11-24-2020, 09:14 AM | #45 | |
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11-24-2020, 06:20 PM | #46 |
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ebay:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/H-Beam-Conn...gAAOSwLXNbwERO direct: https://www.maxpeedingrods.com/produ...0-20t--n26b20-(us-only).html Not trying to thread jack, but I literally have the same internals in hand too |
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11-24-2020, 09:11 PM | #47 | |
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sqwinny497.50 |
11-24-2020, 09:53 PM | #50 | |
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This isn't a boost issue, and in all honesty stock block can withstand 30psi with its current design (no the rods can't) adding sleeves allows you to run closer to 40psi of boost and associated cylinder pressure. Given the fact this motor is small displacement and only 4 cylinders to get a turbo to flow enough air to make 500-600 hp you'll be looking close to the 28psi range at 6000rpm anyways. |
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11-24-2020, 10:48 PM | #51 |
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Hey Navardi, I'm going to get the mambatek, I know in your build you said hat I could get like 380whp off of it right. Also can you put the link to your build so others can see it too
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11-25-2020, 03:30 AM | #52 | |
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Yeah, you can, But all Stage 2 N20 Turbo's you won't see over 380-400HP (dyno dependent for reference Dynojet would see around 360-380whp on 93 and close to 400whp on E85). if you want more HP you need a big external turbo setup. The stock Turbine housings even if you fit a larger turbine wheel, reach a Max VE around 5700-6000 RPM and physically limit the flow of the engine to around 38-40lbs a min. So if you are planning on twin charging, you will be limited in airflow, not to mention a stage 2 N20 turbo can spool to 22psi by 2300rpm, and hold 25PSI all the way to 7K rpm. However doesn't show to flow any more air past 25-24psi. So realistically twin Charging in your use case would only be beneficial if you had a big single scroll turbo on the motor and wanted to reduce turbo lag. |
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11-25-2020, 04:02 AM | #53 | |
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helix24716.50 |
11-26-2020, 02:03 PM | #54 |
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Thanks for the info. I've actually been running my car without the maf for 2 months. I plan on running the turbocharger and supercharger with their own air filters and then use a big intercooler with 2 inlets and 1 outlet. I just need the mambatek turbo for like around 350whp, and use the centrifugal supercharger for the other 350-400whp. I'm just working out the fuel system.
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11-27-2020, 04:21 PM | #55 |
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What's your plan for fueling Kel918 ? Trying to decide what to do. My power goals are a little different than yours but its something that I've been pondering about lately. Perhaps you can chime in navardi too.
All I can think of is LPFP + HPFP (tune calibrated) should do the trick, unless CPI/port injection is still required even with the HPFP upgraded as well. |
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11-27-2020, 11:28 PM | #57 | |
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11-27-2020, 11:36 PM | #58 |
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I don't think the block had to be notched with these rods. I think with the carillo rods they had to, I'll take more pictures of the block tomorrow. The cost for everything came out $1,712. That was just dropping of the block, pistons, rods and crank. This does include the melling liners, king bearings, installing liners, line hone, etc.. Also my crankshaft had to get worked on.
Last edited by Kel918; 11-27-2020 at 11:47 PM.. |
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11-28-2020, 12:19 AM | #59 | |
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Currently acquired/ordered: Rods 275 shipped Pistons 700 shipped Bare block upper and lower with oil squirters 300 local Crank 400 shipped New oem Hardware and gaskets 550 shipped LPFP stage 2.5 (walbro 530) 500 shipped Still have to buy/services to pay: Jet wash block 275 Micro polish crank Crankshaft bearings 200 Cylinder iron sleeves and/or css sleeves with supports and closing the deck 1275 + shipping to the shop. (Have to give John a call and see what this price all includes). Debating this or just balancing everything, sleeving, bone, notch cylinder wall, and machining locally 150 (typically it's around 20 +/- a cylinder) Balance internals 200 Balance flywheel and clutch package 250 New water pump with hardware and gaskets kit 430 shipped New updated timing chain kit 630 shipped HPFP (spool performance) 1500 shipped Up in the air turbo decision: spa exhaust manifold Used n20 turbo for core/exhaust manifold to modify and fit big turbo 350 shipped n55 upgraded n55 turbo on n20 exhaust manifold or n55 turbo on modded n55 manifold drilled to fit n20 block f30 n55 turbo inlet Custom tune BM3 Cary Jordan/navardi/bm3 tuner 650 (approx current rate or so) I have 6MT so add these to the list: Luk dual mass flywheel 550 shipped Stage 3 clutchmasters to hold 500 whp 800 shipped Still have remove old engine, put in new one with forged bottom end and replaced parts which means add 130-160 an hour for labour costs. I can only assume it's 10+ hours to do all that. I don't even want to total this up. But when is all said and done, anything was changed and it's a "new car" engine and powertrain wise. This doesn't include port injection or touching the head other than gaskets, checking for damage, and cleaning it. Some of it might seem excessive, but I want to rev to 7500 redline (bm3 allows for 7200 with e30 OTS and I want to shift the powerband to a higher range to tune the the car similar to an evo/srt4 which reduces instant low end tq and shock to the transmission) and don't want to push more than 27-28 pounds on the turbo for its efficiency.
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MY13: TTE400 Stage 2 turbo.
e80 tune by Navardi Tuned. 380 whp/360 wheel torque stock block Build Thread: https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1742413 IG + YT: Sqwin_n20 Last edited by sqwinny; 12-05-2020 at 05:44 PM.. |
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blumagic313.00 |
11-29-2020, 02:56 AM | #60 | |
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So if the turbo max's out at say 38lbs a min at 25PSI (which is around 60PSI of back pressure or greater on the Turbine Housing/Downpipe section of the exhaust. The Super Charger might add an additional say 10lbs/min of airflow, but given the Choke affect of the Turbine Housing the Turbo will then proceed to drop in efficiency thus lowering its airflow, negating any actual gain the super charger might add. Not to mention given the nature and size of the Turbine Housing A/R Max HP will always be around the 5700 - 6000 RPM range, wasting an extra 1200 RPM in the RPM cycle. Best Suggestion is maybe see if adding an external Gate into the Turbine housing before the manifold splits into the dual Volutes (for the twin scroll part of the housing) to help bleed off the additional airflow into the housing and help promote some VE and power in the top end. |
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11-29-2020, 03:00 AM | #61 | |
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11-29-2020, 03:03 AM | #62 | |
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If you rotate the block more than 270 degs and your block isn't notched properly you'll feel the rod hit the cylinder wall and prevent the crank from rotating further. My mates video actually shows the notching in it, Pretty sure its this video. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMXetr9coGk |
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11-29-2020, 03:08 AM | #63 | |
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I have linked the Forum post for the N55 turbo on a N20, however 2 of my mates here in Aus are currently fitting a N55 Stock and N55 Stage 2 turbo to their Forged N20's they are looking to either weld the N55 Turbine Housing to the N20 Stock manifold or just cut Cylinders 1 and 6 from the N55 Turbo manifold/Housing and then redrill the Mounting stud holes. (The N55 shares the same Bore spacing, Exhaust port spacing, Intake Port spacing, Intake Port dimensions, and exhaust port dimensions as the N20 (plus alot more in common with it)). https://f30.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1778526 Regarding Rev Limit stock hardware generally sees issues around 7600 rpm. I don't see that an issue with forged rods and pistons. The max the ecu will let you run is 8000 rpm due to a physical coding limit. Most of our valve train is shared with the n55/S55 however the exhaust valve springs are from a N54. The main thing to take away here is the hydraulic lifters used are identical to the S55. If you want to confirm this real oem shows you what on the n20 is shared with the N55, S55 and N54. It also means we can look to these motors to use their upgraded valve train. This information is also mentioned in the n20,n55 and s55 technical documentation. I am not sure however if you might run into valve float issues on the N20 earlier than you would see on the n55/s55 as cylinder pressures are higher since it has to cram high boost into 4 cylinders and not 6. Which also means to get the turbo combination to flow plenty of air you need to look at a range of 26-30 psi if you chose to bolt a n55 turbo to the N20 just to match the airflow it puts out on a n55 at alot lower boost. Unfortunately if you're too use either a stage 2 n20 or a turbo configuration based on a td04 format the exhaust housing effectively reduces the overall efficiency of boost and capable past 25-26psi. Which then reduces the maximum airflow those turbos usually make. In General terms, TD04 Based Turbos will struggle to pump out more than 36-41lbs a min of airflow in the high RPM range, and Due to the nature of the Small A/R ratios found in TD04 Based Turbos, overall VE is capped early on in the RPM band, and tends to be quite low due to the inefficiencies these turbos have on high RPM High HP setups. I wouldn't be worried about running 30psi on a built motor. Last edited by navardi; 11-29-2020 at 03:33 AM.. |
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11-29-2020, 11:24 AM | #64 | |||
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11-29-2020, 05:34 PM | #65 | |
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11-29-2020, 10:04 PM | #66 | |
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