[mcpcolas]

Originally Posted by darksilkx1

Unless I don't understand your question, I think the 3 series is the sedan version of the 4 series. Alternatively, you might call the upcoming 4 series Gran Coupe the "sedan version" of the series.

Originally Posted by chrisv_335EBII

The sedan version is the 3 series. However, they will bring out a Grand Coupe version of thr 4 series. See 6 series Grand Coupe.

excuse my ignorance but what's the difference between a grand coupe and a sedan? BMW is so full of shit, the 4 series was to replace the 3 series sedan but yet they gonna have 4 series sedan oops my bad i meant "grand coupé"

[SamS]

Originally Posted by mcpcolas

excuse my ignorance but what's the difference between a grand coupe and a sedan? BMW is so full of shit, the 4 series was to replace the 3 series sedan but yet they gonna have 4 series sedan oops my bad i meant "grand coupé"

Head over to your dealer and check out a 535i vs. a 650i Gran Coupe. Two different cars/experiences.

[John Tanglewood]

Originally Posted by r3dbimmer89

The same damn car as a F30 sedan. This disappoints me since the whole 4er thing is a bunch of bull&$%*. I bet it's called a 4er just for more money and that's it. I was expecting options similar to a 6er and not a 3er. And what's up with paying for an alarm again after making it standard on the E92s? C'mon BMW, is this 1991? A $60k 435i without an alarm...oh brother.

You need to relax man. And your ignorance is apparent if you really were expecting something different. A 6 series cost double this, so why would you expect more options similar to it?

You're mad at yourself, not at BMW. Go get a massage and chill the hell out. Come back when you've had time to process.

[WilliCO]

Can't get Saddle Brown with MSport. Damn it.

[Blubaron79]

Originally Posted by mcpcolas

So no x-drive drivers cares that they can't get the M suspensions and increase top speed limiter .

They gave me the top speed limiter in my e92 xDrive, I'm sure it will be available next year.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by alex2364

Anyone know what's 6AN Concierge Services?

From the BMW website:

Your ultimate driving assistant.

Select the "Concierge" menu option on your radio or iDrive display for hands-free access to a friendly representative, offering assistance with restaurant and hotel recommendations, movie times and ticket information, flight arrival and departure gates and times, fuel pricing and availability, and much more.

On selected vehicles, you also get the "Points of Interest" (POI) download function, which allows the representative to send addresses and phone numbers directly to your BMW. Then, this information can be transferred to your BMW Navigation system (if so equipped) for route guidance or to your Bluetooth® linked cell phone to make the call.

It's basically a personal assistant available at the touch of a button in your car.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by r3dbimmer89

The same damn car as a F30 sedan. This disappoints me since the whole 4er thing is a bunch of bull&$%*. I bet it's called a 4er just for more money and that's it. I was expecting options similar to a 6er and not a 3er. And what's up with paying for an alarm again after making it standard on the E92s? C'mon BMW, is this 1991? A $60k 435i without an alarm...oh brother.

The price difference has very little to do with the re-badge to a 4-series. The coupe has always been more expensive than the sedan.

328i sedan base MSRP: $36,850
328i coupe base MSRP: $38,700

The price difference isn't as high, but we're comparing the E92 coupe to an F30 sedan. New models often come with price hikes, so the cost delta will vary based on where the model cycles fall.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by SamS

Negative. People are cheap. Even when spending $40K on a car, some people get really annoyed that a $2K navigation is more expensive and has less features than their $200 smart phone. So they refuse to pay. And BMW can't give away Nav "for free" on a $40K car, so they let people pay the premium. When you get into the $70K base price, then there is enough margin to include it for free.

Navigation systems are a huge money maker for auto manufacturers. They're one of the most profitable options available in a car. BMW could definitely afford to reduce the price, but why would they? The market bears the cost. The argument that there's not enough margin to fit a nav system by default is pretty weak though. It'd require a price bump, but no where near $2k.

[alex2364]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

From the BMW website:



It's basically a personal assistant available at the touch of a button in your car.

That's part of the Convenience Plan that's been available for a long time. I have that available in my 2009 335i. Unless they removed it from BMW Assist and have it as a separate option now...

http://cache.bmwusa.com/Pdf_35534eb9...a-ebb35f18e6b7

[SamS]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

Navigation systems are a huge money maker for auto manufacturers. They're one of the most profitable options available in a car. BMW could definitely afford to reduce the price, but why would they? The market bears the cost. The argument that there's not enough margin to fit a nav system by default is pretty weak though. It'd require a price bump, but no where near $2k.

Your same argument could be made for Xenon lights, 19" wheels, etc. Each are profitable, and each can command a premium over vs. not including them at all. So mine's not a weak argument, at all. It's a business model that has been successfully used by automakers for years.

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by alex2364

That's part of the Convenience Plan that's been available for a long time. I have that available in my 2009 335i. Unless they removed it from BMW Assist and have it as a separate option now...

http://cache.bmwusa.com/Pdf_35534eb9...a-ebb35f18e6b7

Based on the fact that it's listed as a separate item, I'd say it's a separate option now.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by chrisv_335EBII

335 builds can break 60K. I fully expect you can easily equip a 435 upto 65K.

Sure if you add every single option to a current 335i Coupe. I expect medium optioned 435i to break $60k. Which is crazy...considering a new M3 starts at $60k.

[Bluesummer]

people dont want to pay 70k out the door for a none M 3-series? Don't worry, we now offer 4 series for those who pursue sports and luxury.

Ok now, seriously speaking... during the E46 and E9x transition, we saw a huge gain in power and potential even when you compared the E46 M3 and regular N54 335. Yes, I know this all happened during the horse power war and now everyone is/has to go green. But wasn't it fun? Yes it was. The none M model were able to compete with the previous M3. For the very same reason, many 335 owners were previously E46 M3 owners. Some may call it a downgrade but many treated it as an upgrade. Fast forward to 2013, now what do we have here. A rebranded 3 series with many upgrades but perhaps lacking the most important, the engine. I loved the N54 found in my '07 E92, even though it wasn't matured until later 09 and continually to be perfected. I also liked N55 in my '11 E82. Regardlessly how great those two engines are, they should not be used in the new F3x platform. They are great engines, but also brings no excitement. I do enjoy switching between my E90 M3 and the E82 135. Will I replace my E90 M3 with another N55? Why the heck would I do that? Now BMW, there are still time. If you guys are playing the E9x 330 to E9x 335 upgrade card again, I've got my pen and check ready. A N55tu or something along the line will be great. If that doesnt happen, I will still buy the F3x M, but the other parking spot may be reserved for something else besides a BMW.

[M3_WC]

Originally Posted by bradleyland

The price difference has very little to do with the re-badge to a 4-series. The coupe has always been more expensive than the sedan.

328i sedan base MSRP: $36,850
328i coupe base MSRP: $38,700

The price difference isn't as high, but we're comparing the E92 coupe to an F30 sedan. New models often come with price hikes, so the cost delta will vary based on where the model cycles fall.

I suspect the price difference between the F30 and F32, will be much greater than the E90 and E92. But it looks from the F32 option sheet, there really isn't going to be much different from the F30. So in reality, it kinda does come down to the number 4.

I think the price difference will now be more like the A4 and A5. Around $5k.

[Fzara2000]

Originally Posted by Mr Gunfun

How many horsepower does your car have? 300hp?
I bet you don't even use 250hp on a daily basis/average out of 300hp.
Why keep crying about power?

I use the full 300hp (and overboost) in my 335is every single day.

[dreamspeed]

Diehard fans and purists are the ones that help build the brand but it's the mainstream consumers that brings in the money.

In case you guys haven't noticed, BMW has no problems selling cars. They are having records sales at the moment.

Why give the consumer more and charge less when they can get away with giving the consumer less and charge more?

[bradleyland]

Originally Posted by M3_WC

I suspect the price difference between the F30 and F32, will be much greater than the E90 and E92. But it looks from the F32 option sheet, there really isn't going to be much different from the F30. So in reality, it kinda does come down to the number 4.

I think the price difference will now be more like the A4 and A5. Around $5k.

I'd agree with that, but I think people are being a little melodramatic about the whole 4-series rebranding as it relates to cost. Yes, the cost difference is going up, but it's not like it's some conspiracy where the 4-series rebrand is being used as a smoke screen. Coupes demand a premium, and auto manufacturers are going to exploit it, regardless of branding.

[PaulUK]

Choosing a new car used to be a great experience...something to cherish with the brochure, gorgeous cutting edge choices that made you drool. Wheres the innovation gone? Where's the outstanding quality? Come on BMW, your customers (and dealers i suspect) are starting to become fed up of this. We want luxury sport AND modern.....all three.....not one of them...all wrapped up in the ultimate driving machine. Back to basics PLEASE.

[Thurman Murch]

Originally Posted by E46M54325Ci

I couldn't agree more on the feeling cheap. Last year I sat in an e39 for the first time in years and I was shocked at the quality of the materials used in that car. I had gotten so used to the current materials that I had forgotten what used to be. If you get a chance, I suggest to everyone, go sit in an e38, e39 or even e46 and then get into a current BMW. Material quality shock will set in.

Originally Posted by PaulUK

Choosing a new car used to be a great experience...something to cherish with the brochure, gorgeous cutting edge choices that made you drool. Wheres the innovation gone? Where's the outstanding quality? Come on BMW, your customers (and dealers i suspect) are starting to become fed up of this. We want luxury sport AND modern.....all three.....not one of them...all wrapped up in the ultimate driving machine. Back to basics PLEASE.

+1 I had drove an E46 M3 again and fell in love all over again... it was exciting... And taking curves so fast I totally had the oh shit factor... and the previous M3s and M5s... And then you can smell the crayon smell... even the non Ms...

So everyone is well let's bank on the M2 bringing some of that back... weight and agility may be there... but materials not so much

[r3dbimmer89]

Originally Posted by John Tanglewood

You need to relax man. And your ignorance is apparent if you really were expecting something different. A 6 series cost double this, so why would you expect more options similar to it?

You're mad at yourself, not at BMW. Go get a massage and chill the hell out. Come back when you've had time to process.

Before you call someone ignorant, please review the facts. A) Every article on this forum in regards to the 4 series including posts by Scott26 (who obviously works for BMW in Munich) has stated that BMW wanted to create the 4 series to bring the coupe more up market over the current F30. Gee, last time I checked, upmarket includes better specs/options. When one states that a 5er is more upmarket than a 3er, I'm more than sure that includes better options/equipment (Yes, we are expecting the 435i to be the same price as a 535i). No one is mad. Just repeating what was stated

[r3dbimmer89]

Originally Posted by Fieldsy

I like what Audi does with Premium, Plus, and Prestige packages - at least they don't conflict with each other. I also like how Audi has a S-variant for every model. That's what BMW should do, instead of making M-Sport just a package (I don't compare Audi S-line to the BMW M3/M5/M6). Like, make a 435i M-Sport with the Luxury package which implies every available option.

I know those of us who frequent the forum can figure out what the lines mean - but if I was brand new to BMW I'd be like WTF.

BMW will launch ///M Performance models (i.e. M235i) to compete with the S Line Audis and leave full M models for RS models.

[positiveions]

Lots of options. But they need to add more different colors.