Shifting rev blip/hang issue

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 09:49 AM

I am having some issues with shifting. Basically when I accelerate full throttle up to 40 in 2nd then put the clutch in to shift up to 3rd the engine seems to boost even though there is no throttle being applied. Sounds like revs spike but looking at the tach they seem to hang rather than actually increase.

Happens in first a LOT shifting to 2nd but also 2nd to 3rd at around 40mph.

A few times it's done the same thing when full throttle and then lifting off completely without pressing the clutch. When pressing the clutch it happens quite frequently.

2 min sound clip with plenty of 2nd to 3rd shifts at 40mph, some are fine, sometimes you hear that blip after the shift. Happens at around 50s and 1 min 25s amongst others.

Car is a manual m140i.

Any ideas? Back to dealer?

https://clyp.it/dv4o4wz2

ioannisG · 09-02-2017, 11:24 AM

Sounds like rev matching to me.

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ioannisG

Sounds like rev matching to me.

On the upshifts and only once every third or fourth time?

NISFAN · 09-02-2017, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ioannisG

Sounds like rev matching to me.

Agreed, it sounds like you are fooling the car into thinking you are slowing. So rev match mode on the occasions you succeed.

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Agreed, it sounds like you are fooling the car into thinking you are slowing. So rev match mode on the occasions you succeed.

The rev matching isn't working properly then I guess? I've had this happen just flooring it then lifting off without changing gear or engaging the clutch, not convinced that's the issue.

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 02:08 PM

It's not rev matching related, still happens with DST off which also turns off the rev matching feature.

NISFAN · 09-02-2017, 04:16 PM

Yes DSC turns of rev matching, so probably not that then.

Didn't someone else have issues with wayward revs on a manual 140i? K44ent ???

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 04:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Yes DSC turns of rev matching, so probably not that then.

Didn't someone else have issues with wayward revs on a manual 140i? Kent44 ???

Not sure tbh, I'll have a search. Wondering if it's just rev hang, common issue with modern manuals.

NISFAN · 09-02-2017, 04:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kylemacca01

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Yes DSC turns of rev matching, so probably not that then.

Didn't someone else have issues with wayward revs on a manual 140i? Kent44 ???

Not sure tbh, I'll have a search. Wondering if it's just rev hang, common issue with modern manuals.

Well yes, fly by wire throttle, terminator level 'self aware' ECU's, and dual mass flywheels don't make for a slick stick ship.

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 04:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Well yes, fly by wire throttle, terminator level 'self aware' ECU's, and dual mass flywheels don't make for a slick stick ship.

Would it sound like that though?? Trying to work out if it's just the way the car is or whether something dodgy is going on.

NISFAN · 09-02-2017, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kylemacca01

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

Well yes, fly by wire throttle, terminator level 'self aware' ECU's, and dual mass flywheels don't make for a slick stick ship.

Would it sound like that though?? Trying to work out if it's just the way the car is or whether something dodgy is going on.

I'm not sure. Probably best to ask on a 2 series forum, as I doubt there are many 3/4 series manuals about.

It's not the first time I've heard of odd rev control behaviour from a manual M140i, but whether what yours does is typical or not is the real question. Does it interfere with your driving?

NotGotABimmer23 · 09-02-2017, 05:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NISFAN

I'm not sure. Probably best to ask on a 2 series forum, as I doubt there are many 3/4 series manuals about.

It's not the first time I've heard of odd rev control behaviour from a manual M140i, but whether what yours does is typical or not is the real question. Does it interfere with your driving?

No it doesn't it just sounds crap and kind of ruins the enjoyment of having a manual.

JRocker3 · 10-30-2017, 01:36 PM

Interestingly enough I am having a similar issue with a 340i I just took delivery of.

Regardless of drive mode, the car seems to blip the throttle after the clutch is depressed on an upshift (and yes, my foot is off the accelerator prior to depressing the clutch).

So far I've only noticed it from 3-4 and while accelerating hard, but it's been consistent under those conditions.

I've had the car two weeks so who knows... I don't notice it on 2-3, 4-5 or 5-6...

NanasBack · 10-30-2017, 04:47 PM

Do you have the torque & power meter displays in the Technology options?
What do they do when shifting.

I noticed on the 335d, when using the paddles to change down, you can see the torque blips up. (Speed matching?).

I was trying to use manual change down to emulate changing down with a manual box, to reduce braking. But it doesn’t work very well.

Not the same situation for you, but maybe it will give you a clue?

JRocker3 · 10-30-2017, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NanasBack

Do you have the torque & power meter displays in the Technology options?
What do they do when shifting.

I noticed on the 335d, when using the paddles to change down, you can see the torque blips up. (Speed matching?).

I was trying to use manual change down to emulate changing down with a manual box, to reduce braking. But it doesn’t work very well.

Not the same situation for you, but maybe it will give you a clue?

Good idea... didn't think of that.

I know those meters are "fake" but if they're based on engine speed then I'd imagine they'd also jump when the throttle surges... not sure what conclusion to draw either way.

(They do blip when the car rev matches on the downshift.)

I'll report back.

Grant_7 · 10-31-2017, 02:29 AM

MattOz had a rev-hang issue with his manual F31 335i. It is emissions related and sounds exactly as you describe.

He can fill you in on the details

JRocker3 · 10-31-2017, 09:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Grant_7

MattOz had a rev-hang issue with his manual F31 335i. It is emissions related and sounds exactly as you describe.

He can fill you in on the details

I'd be interested to hear more...

NotGotABimmer23 · 10-31-2017, 11:16 AM

It's the laggy fly by wire throttle imo. I've solved it by moving slightly further away which makes me fractionally slower to engage the clutch. Sometimes if my feet get a bit lazy it happens but it's a lot less often.

Stainy · 10-31-2017, 12:00 PM

I've experienced exactly the same on my last two (non BMW) turbo petrol cars. It's wasn't fly by wire and it wasn't rev matching.....it was however bloody annoying! I think it's something to do with the MAF (not reading the air flow/temp properly?), but it's a total guess tbh. It went away for a while after cleaning though and it doesn't cost much to clean a MAF. No ides if it was actually this or if it affects diesels the same though

JRocker3 · 10-31-2017, 12:14 PM

Laggy throttle makes sense... I've been paying more attention and have been noticing that even at low RPM shifts under light load the revs hold slightly even after my foot is off of gas and onto clutch.

I'm thinking that at high RPM and high load the effect is simply pronounced??

I'd be concerned if it was really over revving but it's "only" 100-300 RPM, I'd say.

I've also experienced pressing the clutch prior to having my foot fully off of accelerator and that's a much more pronounced over-rev experience. (This is my first 6MT... it happens...

)

mahad3si · 12-11-2018, 11:59 AM

I experience it too in my 340i rwd 6spd, pretty much every time i rev up to ~5000 rpm, shift up, and pop the clutch (without foot on gas pedal). Revs stay higher than they should be to mesh the tire speed with the higher gear, causing car to surge forward noticeably. A bit discerning at first, if you meant to eventually maintain/slow down after up shifting.

I haven't tried it with rev-matching disabled, or in another older 335i without rev-matching, which would theoretically point the finger at the rev matching "feature".

09-02-2017, 09:49 AM	#1
NotGotABimmer23 Colonel 831 Rep 2,111 Posts Drives: 340i touring - incoming Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Leicestershire UK iTrader: (0)	Shifting rev blip/hang issue - sounds clip I am having some issues with shifting. Basically when I accelerate full throttle up to 40 in 2nd then put the clutch in to shift up to 3rd the engine seems to boost even though there is no throttle being applied. Sounds like revs spike but looking at the tach they seem to hang rather than actually increase. Happens in first a LOT shifting to 2nd but also 2nd to 3rd at around 40mph. A few times it's done the same thing when full throttle and then lifting off completely without pressing the clutch. When pressing the clutch it happens quite frequently. 2 min sound clip with plenty of 2nd to 3rd shifts at 40mph, some are fine, sometimes you hear that blip after the shift. Happens at around 50s and 1 min 25s amongst others. Car is a manual m140i. Any ideas? Back to dealer? https://clyp.it/dv4o4wz2
	Appreciate 0 Tweet Quote

09-02-2017, 11:24 AM	#2
ioannisG Private First Class 67 Rep 192 Posts Drives: 330d F30 Join Date: Feb 2017 Location: London iTrader: (0)	Sounds like rev matching to me.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

09-02-2017, 02:08 PM	#6
NotGotABimmer23 Colonel 831 Rep 2,111 Posts Drives: 340i touring - incoming Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Leicestershire UK iTrader: (0)	It's not rev matching related, still happens with DST off which also turns off the rev matching feature.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

09-02-2017, 04:16 PM	#7
NISFAN Major General 3487 Rep 9,709 Posts Drives: BMW M2 Join Date: Aug 2012 Location: Bedford UK iTrader: (0)	Yes DSC turns of rev matching, so probably not that then. Didn't someone else have issues with wayward revs on a manual 140i? K44ent ??? Last edited by NISFAN; 09-02-2017 at 05:51 PM..
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-30-2017, 01:36 PM	#13
JRocker3 First Lieutenant 345 Rep 378 Posts Drives: 2018 M3 CS Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (0)	Interestingly enough I am having a similar issue with a 340i I just took delivery of. Regardless of drive mode, the car seems to blip the throttle after the clutch is depressed on an upshift (and yes, my foot is off the accelerator prior to depressing the clutch). So far I've only noticed it from 3-4 and while accelerating hard, but it's been consistent under those conditions. I've had the car two weeks so who knows... I don't notice it on 2-3, 4-5 or 5-6... __________________ /// F80 M3 CS ///
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-30-2017, 04:47 PM	#14
NanasBack Lieutenant 199 Rep 542 Posts Drives: EB 335 oil burner Join Date: Aug 2017 Location: Staffs, UK iTrader: (0)	Do you have the torque & power meter displays in the Technology options? What do they do when shifting. I noticed on the 335d, when using the paddles to change down, you can see the torque blips up. (Speed matching?). I was trying to use manual change down to emulate changing down with a manual box, to reduce braking. But it doesn’t work very well. Not the same situation for you, but maybe it will give you a clue? __________________ 335d xDrive
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-31-2017, 02:29 AM	#16
Grant_7 Lieutenant Colonel 2021 Rep 1,926 Posts Drives: Caterham 420R. Tesla Model 3 Join Date: Feb 2016 Location: Warwickshire iTrader: (0)	MattOz had a rev-hang issue with his manual F31 335i. It is emissions related and sounds exactly as you describe. He can fill you in on the details __________________ F31 340i \| GS with CR & Ash Grain Trim \| M Sport+ Pack \| Prof Media Plus Pack \| Interior Comfort Pack \| Leather Dash \| Folding Mirrors \| Pano Roof \| Elec Mem Seats with Lumbar \| Adaptive Suspension \| Comfort Access \| Reverse Cam \| Surround View \| SLD \| Rear Sunblinds \| Folding Headrests \| Model Designation Delete \| Trim Designation Delete \| MPPSK
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-31-2017, 11:16 AM	#18
NotGotABimmer23 Colonel 831 Rep 2,111 Posts Drives: 340i touring - incoming Join Date: Oct 2016 Location: Leicestershire UK iTrader: (0)	It's the laggy fly by wire throttle imo. I've solved it by moving slightly further away which makes me fractionally slower to engage the clutch. Sometimes if my feet get a bit lazy it happens but it's a lot less often.
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-31-2017, 12:00 PM	#19
Stainy Lieutenant 265 Rep 424 Posts Drives: 435d Xdrive Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Floating in the Ether iTrader: (0)	I've experienced exactly the same on my last two (non BMW) turbo petrol cars. It's wasn't fly by wire and it wasn't rev matching.....it was however bloody annoying! I think it's something to do with the MAF (not reading the air flow/temp properly?), but it's a total guess tbh. It went away for a while after cleaning though and it doesn't cost much to clean a MAF. No ides if it was actually this or if it affects diesels the same though
	Appreciate 0 Quote

10-31-2017, 12:14 PM	#20
JRocker3 First Lieutenant 345 Rep 378 Posts Drives: 2018 M3 CS Join Date: Jun 2017 Location: Boston, MA iTrader: (0)	Laggy throttle makes sense... I've been paying more attention and have been noticing that even at low RPM shifts under light load the revs hold slightly even after my foot is off of gas and onto clutch. I'm thinking that at high RPM and high load the effect is simply pronounced?? I'd be concerned if it was really over revving but it's "only" 100-300 RPM, I'd say. I've also experienced pressing the clutch prior to having my foot fully off of accelerator and that's a much more pronounced over-rev experience. (This is my first 6MT... it happens... ) __________________ /// F80 M3 CS ///
	Appreciate 0 Quote

12-11-2018, 11:59 AM	#21
mahad3si New Member 0 Rep 8 Posts Drives: '18 340i rwd 6spd Join Date: May 2012 Location: Ontario iTrader: (0)	I experience it too in my 340i rwd 6spd, pretty much every time i rev up to ~5000 rpm, shift up, and pop the clutch (without foot on gas pedal). Revs stay higher than they should be to mesh the tire speed with the higher gear, causing car to surge forward noticeably. A bit discerning at first, if you meant to eventually maintain/slow down after up shifting. I haven't tried it with rev-matching disabled, or in another older 335i without rev-matching, which would theoretically point the finger at the rev matching "feature".
	Appreciate 0 Quote