[GENAU]

I was ready to buy the oil change kit from FCP Euro but got a bit tongue tied on the lineup they offer. Theres Molygen 5W-40, Special tec 5W-30, and Leichtlauf 5W-40. I, possibly falsley, believe Leichtlauf is focused on longer oil change intervals? For whatever reason I like the Molygen, if for nothing else its the cheapest.

All of them meet LL-01 so we are good on that front. My main concern is that two of them are 5W-40 compared to the 0w-20 that the car "requests" under the hood. I live it Maine and deal with fairly cold winters. It just seems to me that 0W-20 to 5W-40 is a pretty wide gap. Am I being overly concerned with that? Is it a perfectly fine weight for the B58 or should I stick with 5W-30 so I'm at least a little closer to the standard specs? My car is not tuned and I'm certainly not tracking it.

[Billfitz]

The only reason BMW went to 0w-20 was for increased fuel economy. When I stopped getting my oil changes at the dealer, who used BMW 0w-20, and did my own with Molygen 5w-30 my MPG went up.

[edycol]

Do you want best oil or free exchanges at FCP?
If best oil go Motul X-Cess 5W40 GEN2 or Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40.
If you have GPF go LL04 oil. Motul X-Clean + 5W30, Motul X-Clean 5W40 GEN2. You have Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W30 in Wal Mart for $22 for 5qt which is better anything Liqui Moly.

[GENAU]

Originally Posted by edycol

Do you want best oil or free exchanges at FCP?
If best oil go Motul X-Cess 5W40 GEN2 or Pennzoil Platinum Euro 5W40.
If you have GPF go LL04 oil. Motul X-Clean + 5W30, Motul X-Clean 5W40 GEN2. You have Pennzoil Platinum Euro L 5W30 in Wal Mart for $22 for 5qt which is better anything Liqui Moly.

Euro L is LL-04 but not LL-01 certified so I'd lean towards something that meets that particular need. As much as I do love Penn Plat; I wish that Platinum Euro not L was readily available near me.

There's also the Castrol Edge Euro available which does meet LL-01 and is readily available.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by GENAU

Euro L is LL-04 but not LL-01 certified so I'd lean towards something that meets that particular need. As much as I do love Penn Plat; I wish that Platinum Euro not L was readily available near me.

There's also the Castrol Edge Euro available which does meet LL-01 and is readily available.

LL04 is more suitable for B58 than LL01. LL17FE that BMW is using in B58 is fuel efficiency version of LL04.

[aardate]

I just bought pennzoil platinum euro 0w40 from Walmart online. It's currently on sale and it says on the bottle that it provides the same protection as 5w40.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by aardate

I just bought pennzoil platinum euro 0w40 from Walmart online. It's currently on sale and it says on the bottle that it provides the same protection as 5w40.

I would skip PPE 0W40 bcs. no LL01 or LL04 approval.
LL01 and LL04 are not that relevant anymore in engines such as N51,52,53,54 and 55. But N20/26, B48 and 58, always go with approved oil. Reason is that 2018 update of these approvals specifically addresses issues around timing chain in N20/26 and requirements of B generation of engines.
Also, PPE 0W40 is not particularly stringent. If oil missing LL01 go always fir oil that is approved for MB229.5. If missing LL04, go for oil approved for MB229.51/52 and VW504.00/507.00.

[aardate]

Originally Posted by edycol

I would skip PPE 0W40 bcs. no LL01 or LL04 approval.
LL01 and LL04 are not that relevant anymore in engines such as N51,52,53,54 and 55. But N20/26, B48 and 58, always go with approved oil. Reason is that 2018 update of these approvals specifically addresses issues around timing chain in N20/26 and requirements of B generation of engines.
Also, PPE 0W40 is not particularly stringent. If oil missing LL01 go always fir oil that is approved for MB229.5. If missing LL04, go for oil approved for MB229.51/52 and VW504.00/507.00.

Thanks for the advice. What's interesting is that the same oil with 5w40 has the BMW LL-01 but the 0w40 doesn't! Do you know why that would be?
Also see the specifications sheet for the PPE0w40 where it has the MB 229.5. Does that mean that would be suitable to a B58 engine especially with ~6k OCI?

[GENAU]

Originally Posted by edycol

I would skip PPE 0W40 bcs. no LL01 or LL04 approval.
LL01 and LL04 are not that relevant anymore in engines such as N51,52,53,54 and 55. But N20/26, B48 and 58, always go with approved oil. Reason is that 2018 update of these approvals specifically addresses issues around timing chain in N20/26 and requirements of B generation of engines.
Also, PPE 0W40 is not particularly stringent. If oil missing LL01 go always fir oil that is approved for MB229.5. If missing LL04, go for oil approved for MB229.51/52 and VW504.00/507.00.

Castrol Edge Euro car 5w-30 and 0w-40 meet both LL01 and MB 229.5 so that may be what I go with. Relatively inexpensive as well which doesn't hurt.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by GENAU

Castrol Edge Euro car 5w-30 and 0w-40 meet both LL01 and MB 229.5 so that may be what I go with. Relatively inexpensive as well which doesn't hurt.

Castrol 0W40 is not LL01 anymore.
No 0W oil is approved for LL01 or LL04 since 2018 update.
I explained this in numerous topics why.
In 2018 BMW did usual update of its specifications. In 2018 update fallowing is introduced/changed:
- Test plant is nit anymore N52 engine, but N20 engine.
- Specific test for timing chain guides on N20/26 engines is introduced. Mostly that limited Zinc levels in oil.
- Oxidation requirements, already most stringent in industry are further increased. BMW oil specifications are stringent, but comprehensively not as MB or some VW (VW 504.00/507.00 and VW 511.00). New oxidation requirements increased OCI on EU market. However, since "true" synthetic base stocks in oil like esters oxidize more, it eliminated some of the best oils in the world. Mobil1 for example in 0W40 grade has around 10% of esters and oxidize more than hydrocracked oil base stocks like Castrol 5W40.
Some 0W oils have too much viscosity index improvers to be compliant with LL approvals.

For older engines, MB229.5 will suffice. But bcs. specific timing chain test, I would not use in N20/26 and B generation engines anything but approved oils (not "recommended or "meet" oils).
Among approved oils there are differences as LL approval is minimum requirement not maximum.
Castrol 5W40 is IMO mediocre oil in this category as well as Liqui Moly oils.
Pennzoil Platinum Euro, Motul GEN2 and X-Clean+ oils would be top of the line.

[F32Fleet]

Originally Posted by edycol

Castrol 0W40 is not LL01 anymore.
No 0W oil is approved for LL01 or LL04 since 2018 update.
I explained this in numerous topics why.
In 2018 BMW did usual update of its specifications. In 2018 update fallowing is introduced/changed:
- Test plant is nit anymore N52 engine, but N20 engine.
- Specific test for timing chain guides on N20/26 engines is introduced. Mostly that limited Zinc levels in oil.
- Oxidation requirements, already most stringent in industry are further increased. BMW oil specifications are stringent, but comprehensively not as MB or some VW (VW 504.00/507.00 and VW 511.00). New oxidation requirements increased OCI on EU market. However, since "true" synthetic base stocks in oil like esters oxidize more, it eliminated some of the best oils in the world. Mobil1 for example in 0W40 grade has around 10% of esters and oxidize more than hydrocracked oil base stocks like Castrol 5W40.
Some 0W oils have too much viscosity index improvers to be compliant with LL approvals.

For older engines, MB229.5 will suffice. But bcs. specific timing chain test, I would not use in N20/26 and B generation engines anything but approved oils (not "recommended or "meet" oils).
Among approved oils there are differences as LL approval is minimum requirement not maximum.
Castrol 5W40 is IMO mediocre oil in this category as well as Liqui Moly oils.
Pennzoil Platinum Euro, Motul GEN2 and X-Clean+ oils would be top of the line.

Truth

[GENAU]

Originally Posted by edycol

Castrol 0W40 is not LL01 anymore.
No 0W oil is approved for LL01 or LL04 since 2018 update.
I explained this in numerous topics why.
In 2018 BMW did usual update of its specifications. In 2018 update fallowing is introduced/changed:
- Test plant is nit anymore N52 engine, but N20 engine.
- Specific test for timing chain guides on N20/26 engines is introduced. Mostly that limited Zinc levels in oil.
- Oxidation requirements, already most stringent in industry are further increased. BMW oil specifications are stringent, but comprehensively not as MB or some VW (VW 504.00/507.00 and VW 511.00). New oxidation requirements increased OCI on EU market. However, since "true" synthetic base stocks in oil like esters oxidize more, it eliminated some of the best oils in the world. Mobil1 for example in 0W40 grade has around 10% of esters and oxidize more than hydrocracked oil base stocks like Castrol 5W40.
Some 0W oils have too much viscosity index improvers to be compliant with LL approvals.

For older engines, MB229.5 will suffice. But bcs. specific timing chain test, I would not use in N20/26 and B generation engines anything but approved oils (not "recommended or "meet" oils).
Among approved oils there are differences as LL approval is minimum requirement not maximum.
Castrol 5W40 is IMO mediocre oil in this category as well as Liqui Moly oils.
Pennzoil Platinum Euro, Motul GEN2 and X-Clean+ oils would be top of the line.

I just wish these were more readily available locally to me. Walmart only carries Euro L in store, or the Castrol Edge Euro. I suppose it would be better to order the oil, delay the change a few weeks, and add a few hundred miles to the tally. Such is life with a higher end engine.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by GENAU

I just wish these were more readily available locally to me. Walmart only carries Euro L in store, or the Castrol Edge Euro. I suppose it would be better to order the oil, delay the change a few weeks, and add a few hundred miles to the tally. Such is life with a higher end engine.

In my previous posts I addressed Pennzoil Platinum Euro L. It is LL04 and basically heavy version of LL17FE 0W20 used in B48/58. It is actually more suitable for B58.

[GENAU]

Originally Posted by edycol

In my previous posts I addressed Pennzoil Platinum Euro L. It is LL04 and basically heavy version of LL17FE 0W20 used in B48/58. It is actually more suitable for B58.

More suitable than the Motul gen2, X-clean+, and standard Euro despite those arguably being better? Just want to make sure I'm following everything. The X-clean+ looks great as I'm reading now it's built with LL-04 standards as of 2019+. Seems they know their shit.

Edit: Motul 8100 X-clean+ 5w-30? Tell me to shut up and order it already.

One more edit: my 2018 B58 does not have the GPF as it's gen1. For that reason I want the Motul X-Cess 5w40 gen 2 or Penn Plat Euro 5w40, whatever arrives faster.

[AspektUSA]

Originally Posted by GENAU

More suitable than the Motul gen2, X-clean+, and standard Euro despite those arguably being better? Just want to make sure I'm following everything. The X-clean+ looks great as I'm reading now it's built with LL-04 standards as of 2019+. Seems they know their shit.

Edit: Motul 8100 X-clean+ 5w-30? Tell me to shut up and order it already.

One more edit: my 2018 B58 does not have the GPF as it's gen1. For that reason I want the Motul X-Cess 5w40 gen 2 or Penn Plat Euro 5w40, whatever arrives faster.

5w-40 is thicker than necessary for the B58, IMO - unless you're tracking/tuning.

The engines are designed for -20/30, and not -40 but filled with -20 in order to cheat on CAFE requirements. BMW is smart enough to design an engine to run on more efficient oils effectively from the outset in 2016.

You can look at Blackstone reports of Supras on Toyota C5 0w-20, which are tuned but show respectable results: https://www.supramkv.com/threads/bla...-2#post-139644

Do your due diligence, and try out the Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 - but get it tested to check that your local fuel quality is good enough to not degrade it since it's not officially approved.

I personally am using LM 0w-20 TT6600 FE17 from FCPEuro, since it's basically free. If I had a higher mileage B58 I'd look into a suitable 5w-30 as the engine wears in.

BMW knows what's best for your car, conspiracy theorists and arm chair accountants aside. Mobil 1 ran a million mile test on an E30 following BMW maintenance specs to the letter. The engine had 0.0% wear on it.

[edycol]

So, several things:
1. BMW doesn't design engines around grade, but HTHS (High Temperature High Shear). From onset BMW engines are designed for minimum HTHS of 3.5cp. HTHS is resistance of oil to temporary or permanent loss of viscosity at 150c. That is basically most important parameter of an oil when it comes to protection. HTHS of 3.5 is achieved usually with very heavy XW30 oils or light XW40 oils. Some XW30 oils are ranging between 3.5 and 3.65cp. XW40 oils range usually from 3.6 to 3.9cp. Everything depends on base stocks of oil.
2. 0W20 oils have HTHS from 2.6 to 2.9. So why BMW is using this? Because EPA calculates consumption through CAFE requirements. That is it! This is a bet. How many BMW owners keep car beyond lease agreement? How many drive beyond city limits?
3. BMW engines, all of them, can use 20W60 oils if one wants. Why? Because 0W20 at 40c (KV40) is 3 times thicker than average 20W60 at 100c (KV100). So, no engine won't get damaged if XW40 oil is used.
4. APPROVAL IS THE ONLY THING THAT MATTERS! Whether oil is XW30 or XW40 is irrelevant. What is important is that oil is LL04 or LL01 if someone wants to use heavier oils. Yes, there are differences between those oils. Some are better than others. But you are in the end buying high end oil that is approved.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by AspektUSA

5w-40 is thicker than necessary for the B58, IMO - unless you're tracking/tuning.

The engines are designed for -20/30, and not -40 but filled with -20 in order to cheat on CAFE requirements. BMW is smart enough to design an engine to run on more efficient oils effectively from the outset in 2016.

You can look at Blackstone reports of Supras on Toyota C5 0w-20, which are tuned but show respectable results: https://www.supramkv.com/threads/bla...-2#post-139644

Do your due diligence, and try out the Pennzoil Euro L 5w-30 - but get it tested to check that your local fuel quality is good enough to not degrade it since it's not officially approved.

I personally am using LM 0w-20 TT6600 FE17 from FCPEuro, since it's basically free. If I had a higher mileage B58 I'd look into a suitable 5w-30 as the engine wears in.

BMW knows what's best for your car, conspiracy theorists and arm chair accountants aside. Mobil 1 ran a million mile test on an E30 following BMW maintenance specs to the letter. The engine had 0.0% wear on it.

Only good UOA is one with 1,000 miles on unit. At that mileage it is impossible to know anything.
Rest have high iron and copper and oxidative thickening is present as oil on units with 9,000 or more miles is heavier than oil on 1,000 mile unit. Those owners should do TAN and TBN measurement and cut OCI to 5k if sticking to 0W20.

[edycol]

Originally Posted by GENAU

More suitable than the Motul gen2, X-clean+, and standard Euro despite those arguably being better? Just want to make sure I'm following everything. The X-clean+ looks great as I'm reading now it's built with LL-04 standards as of 2019+. Seems they know their shit.

Edit: Motul 8100 X-clean+ 5w-30? Tell me to shut up and order it already.

One more edit: my 2018 B58 does not have the GPF as it's gen1. For that reason I want the Motul X-Cess 5w40 gen 2 or Penn Plat Euro 5w40, whatever arrives faster.

Both would cut!
Motul 5W30 X-Clean+ (+ is a must) has HTHS 3.6. That is same HTHS as Mobil1 0W40 and probably higher HTHS than Castrol Edge 5W40.

[GENAU]

I ordered Motul X-Cess 5w40 gen 2 last night and feel pretty confident in it. Am i correct in my understanding of it being more suited to the non-gpf motor than the other?

[BMWILUVU]

Originally Posted by GENAU

I ordered Motul X-Cess 5w40 gen 2 last night and feel pretty confident in it. Am i correct in my understanding of it being more suited to the non-gpf motor than the other?

I use Motul X-Cess 5w40 good oil but what's this gen 2 thingy?

[GENAU]

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

I use Motul X-Cess 5w40 good oil but what's this gen 2 thingy?

https://www.motul.com/us/en-US/news/products-innovation/motul-difference-xclean-xcess-gen2

[AspektUSA]

Originally Posted by edycol

Only good UOA is one with 1,000 miles on unit. At that mileage it is impossible to know anything.
Rest have high iron and copper and oxidative thickening is present as oil on units with 9,000 or more miles is heavier than oil on 1,000 mile unit. Those owners should do TAN and TBN measurement and cut OCI to 5k if sticking to 0W20.

Keep in mind that's a young Supra tuned for E50, with a catless DP and an aftermarket performance filter doing short trips - so the worst possible circumstances for oil preservation.

Utterly no reason a stock B58 leading a normal life wouldn't be fine on 0w-20.