[2000Z3M]

Originally Posted by dmaxdmax

Your lights and reflectors are there so others can see you at night...to protect you, those who love you, AND the people in the car coming at you at night.

It's like wearing a mask. It's not just for you.

Some night when you're driving home like I did once, without an alternator, visible reflectors could save your life.

They why don't they have side reflectors all over the world?

WHO just stated that not everyone needs a mask..."The WHO advise that people looking after someone who has COVID-19 and those who have symptoms such as coughing and sneezing should wear a face mask."

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/art...k#when-to-wear

Cloth mask are 50% effect at the most.

Did you know that your lights themselves are reflective? Why the hell would you be putting everyone as risk driving at night with no lights?

[dmaxdmax]

Originally Posted by 2000Z3M

They why don't they have side reflectors all over the world?

WHO just stated that not everyone needs a mask..."The WHO advise that people looking after someone who has COVID-19 and those who have symptoms such as coughing and sneezing should wear a face mask."

https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/art...k#when-to-wear

Cloth mask are 50% effect at the most.

Did you know that your lights themselves are reflective? Why the hell would you be putting everyone as risk driving at night with no lights?

I don't know why they don't have reflectors all over the world.

...and I was driving at night without lights because I didn't know, at the time, that my lights were dim...I was too occupied worrying about what was going on with my car.

Anyway, I'm undoubtedly older than you, more ocd, and like to do things as safely as possible. You improve your and others' safety when they can see you and know your intentions from as far away as possible. Maybe you haven't noticed or didn't know, but half the people driving around you have an IQ of 100 or lower. Everyone isn't paying attention as you'd like.

[Gen13 F36]

They do have reflector all over the world. Some places don't even have street lights... so reflectors are even more needed at those places.

[RGM330i]

It is worth checking into your state's motor vehicle requirement. In a number of states the orange reflector or reflector backlit with orange bulb is required. You probably would not get stopped if you run smoked or body color. However, in the event of an accident and it is claimed that the other driver did not see you......a person might find that this is cited as contributing to the accident=liability. FWIW, I was about to put smoked fronts on my blue 330i and checked Florida law. On the last several Porsche Caymans that I owned I got rid of the orange but replaced them with clear and orange LEDs thus satisfying the law.

[2000Z3M]

Originally Posted by dmaxdmax

I don't know why they don't have reflectors all over the world.

...and I was driving at night without lights because I didn't know, at the time, that my lights were dim...I was too occupied worrying about what was going on with my car.

Anyway, I'm undoubtedly older than you, more ocd, and like to do things as safely as possible. You improve your and others' safety when they can see you and know your intentions from as far away as possible. Maybe you haven't noticed or didn't know, but half the people driving around you have an IQ of 100 or lower. Everyone isn't paying attention as you'd like.

Older doesn't mean wiser.

Here is a link for a euro spec bumper, no side markers

Side markers are so people can see you from a 90 degree angle to your car. The only time you would need them is if you are about to get t-boned, you or the other person would already be at fault.

Rear, yes they will help at night when you have no lights, but again, your lights are reflective too. FWIW, 50% of my driving is at night (go to work at 5am) and I see cars without lights on all the time yet their tail lights reflect my head lights.

ETA: I did do some driving in Afghanistan in an old ass land cruiser, I didn't use lights much and I am still alive.

[Gen13 F36]

Originally Posted by 2000Z3M

Older doesn't mean wiser.

Here is a link for a euro spec bumper, no side markers

Side markers are so people can see you from a 90 degree angle to your car. The only time you would need them is if you are about to get t-boned, you or the other person would already be at fault.

Rear, yes they will help at night when you have no lights, but again, your lights are reflective too. FWIW, 50% of my driving is at night (go to work at 5am) and I see cars without lights on all the time yet their tail lights reflect my head lights.

ETA: I did do some driving in Afghanistan in an old ass land cruiser, I didn't use lights much and I am still alive.

That's UK only.... you assume the world... BMW Germany has reflector on there bumper.

At the end of the day. It's up to the OP if it is worth it

[dmaxdmax]

Originally Posted by 2000Z3M

Older doesn't mean wiser.

Here is a link for a euro spec bumper, no side markers

Side markers are so people can see you from a 90 degree angle to your car. The only time you would need them is if you are about to get t-boned, you or the other person would already be at fault.

Rear, yes they will help at night when you have no lights, but again, your lights are reflective too. FWIW, 50% of my driving is at night (go to work at 5am) and I see cars without lights on all the time yet their tail lights reflect my head lights.

ETA: I did do some driving in Afghanistan in an old ass land cruiser, I didn't use lights much and I am still alive.

I didn't say I was wiser than you...just older...and I've probably experienced more stupid stuff on the road than you.

I am just saying what others have said and that's that visibility helps not only you, but others. Wouldn't you rather others seeing you and not T-boning you...doesn't matter whose fault it is.

Anyway, not to start a fight...I'm relatively 'soft' on this issue. I am just religiously 'stock' on most things BMW. Only thing I'm really strongly opposed to are the garish yellow warning stickers on our visors. I removed mine--that's my mod.

[alohasurftoad]

Originally Posted by RGM330i

It is worth checking into your state's motor vehicle requirement. In a number of states the orange reflector or reflector backlit with orange bulb is required. You probably would not get stopped if you run smoked or body color. However, in the event of an accident and it is claimed that the other driver did not see you......a person might find that this is cited as contributing to the accident=liability. FWIW, I was about to put smoked fronts on my blue 330i and checked Florida law. On the last several Porsche Caymans that I owned I got rid of the orange but replaced them with clear and orange LEDs thus satisfying the law.

it is a Federal Law encompassing all vehicles in the USA. FYI, amber led's do not satisfy it, unless your led's are illuminated all the time, (24/7). i suppose states may have their own laws on it but they would have to meet the fed requirement, at a minimum.

i had smoke reflectors and used to put reflective amber tape over them to pass our state's yearly safety inspection. i recently swapped it back to the oem amber reflector, i'm "over" it.

[Elvisfan]

Originally Posted by SeanFitz335

I had a little 3M black wrap leftover from when I wrapped my grills and covered them. I'll take my chances at night. lol

You would really risk you and your families life to look cool? Why don’t you just leave all the lights off. That’s really cool looking.

[Silverlining_m2]

Originally Posted by Billfitz

+1. Vanity shouldn't override sanity.

It isn't more sane to drive in the dark without lights by any means. Call a tow truck. A reflector isn't an guardian angel.

I have body paint colored markers. I always keep my lights on. As in ALWAYS. There has to be some care given to safety. As I stated earlier, I'm curious if the eyelids are also reflective. I also saved the old reflectors, because getting pulled over for it is surely a "repair and report" ticket. Like a headlight out. This has been a fun debate to read

[orbE46]

Ordered a clear pair and they arrive tomorrow. Anybody got pics of clear on their car? Seems most go for painted or smoked.

[davidr3]

Originally Posted by Elvisfan

You would really risk you and your families life to look cool? Why don’t you just leave all the lights off. That’s really cool looking.

A little excessive there buddy.
If you don't spot headlights that are on, I doubt you'd spot a reflector. Idk about where you guys live but in California there are reflectors in the roads, side of the road, off in the dirt for seemingly no reason. Very easy for a car reflector to blend in, the only reflectors i'd argue that are useful are the ones to indicate fire hydrants.

Reflectors are at best a worst case safety piece when your headlights & taillights go out, beside that most people will spot a light before a reflector.

[Gen13 F36]

I totally forgot about this experience and I just remember this now.

8 yrs ago me and my cousin.... he was driving his car, I was on the passenger side, he rear ended someone with a black car on the driver side... short story we found out by the look of the passenger side that the car have black out reflector, rear taillight and others. His insurance in turn paid my cousin insurance. It was rule that we can't see his car due to blackout taillight and reflector.

[Nickef30]

Originally Posted by Elvisfan

You would really risk you and your families life to look cool? Why don’t you just leave all the lights off. That’s really cool looking.

Don't think it's that serious

[alzhang4]

Tint them into smoke black

[im_an_alien]

Originally Posted by Nickef30

Don't think it's that serious

This. If anyone can be facing a car from the side, day or night, and fail to see all the other bits of said car including the car itself because of a missing ~4 inch strip of reflector then we're all doomed. Full disclosure mine are blacked out front and rear.

[Elvisfan]

Originally Posted by im_an_alien

This. If anyone can be facing a car from the side, day or night, and fail to see all the other bits of said car including the car itself because of a missing ~4 inch strip of reflector then we're all doomed. Full disclosure mine are blacked out front and rear.

Besides it being illegal,it’s just plain stupid. It makes no sense to me. Use a little common sense. I would think that when you are driving,you want to be seen.
It just hit me. You have the rear blacked out. That makes even less sense. I can’t count the times I’ve seen no tail lights at night. The only reason I see the car in front is the reflectors.

[2000Z3M]

Originally Posted by Elvisfan

Besides it being illegal,it's just plain stupid. It makes no sense to me. Use a little common sense. I would think that when you are driving,you want to be seen.

the people that think it is stupid to remove them and think that people that do are stupid are the same type of people that made me wear a reflective belt in the air force during the day. not me in the pic
[IMG]https://media.defense.gov/2009/Oct/1...-7370M-004.JPG[/IMG]

[Gen13 F36]

The fact is people can't see shit. So I'm keeping mine.

[Poochie]

North America FMVSS mandated amber side markers, on the front bumper, in 1969, at a time when vehicles were shaped boxy, instead of angular and all vehicles had seal-beam headlights, which was difficult to see from the side.

This archaic law was never revised, despite the advent of modern vehicle designs, which are well lit and the headlights themselves are reflective, from the side profile, making side markers redundant, in practice but since it's required, manufactures just slap them on to meet the US guidelines, which on some vehicle, they look like an afterthought.

Just because the government say something is required, across the board, doesn't necessarily mean they make ones vehicle any safer - with or without them but it's what it is.

Concealing the ugly yellow front side markers is a personal choice, which wouldn't make any difference to anyone, other than the end user.

However, I would strongly suggest you leave the rear reflectors on, to prevent you from possible being rear-end, should your electrical fail, rendering no taillights and you're unaware or in a helpless situation.

Here is my Xenon headlights, as you see, I also decoded the marker lamp also, which is whole other topic and I've tested the side visibility and verified that it's still reflective, at over a 1,000ft, just not the color amber.

[Elvisfan]

[QUOTE=

Just because the government say something is required, across the board, doesn't necessarily mean they make ones vehicle any safer - with or without them but it's what it is.

Concealing the ugly yellow front side markers is a personal choice, which wouldn't make any difference to anyone, other than the end user.

However, I would strongly suggest you leave the rear reflectors on, to prevent you from possible being rear-end, should your electrical fail, rendering no taillights and you're unaware or in a helpless situation.



[/QUOTE]

Saying concealing the side marker lights is a personal choice is like saying using headlights is a personal choice. It’s wrong. I know a lot of users on this forum like to skirt the law. Hence all the posts about exhausts and cat or catless. But to compromise safety for looks is stupid.

[T5viggen]

Kept mine reflective, just not orange.