Learned my lesson about tracking without camber

brigade24 · 06-23-2021, 04:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

How are you able to get 275 width tires all around?

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

Polo08816 · 06-23-2021, 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

I'll take as many details as I can. You're one of the few that are running 275 squared so I was curious. The only other person I knew would be DVC .

brigade24 · 06-24-2021, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

I'll take as many details as I can. You're one of the few that are running 275 squared so I was curious. The only other person I knew would be DVC .

I took alot measurements before I took the leap because there was a bunch of internet science stating that it wasn't possible but there were no parameters provided around that when i looked a little deeper. IIRC, I posted my measurements in one DVCs threads where he asked the question if it would fit...i don't remember the title of the thread but i know its in here somewhere.

turns out 275 wide is very achievable with the F30 platform, just takes some extra work and a staunch ignorance of the naysayers.

conradb58 · 07-11-2021, 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

I'll take as many details as I can. You're one of the few that are running 275 squared so I was curious. The only other person I knew would be DVC .

I took alot measurements before I took the leap because there was a bunch of internet science stating that it wasn't possible but there were no parameters provided around that when i looked a little deeper. IIRC, I posted my measurements in one DVCs threads where he asked the question if it would fit...i don't remember the title of the thread but i know its in here somewhere.

turns out 275 wide is very achievable with the F30 platform, just takes some extra work and a staunch ignorance of the naysayers.

This is exactly what I was looking for! I only wanted to run a 255/285 set up though.

benben01 · 10-28-2021, 02:51 AM

Hi ! I'm using the millway camber plates for 3 years on the nurburgring (about 100 laps) and the alignment is stable. I'm satisfied. I think that top mounts are necessary if you track your car. In the end you will spare tons of money on tyres.

Polo08816 · 10-28-2021, 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

I took alot measurements before I took the leap because there was a bunch of internet science stating that it wasn't possible but there were no parameters provided around that when i looked a little deeper. IIRC, I posted my measurements in one DVCs threads where he asked the question if it would fit...i don't remember the title of the thread but i know its in here somewhere.

turns out 275 wide is very achievable with the F30 platform, just takes some extra work and a staunch ignorance of the naysayers.

Effectively, you're running an 18x9.5 ET23 wheel in the front.

The issue in the rear is that if you ran a 18x9.5 ET23 wheel, it would run against the fender because it would poke out too much.

skier_du · 11-15-2021, 03:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

How are you able to get 275 width tires all around?

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

275 square would be great. Something I've been looking into for some time. But my 255 barely fits the rear and I've already messaged the fenders some. But, I don't have eccentric lockouts yet and 2 bushings are still rubber. Did you have to do eccentric lockouts and adjustable bars? I already have all the adjustable bars in the rear I can get. Also, did you replace the rear rollover strut (lower camber arm) inner bushing with a poly? I've been looking for a poly or mono ball, but haven't found any information for non M cars. Also haven't found any for the rubber bushing the rear trailing arm mounts to on the wheel carrier.

Logicoeur · 11-15-2021, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skier_du

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

How are you able to get 275 width tires all around?

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

275 square would be great. Something I've been looking into for some time. But my 255 barely fits the rear and I've already messaged the fenders some. But, I don't have eccentric lockouts yet and 2 bushings are still rubber. Did you have to do eccentric lockouts and adjustable bars? I already have all the adjustable bars in the rear I can get. Also, did you replace the rear rollover strut (lower camber arm) inner bushing with a poly? I've been looking for a poly or mono ball, but haven't found any information for non M cars. Also haven't found any for the rubber bushing the rear trailing arm mounts to on the wheel carrier.

Are you slammed or something? I've had 255s on stock xdrive and now dropped one inch with no additional mods to fit the tires. No rubbing, nothing. Even during an auto cross session

skier_du · 11-16-2021, 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Logicoeur

Quote:

Originally Posted by skier_du

Quote:

Originally Posted by brigade24

Quote:

Originally Posted by Polo08816

How are you able to get 275 width tires all around?

Im not sure how much detail you want on this but I can provide you some basics.

Front: Fenders are rolled and I run a 12mm spacer. This provides just under a 1/4" of clearance between the shock body and tire. The wheels are 18x9.5 ET35. The tires are 275-35-18 RE71Rs. I run this setup only when Im autocrossing which means i set my camber to about -2.9 degrees so that helps tuck the tires in (camber is backed out -1.9 after every event). I ran this setup last year with the same sized tires but SUR4Gs to test and there was no rubbage. I tested the same setup again but this time with the KMAC offset bushings in the control arm and that increased the track width causing some rubbage with both the and 275 and 265 setups. Once I took the KMACs out, no rubbage. currently running power flex race bushings in the front control and thrust arms...it has been around three years and they are still holding. These bushings prevent alignment deflection which can cause rubbage.

Rear: This was much easier. The wheel/tires fit no problem. I was running -2.7/-2.5 degrees in the rear and that was too much...outside of the rears were not heating up enough so I reduced it to around -2.0 on both sides and now the heat distribution is more progressive (optimal grip for longer period of time). I was worried with the new alignment spec that in transitions the rear fenders would make contact with the back tires but that was not the case...thank God!!! The camber and toe bushings are polyurethane so that helps preserve the alignment.

The springs are stupid stiff which i need to help control the weight of the car during hard transitions. I'm running 450in/lbs in front and 1200in/lbs out back...this is very aggressive but its part of the equation as to why the fenders don't reach the tires.

There's more, but i'll stop here.

275 square would be great. Something I've been looking into for some time. But my 255 barely fits the rear and I've already messaged the fenders some. But, I don't have eccentric lockouts yet and 2 bushings are still rubber. Did you have to do eccentric lockouts and adjustable bars? I already have all the adjustable bars in the rear I can get. Also, did you replace the rear rollover strut (lower camber arm) inner bushing with a poly? I've been looking for a poly or mono ball, but haven't found any information for non M cars. Also haven't found any for the rubber bushing the rear trailing arm mounts to on the wheel carrier.

Are you slammed or something? I've had 255s on stock xdrive and now dropped one inch with no additional mods to fit the tires. No rubbing, nothing. Even during an auto cross session

Not terribly slammed. There's a little gap Al around. Probably about a finger gap in the rear, give or take a little. I just think my rear subframe alignment or something must be off. My wheels are 18x9 et30 and the tires are 255/40/18, which is a factory size. So something is off. You can see there's not much space in the picture. And this is after I rolled and pulled the rear fenders some.
Edit: just realized I think I had 245/40/18 tires in the picture. I'm back to the 255 now so they fill a little more than the picture shows.

BMWILUVU · 11-16-2021, 04:53 PM

You can do 265 in the rear there is room.

skier_du · 11-17-2021, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

You can do 265 in the rear there is room.

Possibly. I think I just need some camber shims and max the positive camber. Then just use the adjustable arms to pull the top of the tire in more and get back to about -2 rear camber. Then I may be able to get the 275 to fit. If I need to do a little extra massaging of the fenders that's ok.

BMWILUVU · 11-17-2021, 01:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by skier_du

Possibly. I think I just need some camber shims and max the positive camber. Then just use the adjustable arms to pull the top of the tire in more and get back to about -2 rear camber. Then I may be able to get the 275 to fit. If I need to do a little extra massaging of the fenders that's ok.

275 on 8.5" rims?

skier_du · 11-17-2021, 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BMWILUVU

Quote:

Originally Posted by skier_du

Possibly. I think I just need some camber shims and max the positive camber. Then just use the adjustable arms to pull the top of the tire in more and get back to about -2 rear camber. Then I may be able to get the 275 to fit. If I need to do a little extra massaging of the fenders that's ok.

275 on 8.5" rims?

Definitely not. Lol Currently my rims are 9". I'd like 10" square for best use of the extra width and driving dynamics.

10-28-2021, 02:51 AM	#27
benben01 New Member 3 Rep 5 Posts Drives: F20 120d track ready Join Date: Oct 2021 Location: Europa iTrader: (0)	Hi ! I'm using the millway camber plates for 3 years on the nurburgring (about 100 laps) and the alignment is stable. I'm satisfied. I think that top mounts are necessary if you track your car. In the end you will spare tons of money on tyres.
	Appreciate 2 MacklinUSOB518.00 FlorinQCK-2.50 Quote

11-16-2021, 04:53 PM	#32
BMWILUVU Lieutenant Colonel 809 Rep 1,597 Posts Drives: 340ix Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: The Boibs iTrader: (0)	You can do 265 in the rear there is room.
	Appreciate 1 FlorinQCK-2.50 Quote