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      01-17-2018, 10:20 AM   #1
Daylights
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Sold F30 328xi based on N20 Timing Guide Issues

A few years ago I purchased a used 2015 328i X-Drive and later discovered I missed the upgraded plastic timing chain guide by 2 months. Not wanting to find myself stranded with a self destructed engine, I tried to have BMW Canada deal with the issue proactively. What I got from both the local dealer and BMW Canada was the run around and trying to get me to buy an extended warranty or pay for the proactive repair myself ($8,000) or nonsensical advise like "Do oil changes regularly and it won't be a problem". I even tried to use the Better Business Bureau (BBB) with BMW Canada to no avail, they have a D+ rating by the way. Then I learned that BMW USA had extended the warranty to protect its customers. So I made a decision that it was time to part with this car before the warranty ran out this year in 2018.

This guide issue in addition to an on-going battery discharge warning in cold weather (was supposedly reprogrammed by dealer to address issue, not!!), a turbo already replaced under warranty and having to push buttons to have the sport mode implemented, so it mimics a BMW Suspension was enough for me, and I ended up trading the F30 in for a 2013 E92 335xi with the M package with low mileage.

What a joy to go back to a car with a proper M suspension (no buttons to implement), a smooth 6 cylinder rather than the jerky power delivery of an over worked 4 cylinder and proper steering. Hate to say it but BMW has lost its way and I will never buy a new BMW again. I will try to keep my E36, my E46 and now E92 on the road as long as possible and BMW to me now is just a parts supplier. Even if I was to buy a new car at some point in the future, I would not consider BMW based on there inability to stand behind their products.

An interesting side note was I went back to the non-BMW dealer, I originally bought the car from and asked if they wanted to buy the car. I was told they were interested but preferred a trade deal. I said that they did not have any BMWs for sale. The salesperson said that they have stopped buying BMWs at auction based on problems with the X-1, X-3 engines. He did not say what the problems were but I am think they have had a few customer experience the N20 timing chain guide issue and engine destruction to stop buying BMW altogether at dealer auctions.

Please don't take this post as sour grapes, many of you love your F30's with the N20 engine and I wish you the best but to me a problem with defective parts that could literally destroy an engine is not something I want hanging over my head. Hopefully, BMW will step up and help the rest of the N20 engine owners but it appears that they are using the "Fight Club" formula as to whether to address the issue (cost vs risk). In the meantime Google, "N20 class action suit" in Ontario and join in as it appears that this will be the only way to address the financial hardship the timing guide issue has or may cause owners.

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      01-22-2018, 09:21 AM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrboulder View Post
Why are people so worrried about this?

My 5 y/o 328i could have had 2 used engines installed a year with the depreciation the first 2 owners took. Still on the original engine.
Really? Most folks don't want there car engines to self destruct due to a faulty plastic piece, that is why we worried about it.

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      01-22-2018, 10:01 AM   #3
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2015 has the n26 engine
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      01-22-2018, 12:56 PM   #4
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Boy did that dealer have your number; glad it worked out in the end for you but do remember that you were speaking with a salesman about all this All joking/puns aside, to each his own and if you weren't comfortable with the car, it was time for you to let it go anyway. Best of luck with your new ride!
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That seat was meant to be used, are you going to deny it's purpose in life?
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      01-22-2018, 12:59 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vooonoo View Post
2015 has the n26 engine
Correct but it does include both:

https://www.carcomplaints.com/news/2...g-chains.shtml
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Originally Posted by jmg

That seat was meant to be used, are you going to deny it's purpose in life?
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      01-22-2018, 03:29 PM   #6
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Actually the 2015 328i made in 2014 uses the N20 engine but as someone pointed out both the N20 and the N26 have the same guide problem.

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      01-22-2018, 03:32 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffc83 View Post
Boy did that dealer have your number; glad it worked out in the end for you but do remember that you were speaking with a salesman about all this All joking/puns aside, to each his own and if you weren't comfortable with the car, it was time for you to let it go anyway. Best of luck with your new ride!
Not sure what you are saying, the dealer I mentioned was who I bought it from not who I sold it to. The main point was that that dealer did not want any more BMWs due to major problems which I think was the timing guide. But I agree with you that I am glad I parted ways with the thing. NO more pushing buttons for sport every time I get into it!!

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      01-22-2018, 03:43 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daylights View Post
Not sure what you are saying, the dealer I mentioned was who I bought it from not who I sold it to. The main point was that that dealer did not want any more BMWs due to major problems which I think was the timing guide. But I agree with you that I am glad I parted ways with the thing. NO more pushing buttons for sport every time I get into it!!

Daylight
I wouldn't think so but who knows in the end. The point was more or less taking a "salesman's word for anything" regardless if you bought something from them or not but I see where you're coming from. That dealer might have "been in the know" who knows.

I never push the button for sport when I get in until it's warmed up to temp but I am curious; what did you end up with? To me, there's a sh**load of awesome options at the moment!
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That seat was meant to be used, are you going to deny it's purpose in life?
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      01-22-2018, 06:32 PM   #9
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Originally Posted by Jrboulder View Post
Man, I feel bad for people who let inexpensive, low-probability failures dominate their thinking and enjoyment.
+1. Perhaps we should coin a term for it. How about vehicular hypochondria?
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      01-23-2018, 08:48 AM   #10
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For someone who was concerned about the N20 engine the E92 335i would have been avoided. Granted these issues are not as bad as a timing chain preventative cost and sorry to hear you were messed around. Budget for repairs:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=605631
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      01-23-2018, 09:15 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daylights View Post
Not sure what you are saying, the dealer I mentioned was who I bought it from not who I sold it to. The main point was that that dealer did not want any more BMWs due to major problems which I think was the timing guide. But I agree with you that I am glad I parted ways with the thing. NO more pushing buttons for sport every time I get into it!!

Daylight
You're speculating. Perhaps they just didn't need anymore 4 banger BMWs as those dominate the used market.


Also, i didn't realize pushing the Sporr rocker button once or twice was such a big deal? You must get wildly livid when having to push the start button and volume buttons and adjusting HVAC temp.
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      01-23-2018, 02:11 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 37psi View Post
For someone who was concerned about the N20 engine the E92 335i would have been avoided. Granted these issues are not as bad as a timing chain preventative cost and sorry to hear you were messed around. Budget for repairs:

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=605631
Still cheaper than a blown engine a.k.a timing guide catastrophic failure
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      01-23-2018, 02:14 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jrboulder View Post
Man, I feel bad for people who let inexpensive, low-probability failures dominate their thinking and enjoyment.

Worst case it would be about 4k to have a shop swap in a used engine. We'll just round it up to 5k for 'while you're in there' stuff. And that's for something that has maybe a 5% failure rate. So that's a $250 probability*cost-of-failure. But by the nature of being a lifetime chain it saves every owner a $1000 mid-life timing belt. I'll take that bargain any day of the week. And if it does fail I'll write a check and barely remember it in a year.
Easier to have that viewpoint when BMW USA took care of its customers and extended the warranty from 80,000 to 110,00 but we will see how many owners fair post 110,000. Good Luck!!
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      01-23-2018, 02:16 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XutvJet View Post
You're speculating. Perhaps they just didn't need anymore 4 banger BMWs as those dominate the used market.


Also, i didn't realize pushing the Sporr rocker button once or twice was such a big deal? You must get wildly livid when having to push the start button and volume buttons and adjusting HVAC temp.
It is not having to push sport all the time it is that even after you have engaged sport the handling is numb and not what many BMW owners would expect from past BMW's. If the numb steering works for you, "enjoy"?
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      01-23-2018, 04:34 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daylights View Post
It is not having to push sport all the time it is that even after you have engaged sport the handling is numb and not what many BMW owners would expect from past BMW's. If the numb steering works for you, "enjoy"?

Should have bought a M235/240/M2 if you want proper steering and suspension in a late model BMW. Also, stop buying xdrives as they kill the BMW driving experience I find rather amusing that you think the handling and steering is subpar yet still bought the 328ix.

When all things are said and done, that 6 y/o E92 335 will nickel and dime you in the next two years or less. With the amount of money lost on depreciation, taxes, etc. and a older car that will certainly have a host of $1,000+ issues in the very near future, you could have had that timing chain guide and chain fixed at a BMW indie shop for peanuts in comparison.

Lastly, the battery discharge matter is nothing more than an annoyance that affects many BMWs in excessively cold temps. The battery warning system is simply hyper-active (even when adjusted). The fix is a $60 battery tender and it's likely you wouldn't see the warning.
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Last edited by XutvJet; 01-23-2018 at 04:39 PM..
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      01-24-2018, 08:21 AM   #16
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The fix is a $60 battery tender and it's likely you wouldn't see the warning.[/QUOTE]

That's why I bought a $40 K car so I could then buy a $60 trickle charger for my 1974 Nova, sorry, 2015 328I Xdrive. Also, don't mind a few repairs as long as I am enjoying the ride in between repair. Plus a few repairs does not compare to the cost of an engine that self destructs due to a cheap plastic parts.

Seems like a lot of new owners with the N20 and N26 appear offended by my update, I guess the old saying that "Ignorance is bliss" has some truth. All the best, hope not to see you stranded at the side of the road.
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      01-24-2018, 08:31 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daylights View Post
Seems like a lot of new owners with the N20 and N26 appear offended by my update
No, we're just tired of seeing the same old mantra day after day in what's now at least three different threads.
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      01-24-2018, 12:45 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Daylights View Post
That's why I bought a $40 K car so I could then buy a $60 trickle charger for my 1974 Nova, sorry, 2015 328I Xdrive. Also, don't mind a few repairs as long as I am enjoying the ride in between repair. Plus a few repairs does not compare to the cost of an engine that self destructs due to a cheap plastic parts.
Why is getting and using a $60 trickle charger such a big deal? Lots of people run them on their cars (no matter the make) when living up in the North in the winter. Lots of people run battery and engine block warmers as well. Just because you get the warning doesn't mean the car won't start. EVERY car will have it's little issues and annoyance. The battery discharge warning is one of them, but easily remedied. You'll likely see the same issue with the E92. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=811488

I agree that the timing chain issue in the N20/26 is unfortunate, but it's not the end of the world. You could have preemptively fixed the issue for much cheaper than your car swap. Sounds like you're happy now.......until of course that 335i starts acting up with the more common, expensive problems. Then you'll post to the E92 forums about how much a POS that car is.
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      01-24-2018, 04:11 PM   #19
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I agree that the timing chain issue in the N20/26 is unfortunate, but it's not the end of the world. You could have preemptively fixed the issue for much cheaper than your car swap. Sounds like you're happy now.......until of course that 335i starts acting up with the more common, expensive problems. Then you'll post to the E92 forums about how much a POS that car is.[/QUOTE]

Maintenance and some repair are fine. I have, still on the road in as new condition, an E36 and an E46 in addition to the E92. The only POS with the potential for a complete catastrophic engine failure was the F30.

POS + sold sign = piece of mind!!

P.S. Keep a small sign in your F30 trunk that says "F30POST" and if I see you at the side of the road holding the sign, after the timing chain guide has reared its ugly head, I will pick you up. But the sign is important, can't be too careful these days!!

Last edited by Daylights; 01-25-2018 at 09:38 AM..
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