[crAbb]

Busy reminiscing about my later father's cars this evening. Came across a photo of his 1969 (?) Lotus Cortina. 110bhp IIRC. I guess it was the equivalent of an M3 today? No, electronic aids at all. No ABS. No power steering. Less than a tonne in weight. But which would be more fun to drive?

I reckon it'd be the Lotus. Of course it's far slower than the modern day M3. But is that important? What about the steering? Wouldn't the Lotus be more communicative? What about the simple pleasure of a perfectly exercised 'heel and toe' downchange? Catching that gentle slide of oversteer, at speeds that seem almost pedestrian these days. The interaction with the gearbox, going up and down the gears, silently chastising yourself when you don't get it 'just so'.

The registration number is PAL 3F, and checking on the MOT database, it's still on the road having covered 90,000 miles.

[isleaiw1]

Hmmm, my dad had a Corsair then a Triumph 1300TC.... I'd say family cars today are a class better!

But you are right about simple and less power being better - I much prefer a fun run out in the Mini to the RS or M cars... even though it is by modern standards not fast and as a manual even slower...

[boba-fett]

I drove one of them last summer, yes it was engaging and extremely mechanical, raw and full of feedback, but, that was it, I just can't get on with classics. I bought an old classic but a few months ago trying out an old, sought after, money holding reliable oldie with a bit of poke, I had it a week and even driving it home I thought what have I done. They are not for me.

It was so fragile feeling, slow, lazy, spongy and always thought is this going to bring me back home again? however the main reason, I can't get past the smell. They make me feel sick. I know people quite like the smell of an old Merc, BM or Ford, but for me its like opening Granny's handbag.

I won't go there again, but I do like looking at them. Your Dad must have been God having one of them back then. Cool car!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Hmmm, my dad had a Corsair then a Triumph 1300TC.... I'd say family cars today are a class better!

But you are right about simple and less power being better - I much prefer a fun run out in the Mini to the RS or M cars... even though it is by modern standards not fast and as a manual even slower...

I love my JCW. Brilliant car.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

I love my JCW. Brilliant car.

me too. Looking forward to getting the roof down when the weather is a bit warmer too. The m25 was usual friday car park last night so I took the country roads from j22 to the herts / essex border, a great run.... and its loosening up now, was only on 2k miles (in nearly 2 years!) when I bought it, an extra 1000 has loosened up the engine and made the gears less notchy...

Still days when I prefer the iPace though

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

me too. Looking forward to getting the roof down when the weather is a bit warmer too. The m25 was usual friday car park last night so I took the country roads from j22 to the herts / essex border, a great run.... and its loosening up now, was only on 2k miles (in nearly 2 years!) when I bought it, an extra 1000 has loosened up the engine and made the gears less notchy...

Still days when I prefer the iPace though

They are not the best for long journeys, had R56's and now the F56 and its much, much better, but an hour in those seats at anyone time is enough for me. For that hour though its in go cart mode!

[agentorange]

The "good old days of motoring" went away with vastly increased car ownership without a similar increase in road space.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

They are not the best for long journeys, had R56's and now the F56 and its much, much better, but an hour in those seats at anyone time is enough for me. For that hour though its in go cart mode!

Yep, SIL is running my old Cooper 5 door (and my daughters before that) until his new car arrives (and he needs to sort the co car scheme and sal sac scheme before he can order)... so doing two days of 75 miles each way in it and not quiet roads (think M42 past Birmingham!). If he has to go a 3rd day he takes the X5!

But they are not designed for that... for what they are intended for they are immense....

My other half has already said she wants it when I get bored so expect me to be looking for another next year!

[Ennoch]

I can't help but agree with you crAbb, I just find modern stuff completely uninspiring. I mean don't get me wrong, I don't want to drive 1000 miles in an original 998cc Mini, but there's a comfortable middle ground. I was offered a drive in an old MV6 Omega recently that a neighbour of my dad's has up north. Now I know these were never the last word in dynamics, although this one has been meticulously maintained as he's had it from new, but man, it was just so nice to drive. Light but feelingful steering, comfortable ride, ridiculously comfy seats, and it handled in a way that most modern cars could only hope to get in the same galaxy as. Of course actual grip was lower, but the way it felt to drive was in another league. Of course most people mistake grip for handling, but I just wished you could get something similar these days. Modern EPAS is shit, low profile tyres are shit but necessary to cope with the increased mass of bloated modern cars, modern seats are hard and 'sporty', and you just feel so removed from things that there's very little experience. And to make up for that lack of handling/feel experience everything just gets filled with more power which means bigger brakes, bigger wheels and even smaller tyres. It's never going to be better than we've currently got it because most people want a car to be filled with more and more toys, more and more junk, more and more chintzy lights and more and more daft features that are there to distract you from the fact you're driving a car - it's this that segues this topic into the driving standards one because the more removed you are from the experience, the less you're likely to treat it as a critical skill. But then isn't that a metaphor for modern life where people seem to want everything dumbed down so even the biggest idiot can manage to look like an expert?

I know properly older cars are definitely an acquired/non-acquirable taste for many, and they're not practical, but I'm looking forward to getting north and having a workshop so I can get the Midget shell built up. I mean it's far from an A-road blaster but most of them are pretty bland anyway so for a B/C road hood it'll be absolutely perfect. With that and the Impreza, I reckon the BMW may go in exchange for a pickup but we'll see. I could equally see it being joined by a pickup.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by Ennoch

I can't help but agree with you crAbb, I just find modern stuff completely uninspiring. I mean don't get me wrong, I don't want to drive 1000 miles in an original 998cc Mini, but there's a comfortable middle ground. I was offered a drive in an old MV6 Omega recently that a neighbour of my dad's has up north. Now I know these were never the last word in dynamics, although this one has been meticulously maintained as he's had it from new, but man, it was just so nice to drive. Light but feelingful steering, comfortable ride, ridiculously comfy seats, and it handled in a way that most modern cars could only hope to get in the same galaxy as. Of course actual grip was lower, but the way it felt to drive was in another league. Of course most people mistake grip for handling, but I just wished you could get something similar these days. Modern EPAS is shit, low profile tyres are shit but necessary to cope with the increased mass of bloated modern cars, modern seats are hard and 'sporty', and you just feel so removed from things that there's very little experience. And to make up for that lack of handling/feel experience everything just gets filled with more power which means bigger brakes, bigger wheels and even smaller tyres. It's never going to be better than we've currently got it because most people want a car to be filled with more and more toys, more and more junk, more and more chintzy lights and more and more daft features that are there to distract you from the fact you're driving a car - it's this that segues this topic into the driving standards one because the more removed you are from the experience, the less you're likely to treat it as a critical skill. But then isn't that a metaphor for modern life where people seem to want everything dumbed down so even the biggest idiot can manage to look like an expert?

I know properly older cars are definitely an acquired/non-acquirable taste for many, and they're not practical, but I'm looking forward to getting north and having a workshop so I can get the Midget shell built up. I mean it's far from an A-road blaster but most of them are pretty bland anyway so for a B/C road hood it'll be absolutely perfect. With that and the Impreza, I reckon the BMW may go in exchange for a pickup but we'll see. I could equally see it being joined by a pickup.

I loved the Omega, had many a happy drive in a 2.5 CDX, and desperately wanted a 3.0 Elite but work wouldnt allow it!

and then I found a skid control training firm in Herts (as a works day of fun) using them as skid practice cars. The training instructor was impressed i could drift one, less so when I said I'd practiced in a hire car via work many years earlier

I did put it in the field backwards on the skid pan when overconfidence struck!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

I loved the Omega, had many a happy drive in a 2.5 CDX, and desperately wanted a 3.0 Elite but work wouldnt allow it!

and then I found a skid control training firm in Herts (as a works day of fun) using them as skid practice cars. The training instructor was impressed i could drift one, less so when I said I'd practiced in a hire car via work many years earlier

I did put it in the field backwards on the skid pan when overconfidence struck!

Back in the day I wanted a Monza GSE. Very nearly pulled the trigger on one, but bottled it and stayed with Fords.

[agentorange]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Back in the day I wanted a Monza GSE. Very nearly pulled the trigger on one, but bottled it and stayed with Fords.

They could be had remarkably cheap, as I recall. The Senator was the 4-door daddy of the Monza. I wanted to snag a white Senator then hang all my Ham Radio antennas on it. I'd have never been passed on the motorway ever again.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by agentorange

They could be had remarkably cheap, as I recall. The Senator was the 4-door daddy of the Monza. I wanted to snag a white Senator then hang all my Ham Radio antennas on it. I'd have never been passed on the motorway ever again.

Those senators where very cool Cop cars, along with the SD1 Vitesse

[lethbridge]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

Back in the day I wanted a Monza GSE. Very nearly pulled the trigger on one, but bottled it and stayed with Fords.

In 1984 I was a BT apprentice but managed to order a gold Manta GTE - still remember looking for hours at the brochure which had the Monza in it too. I loved the Manta and went out for spirited drives in it most nights putting 80k personal miles on it in 3 years. 185/60 tyres were low profile in those days… My dad had (and still has it) a Hillman Minx - safe to say the family car has come a long way since then though and I’ve never seen the appeal of cars from that era - live axles and extremely imprecise steering. The 80’s though had some good affordable cars - I’d love to able to have a go in a Manta again to compare with my M3 - I think I would prefer its steering and the way you extract the performance rather than it just being there…

I then had 3 MR2s and my son now has a Turbo so I can compare that - it is so much better as a drivers car - probably dangerous if you don’t know what you are doing - but steering, rotation, knowing precisely what it is doing, mighty impressive and the Turbo gives modern day cars a run for their money…

But as had been said, busy roads, speed limits, slow drivers, endless queues behind cyclists who won’t pull in to let a lorry pass all sap the chance to enjoy a car unless you go out in the early morning…

[Pond]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

I loved the Omega, had many a happy drive in a 2.5 CDX,

I had an Omega CDX estate for a couple of years. It was quite a good car but the best bit was EVERYBODY thought it was an unmarked cop car.

It took me ages to realise why people would slow down in front of me on the motorway!

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Pond

I had an Omega CDX estate for a couple of years. It was quite a good car but the best bit was EVERYBODY thought it was an unmarked cop car.

It took me ages to realise why people would slow down in front of me on the motorway!

All the time you never knew you had the power to uphold the law!

I take it, it was white?

[Pond]

Originally Posted by boba-fett

All the time you never knew you had the power to uphold the law!

I take it, it was white?

No it was silver!

I had roof bars permanently on it aswell, so from a distance it looked like the cops light bars on the roof!

Only car I've ever had with a CD changer AND a cassette player! It was a 2003 so quite a late one.

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Pond

No it was silver!

I had roof bars permanently on it aswell, so from a distance it looked like the cops light bars on the roof!

Only car I've ever had with a CD changer AND a cassette player! It was a 2003 so quite a late one.

Do you remember all those stereos, Aiwa and Sharp and the one we lusted after the Alpine 7525R

[Scoobyd]

Youngsters today will never understand having to take the face of your stereo off and out the car every time you got home!

[D69GMB]

Owned this about 15 years ago, just as a wee toy to tinker with and improve. Always wanted one when I was 18/19 but couldn’t afford one. It was great fun to chuck about and very easy and cheap to run.

[dave550i]

One of the keepers! but sadly sold it PS sorry for the photo being too big and the wrong way

[boba-fett]

Originally Posted by Scoobyd

Youngsters today will never understand having to take the face of your stereo off and out the car every time you got home!

Do you remember the ones before the face off versions where the whole stereo slid out with a handle and you had to take the whole thing with you!