all metal IC will heat soak worse around town compared to the smaller plastic/metal OEM IC. A metal charge pipe will also heat soak and increase IATs during normal driving.
During steady state, normal around the town driving (speeds ranging from 40mph to 70mph), my M235 (all stock intake, IC, etc.) typically sees about 15 to 25 degrees over ambient (higher IATs correlate to slower speed driving and ambient temp). On hot and humid 80+ degree days and at stop light for around 2 minutes, IATs can creep up to over 40+ degrees above ambient. This is due to the mostly sealed engine bay and all the piping heat soaking, including the IC which sits right in front the scalding hot radiator. Plus the pavement is screaming hot too and probably 20 degrees over ambient at 1 foot off the pavement surface. Not until you get going for a few minutes, does the everything cool off as the air blows through the engine bay pulls away some of the heat. When everything is heat soaked (like sitting at the light) and IATs high, the car can feel like a pig and be quite laggy until it cools down. Once IATs crest 120 degrees, the DME is yanking timing, thus power. No car is immune to this. It sucks, but a larger IC isn't going to help this if this is your biggest complaint. If you're not doing longer duration, hard driving, and/or don't have a ton of power mods, you may want to save your money.
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Last edited by XutvJet; 06-07-2018 at 03:29 PM.. |
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06-07-2018, 03:40 PM | #29 | |
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yes, for sure, I understand what the load is if car has stock software it is
limited by load in all rpm range and all you said is 100% true. If tuned, e.g. I limit to some load I want at low/midrange rpms to not overshoot and not make useless extra torque, but my targets at 5500-7000rpm range are way higher than turbo can do to get max hp. So, if load target is way higher than turbo can do, it tries to do its best and reach load target, right? then you can see how much mbar/psi it does with stock intercooler and with aftermarket one, same car, same conditions. In both cases it will not reach load target. But in both cases will reach some psi trying to catch target. So, you compare them at the same rpm and aftermarket intercooler will likely have some lower psi, meaning it has more pressure drop. Quote:
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06-11-2018, 04:17 AM | #30 |
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Does not make sense to me to put on an aftermarket fmic and run stock boost.
I experienced a loss of power in a car running stock boost as a result of upgrading the fmic. Which I have to attribute to some natural pressure loss due to the increased area inside the fmic.The purpose of upgrading the fmic is when running higher boost the charge air is less likely to heat up like it would with a stock fmic and running higher boost levels.
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06-11-2018, 05:11 AM | #31 | |
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how much pressure loss you have with wagner evo2 comp vs stock fmic at high rpms? (6000+ rpm)
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Last edited by enemigo13; 06-11-2018 at 05:23 AM.. |
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06-11-2018, 07:47 AM | #32 | |
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On my other car which had a side mount intercooler ,I replaced it with a much bigger front mount intercooler and as a result the car was laggier ,felt sluggish,until I upgraded the turbo and raised the boost. Which I will attribute to pressure loss due to increased area. The dimensions of the FMIC were extreme compared to the stock side mount intercooler. I'm not really noticing on the 335i a laggier response with the Wagner FMIC vs the stock FMIC to my surprise. So perhaps the pressure loss, if there is any, is very minimal. I am sure the Wagner will shine over the stock FMIC once I raise my boost and run the car in the 1/2 mile full throttle or Road Racing where you have constant on off throttle where the IATs are supposed to go up or down.
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Wagner Comp2 FMIC,FTP CP,stock exhaust. Fabspeed Sport catted DP, KW V2 coil overs,FBO BM3 Stg 2 Last edited by ceedawg; 06-11-2018 at 08:00 AM.. |
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06-11-2018, 10:52 AM | #33 | |
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I would like not talk about feelings but about numbers e.g. if turbo is maxed out at high rpms what's max boost there in the same gear with stock IC vs wagner
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06-11-2018, 10:58 AM | #34 |
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Pmd you
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02-11-2019, 11:42 AM | #35 |
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02-11-2019, 12:52 PM | #36 | |
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Yes you should. You should also check if car is RWD or Xdrive
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02-11-2019, 01:05 PM | #37 |
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It's a RWD manual. What do you suggest?
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02-11-2019, 03:37 PM | #38 |
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We offer Active Autowerke, VRSF and Evolution Racewerks.
You cannot go wrong with either one
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02-14-2019, 04:51 PM | #40 |
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05-08-2019, 12:14 PM | #42 |
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Aftermarket charge pipes are aluminum, im not aware of any other material used for aftermarket pipe. I also do not see any benefit from using a different material than aluminum
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05-08-2019, 12:48 PM | #43 |
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There's a lot of talk here about IAT and heat soaking so an insulating material could have its advantages.
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05-08-2019, 05:52 PM | #44 |
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I cannot imagine, downpipe change would make any noticeable difference but im always interested in results.
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