[pdk42]

Originally Posted by gangzoom

Plenty of other EVs around these days, for me the Taycan head and shoulders above everything else, great specs, usable practicability, unbeatable brand history, and even the price though high is actually very comparable to other EVs/combustion cars to the point of almost been 'good value' (I personally wouldn't even compare the 3 to a Taycan, it's like comparing a Focus ST to a Panamera) .......Now if only I can find that £90K I lost behind the sofa the other week .

The problem with the Taycan, like every other non-Tesla EV, is that the public rapid charging infrastructure is crap. It makes stress-free long distance travel an impossibility. So, you're looking at £90k for a car that has severe restrictions on its usability. Tesla's trump card right now is their SuC network. I wouldn't consider any other EV brand, unless it was for a local run-around only - i.e. within the range of the home charger.

[pdk42]

Originally Posted by Soul_Glo

I bashed EV's on here a while ago. The reality is that I have since accepted is... they may well be the future. No need to warm up the car.. mash the throttle and off you go. Once the battery technology improves I will be all in.

I humbly take back all the bad comments I have made on EV's. Hey I was a die hard petrol head what can I say?!

Well, it takes a brave person to admit they were wrong. Many find it hard to do.

EVs aren't perfect for everyone, but they will work for many. The biggest problem is public charging infrastructure. IMHO, putting slow AC chargers into supermarkets etc is a bit pointless. A car with 250+ miles range will likely do a full-day's driving without needing a top-up from its overnight charge. So, we need two things:

- Overnight slow AC charging. Easy if you have off-street parking, but if not, you'll need something on a lamp-post. Councils need some incentive to do this en masse.

- En-route fast DC charging (like Tesla's superchargers). Germany is incentivising petrol stations to install these, which is a good idea. We also need more in motorway service stations. This is the key point to make long journeys a practical reality.

[pdk42]

Originally Posted by Sennen

I find Tesla intriguing and I have no doubt EV is the future but I just cannot get over how low rent the interiors are.

Why is it the Yanks have never been able to do interiors

It's not great, I admit. But it's not a complete fail. The seats are very functional and comfortable, even if the material is plastic (or "vegan leather" as Elon prefers to call it). The dash is a marmite thing. The other interior elements are better than a Kia, but fall a long way short of an Audi, or even a BMW. It's definitely an American car thing I think, esp at the "budget" end - which is where the Model 3 is pitched.

[djcowlin]

Maybe the quality will improve once they start making them in Germany for the European market.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by pdk42

It's not great, I admit. But it's not a complete fail. The seats are very functional and comfortable, even if the material is plastic (or "vegan leather" as Elon prefers to call it). The dash is a marmite thing. The other interior elements are better than a Kia, but fall a long way short of an Audi, or even a BMW. It's definitely an American car thing I think, esp at the "budget" end - which is where the Model 3 is pitched.

Good to have a realistic view. I test drove a Model S in 2015. At the time stepping out of my F30 335d (and the interior quality was mediocre in that) into a Model S felt like quite a large step down in quality. I am regularly dragged into Tesla showrooms by my young son and I have noticed some real improvement over the last few years.

The difficulty Tesla face is that the BMW G Series cars stepped up quality by a large margin over F Series. Even the G20 3 Series feels good now and the higher models are seriously well put together.

It is a bit crazy that Tesla can manage the complex stuff really well, but fall down on something as low tech as interior quality. Hopefully that will change.

[pdk42]

Originally Posted by JD6

Good to have a realistic view. I test drove a Model S in 2015. At the time stepping out of my F30 335d (and the interior quality was mediocre in that) into a Model S felt like quite a large step down in quality. I am regularly dragged into Tesla showrooms by my young son and I have noticed some real improvement over the last few years.

The difficulty Tesla face is that the BMW G Series cars stepped up quality by a large margin over F Series. Even the G20 3 Series feels good now and the higher models are seriously well put together.

It is a bit crazy that Tesla can manage the complex stuff really well, but fall down on something as low tech as interior quality. Hopefully that will change.

I had two F31s, and took a test drive in the G30 when it was launched and totally agree that it is a huge step up in both refinement and quality. If there was a G31 BEV (or even a PHEV with a range of above 100 miles), then I'd go for that.

[f30paul]

I recently dipped my feet in the hybrid world with an F30 330e. Even the minute range of the first generation of 330e has made a big difference in halving my petrol costs on my commute.

Won't be ready for full EV ownership for a while, mainly due to the fact I'm not a fan of the Kia/Hyundai/Japanese EV clones on sale - and a quick read on an EV forum demonstrates the public charging network (minus Tesla) is in a right mess.

I have high hopes bmw will produce an EV with soul and some of the UDM DNA. For now I'm aware with my budget the next car will be a g20 330e in a few years time... after that who knows what the i4 or full leccy 3 series may be selling for...

OP - nothing against Tesla, think they're fantastic - just out of my price range for a family second car that mainly does the work and weekend commuting!

[ArthurKing]

Great write up.

EV is just not there for me yet.

Once range/charging is no longer a concern and the used market makes them affordable for the average person, I might change my mind.

The reality is for me, I just don't have £50k to drop on a car.

In terms of monthlies on a PCP, you are looking say £600pm with a decent deposit? That is 3/4 of our mortgage payment each month on a car that I use to get to work and back, pop to Morrisons and do a few staycations (I hate that word) each year.

[Randy Johnson]

Not sure BMW and affordable go together.

“The problem is that the BMW is, IMHO, the high water mark of the affordable, quality ICE (Internal Combustion Engine) car; whilst the Model 3 is the first, quality EV that gets close to doing what a BMW does for most of us.”

[Olly_P]

This threads been an interesting read. I'm keeping my 440i GC for a few years yet, but will have a serious look into EV's when the time comes.

Main concern for me is the charging infrastructure, it doesn't sound great at the moment...

[DougMcL]

Instavolt chargers always seem to work. 35 per kWh but at least you don't need a damned app. Just your contactless card.

And our secretary of state for transport (Shapps) does have an electric car.

[JD6]

Originally Posted by Olly_P

This threads been an interesting read. I'm keeping my 440i GC for a few years yet, but will have a serious look into EV's when the time comes.

Main concern for me is the charging infrastructure, it doesn't sound great at the moment...

Interesting video and echoes the point that Harry Metcalf (of Harry's Garage) often makes. Electric cars other than Teslas are let down by the utterly hopeless charging infrastructure. He seemed to conclude that a decent PHEV was the best option for now, and rated the X5 45e very highly. A 40-50 mile electric range, plus a good petrol engine so it doesn't feel like you're in limp mode once the battery is drained.

My 840i is due to be replaced in late 2022, but despite having 2 cars to myself (the other being a Mini) I don't think I should replace either with an EV. Perhaps in 5 years from now I'll switch one to an EV if the charging network has been transformed and real-world range is a lot better.

[DougMcL]

You actually rarely use rapid chargers, only on long journeys. Any I've had to make, I have planned around the Instavolt network without any problems. Charging is done at home using an Andersen.

[Jon TDI]

I totally agree with everyone here that say the infrastructure is no where near good enough at the moment to own an EV other than a Tesla.
I’ve made the decision to stick with ICE for a while until there more charging points and are faster than they are at the moment. If that means owning my F31 330d for 10 years, then so be it.

With me working in the automotive industry for 20+years, I’ve seen a shift in the last few years to more new projects being for EVs. It’s a gradual change, but it’s more of a snowball effect now. ICE to PHEV was slow, but the shift to full EV is becoming quicker.
There are new developments for battery plants in the UK, new fuel cell technology and major OEMs have some big plans.

It’s definitely the future for driving a vehicle......it just needs to be developed, honed and better planned to become the “norm”.

[DB118D]

My Aldi A4 is getting VT'd in April and ordering a Model 3 LR on the company car scheme. I've worked out that I'll be anything between £100-200 a month better off despite giving up £5.5k gross of car allowance.

There are a large number of 50/22kWH chargers around where I live, mostly free to use (£20 annual subscription to Charging Place Scotland) so the need for home charging is diminished. Tesla are in the process of installing new Superchargers less than 10 minutes from my door and existing Superchargers are around 20 minutes away.

I'm pretty confident I can cope without home charging in the short-medium term, but will install a charger at some point.

Tesla is the only EV I'd consider due to the existing infrastructure. I could pick VW/Skoda offerings, but long range trips would be harder relying on service stations etc.

[DB118D]

Am I right in thinking the following

My employer pays £0.00 for business miles done in an EV on the company car scheme

I can then reclaim my business miles back at 4p*40% from HMRC, in a similar fashion to claiming my business miles back at 45p-11p*40% for my own car that I use currently?